Bug Thread: Discussion

[Edi]

Added new unit issues into the shortlist.

[Taqwus]

Unit 1016, 'Commander of Ulm', for Late Era Ulm -- description says "The commanders of Ulm are clad in thick armor made from the Blacksteel of Ulm...", forging of which has been forgotten (and the commander has an ordinary Plate Cuirass, not Blacksteel).

Unit 739, Black Acolyte, should probably have a slightly different description from Black Priests; they don't yet know any magic, nor do they yet get an inquisitor bonus.

[Edi]

Hadn't paid attention to the 1016 description. Thanks for reporting that.

The Black Acolyte is a known issue that I have discussed privately with Kristoffer when the Great Fixing was done prior to patch 3.10. It is very much a legacy of the conjoining of both Iron Faith and Black Forest themes from Dom2. It is among a number of issues that will be changed in the future if he gets around to doing that. If and when that happens, LA Ulm will have some thematic changes which will fix this.

You can see the same legacy issues in Ashen Empire Ermor mage descriptions when you compare EA, MA and LA Ermor. This is also a result of basically parallel histories forced into the same timeline and then divided into eras. These are issues that Kristoffer will solve in his own good time.

[Kristoffer O]

That post by Taqwus actually made me work on the Ulms today.

I'm home today. I believe someone in the building is sneaking around with a bane venom charm. I figured I could as well do something about Ulm. I'm quite satisfied with developments.

[Dedas]

Love and kisses from an Ulm fan.

[Edi]

Kristoffer O said:
That post by Taqwus actually made me work on the Ulms today.

I'm home today. I believe someone in the building is sneaking around with a bane venom charm. I figured I could as well do something about Ulm. I'm quite satisfied with developments.


Yeehaa! Ulm always has been my favorite nation in all eras and that is good news indeed! Thanks, Kristoffer! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Endoperez]

Edi said:
Yeehaa! Ulm always has been my favorite nation in all eras and that is good news indeed! Thanks, Kristoffer! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif



* MA Black Priests.
* Black Halberds.
* Iron Darts.

So spaketh the Progress Page, and the Progress Page hath spoken! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/eek.gif

[Taqwus]

...and Iron Blizzard? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/redface.gif

[Velusion]

Any MA or LA Ulm help would be great!

[Loren]

His pretender was called back to my province. On the first turn of battle he changed from dragon to human form. On the second turn he routed. He died on the retreat. I did *NOT* get the message about killing his pretender. This same battle has happened a few more times. If I kill him on the battlefield I get the message, if he retreats and dies I don't. (He's lost all his magic by now, I've got dominion 10 in the province and he's has this never healing wound affliction for quite a while--in theory he should have 0 hp but he always has a few.)

[paparapapa]

Not sure if this was supposed to be intentional: I had a few sauromancers die in a battle as LA C'tis while another commander was holding the Ankh. They became soulless with all the old mage paths, but now they can use the reanimate command.

I'm assuming the game just gives any undead commander with priest paths the reanimate command for LA C'tis. It's not game breaking or anything, but I figured I'd point it out.

[vfb]

The game gives any undead or demon commander with priest paths the reanimate command, by design. This applies to all nations.

You can summon a Black Servant and make him your prophet, for early access to undead troops. He will have the 'Reanimate' command available, instead of 'Preach'.

[lch]

Loren said:
His pretender was called back to my province. On the first turn of battle he changed from dragon to human form. On the second turn he routed. He died on the retreat. I did *NOT* get the message about killing his pretender.


You never get a message about units killed while retreating. Only the controlling player gets a message stating that "XY died retreating from the battlefield". If he has diminished magical powers the next time that he appears, everything is in order.

[Loren]

lch said:

Loren said:
His pretender was called back to my province. On the first turn of battle he changed from dragon to human form. On the second turn he routed. He died on the retreat. I did *NOT* get the message about killing his pretender.


You never get a message about units killed while retreating. Only the controlling player gets a message stating that "XY died retreating from the battlefield". If he has diminished magical powers the next time that he appears, everything is in order.



No--I'm saying I didn't get the message about them being mad about my killing their god. The message you get anytime you kill a pretender, even in the arena.

[Endoperez]

Loren said:
No--I'm saying I didn't get the message about them being mad about my killing their god. The message you get anytime you kill a pretender, even in the arena.



As far as the game is considered, I don't think you did. You routed the pretender, who happened to die, but because one of your units didn't deal the killing blow the AI doesn't know it was you. Because either it attacked you or you it, you're in war any way, so I doubt it matters much.

[Endoperez]

/threads/images/Graemlins/Bug.gif If a weapon has multiple attacks, and the unit using the weapon has been blessed via Fire 9, the weapon deals damage only once. :bug

Thus, if your Jotun Herse goes against a fire-immune unit with his Sword of Swiftness, he will only deal 9+str damage once, instead of twice.

[ano]

I mentioned a very serious bug somewhere above, but it seems that it was left untouched. You can cast twiceborn on a demon (not sure about undeads) and it not only works perfectly (despite it shouldn't), but the demon returns in his original shape (tested with Raksharajas add Hannyas) and still has twiceborn in effect. Thus you buy an immortal for 10 death gems.

[lch]

Loren said:
No--I'm saying I didn't get the message about them being mad about my killing their god. The message you get anytime you kill a pretender, even in the arena.


They're shameful that their god ran away, so they stay quiet. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Dedas]

Jotunheim
When the Vaette on the wolf dies the wolf you get always has old age.

[Edi]

That's an age discrepancy issue. The vaetti starts with age 22/50 and wolf has something like 3/12 or 15/30 at best. So when the Vaetti becoems a wolf, its old age lowers, but the actual age of the unit stays the same as the vaetti had because it's tied to the unique id number of that particular unit and not the monster type.

I suppose it would be fixed by having the Dominions world wolves be extra long-lived and having them be something like 3/30 or 3/50 and Vaetti age staying the same.

[Edi]

Shortlist reorganized and updated to reflect changelog. New entries based on this thread not added yet, but coming next week.

[ano]

If machakan spider rider gets poisoned and dies, remaining poison will still affect spider who is poison immune.

[atul]

I don't remember seeing this in here, but.

If nation A is being sieged by B in a province with a fort, nation C's scouts (etc) can be set to 'Defend' in said province with either hotkey command or by canceling some previous order. Usually, if you set your sneaking commander to 'Defend', it attacks the province it is in. But if the province is a sieged castle, then it won't.

However, should B storm the fort and win, nation C's defending scouts end up sieging the fort with B's stormers inside. Same happens if sieged gets a barbarian/knight attack in the province, because it would appear indies default to 'Defend', and don't appear until the siege is resolved.

I'd think the logical behaviour would be that the third-party 'Defenders' would attack the sieging force, instead of defaulting to some sort of sneaky defence.

[Edi]

Atul, that seems to be a special case of the how third party units (whether indies or other nations) are handled in sieges and is already listed. There is a whole slew of siege related behavior and movement bugs in the shortlist.

[Edi]

<font color="red">U 1856 Hydra</font> Wrong secondshape. Unit should have secondshape 1850 instead of 1856. Form 1856 is one of the intermediate forms of the Pythium SC sacred hydras, but it does not revert back to its base form due to wrong secondshape. All other hydra secondshapes seem to be okay.

[lch]

I've had it a couple of times that I can't see the results of an (Earth Attack) assassination attempt. The casting is successful, there's a battle, but I can't see the battle. Clicking on the crossed swords icon doesn't switch to battle mode. Any ideas why this is? Or is this a bug?

[Zeldor]

Doesn't it need a scout in that province for battle report?

[lch]

I don't think so. And anyway, I can see other assassination reports from the same province, just some I can't see. Or do the assassinations have to be successful without scouts?

[Loren]

Slaves are stored as a signed 16-bit integer.

(SP game, Large map, one AI left who actually holds most of the map. I'm up against the commander limit and there's not much to do with the slaves so they have been building up.)

[NTJedi]

Loren said:
... AI left who actually holds most of the map. I'm up against the commander limit and there's not much to do ...



Yes I also have games which encountered the commander limit on maps without ERMOR or Ry'leh of only 700 provinces.


lch said:
I've had it a couple of times that I can't see the results of an (Earth Attack) assassination attempt. The casting is successful, there's a battle, but I can't see the battle. Clicking on the crossed swords icon doesn't switch to battle mode. Any ideas why this is? Or is this a bug?


The game has a commander limit and empty assassination spells(not working) are one of the many side-effects.
Ideally the best solution would be providing a game setting where the commander limit and unit limit could be increased as desired thus more powerful computers don't have to suffer these limitations. Considering computers are constantly becoming more and more powerful these limitations should be scalable.
* Even a moddable commander limit and unit limit would be nice, allowing the game to be scalable with todays faster computers.

[capnq]

lch said: I've had it a couple of times that I can't see the results of an (Earth Attack) assassination attempt. The casting is successful, there's a battle, but I can't see the battle. Clicking on the crossed swords icon doesn't switch to battle mode. Any ideas why this is? Or is this a bug?

I didn't know the Messages icons were hotlinks? I've always used the "View Battle" text link.

[lch]

NTJedi said:

lch said:
I've had it a couple of times that I can't see the results of an (Earth Attack) assassination attempt. The casting is successful, there's a battle, but I can't see the battle. Clicking on the crossed swords icon doesn't switch to battle mode. Any ideas why this is? Or is this a bug?


The game has a commander limit and empty assassination spells(not working) are one of the many side-effects.


I don't think this is a commander limitation as we'll hardly have touched that in this game. And I guess the logs would show that the assassinations have actually taken place.


capnq said:
I didn't know the Messages icons were hotlinks? I've always used the "View Battle" text link.


Err, yes, that's what I meant. I was writing from memory.

[Loren]

NTJedi said:

Loren said:
... AI left who actually holds most of the map. I'm up against the commander limit and there's not much to do ...



Yes I also have games which encountered the commander limit on maps without ERMOR or Ry'leh of only 700 provinces.



Yeah, I'm EA Oceania and breaking onto the land was hard as the one AI nation pretty much controlled it by the time I had cleaned out some pesky opposition underwater. Thus I did some pretty heavy clamming and it's one commander per clam.

Is there any way to make a mod item? I'm thinking of a superclam with 10x the cost that makes 10 pearls/turn.

[Maraxus]

Just a typo:

Random event:

Heavy snowfalls has blocked important mountain roads.

[Edi]

Most event typos are known. Since they are in different files than the unit descriptions, they were not affected by the Great Fixing. Though I wish I could have gotten my hands on them. That was one of them...

[Sombre]

It says in the mod manual that nametypes are available up to 159 now, but in fact if you use any nametype 151+ the game will crash when you use or click on a unit that has that nametype.

So 150 is ok, but afaik 151, 152, 153 etc all the way up don't work.

[NTJedi]

Sombre said:
It says in the mod manual that nametypes are available up to 159 now, but in fact if you use any nametype 151+ the game will crash when you use or click on a unit that has that nametype.

So 150 is ok, but afaik 151, 152, 153 etc all the way up don't work.



The Mod Manual and MapEdit Manual will hopefully updated in one of the future patches.

[ologm]

The bakemono(monster number 1963) scout lists its stealth value as +-25.

[ano]

Tartarian chains (item number 98). Description says (last sentence): "Anyone wjo wields these chains...". Should be "Anyone WHO wields these chains..."

[Edi]

Noted. Thanks.

ologm, that's already fixed for next patch.

[Lingchih]

What about this bug, Edi. Do you know if anyone is looking into it?

"The most annoying bug in the game is the so-called "syncinfo" bug, where playing a tcp-ip network game, when you try to connect to the server, you just get a "Waiting for info" screen. You have to start the game in windowed mode, and then keep launching more windows until you finally get one that gets past the bug. I hate it, and I wish someone would fix it."

[Endoperez]

/threads/images/Graemlins/Bug.gif If Gift of Reason is cast twice on the same province on the same turn, and both spells target the same type of unit, only one of the units is made commander. I think GoR targets the lowest ID of a spesific type it finds when the command is issued, instead of checking for it when the spell is resolved.

The above causes all kinds of weird things. As an example, a unit that is teleporting somewhere via Astral Travel can move there first, and then become a commander, if GoR is completed after Astral Travel. It'd be nice if there were error messages for GoR (e.g. no units of the spesified type could be found in the province).

[Edi]

Lingchih said:
What about this bug, Edi. Do you know if anyone is looking into it?

"The most annoying bug in the game is the so-called "syncinfo" bug, where playing a tcp-ip network game, when you try to connect to the server, you just get a "Waiting for info" screen. You have to start the game in windowed mode, and then keep launching more windows until you finally get one that gets past the bug. I hate it, and I wish someone would fix it."


Not familiar with that one, because I know almost nothing about the client-server interaction side of Dominions. I'll ask Johan about this.

Endo, noted. I noticed the same thing about trying to GoR more than one unit of the same type, doesn't work. I'll add that. GoR seems to need the kind of checks you talk about and an incrementing counter like the site search spells do.

[lch]

Edi said:
Not familiar with that one, because I know almost nothing about the client-server interaction side of Dominions. I'll ask Johan about this.


It might not be game-related but OS-related, not sure. I don't recall that any of my games ran into that problem, ever. But I am resetting timers once in a while, too.


Edi said:
Endo, noted. I noticed the same thing about trying to GoR more than one unit of the same type, doesn't work. I'll add that. GoR seems to need the kind of checks you talk about and an incrementing counter like the site search spells do.


I was experiencing this GoR oddity a lot of patches ago, too, when I started playing. I just considered it a design oddity that I'd have to live with. In a recent game I did successfully GoR two Tartarian cyclops of the same type in the same province. So it might be a little more complicated.

[llamabeast]

I just GORed two gargoyles in the same turn. But for some reason they showed up a separate choices in the list of unit types. I didn't understand that.

[Edi]

Damn, so they do. It can get pretty damned confusing fast.

[lch]

Oh yes, you obviously need to select different groups in the GoR screen. Not the same unit twice, even if there are more than one of that type in that group.

[Edi]

No, what he means is that all the units appear separately in the GoR list, so picking up the right ones from it can be difficult and can lead to confusion. Needs a bit more testing, that one does.

[lch]

No, multiple units in groups don't appear twice. Otherwise you'd have thousands of units in there. But I don't know the real mechanics behind the GoR list, this would really require some testing.

[Edi]

Too late in the night, so maybe my memory is shot. Could be I'm remembering the time of Dominions - PPP when every single unit did show up separately in the list and it was long as all hell.

[Loren]

lch said:
No, multiple units in groups don't appear twice. Otherwise you'd have thousands of units in there. But I don't know the real mechanics behind the GoR list, this would really require some testing.



Something certainly does happen. I've had the same unit type show up in several groups when casting GoR.

It's only happened to me when I was summoning more than one unit type in the province and only while the units were still sitting in the pool, not assigned to any commander. I have no idea on recruitment, I've never tried to GoR a recruitable.

[Twan]

My ennemy had a wraithlord in a province in his dominion. I enslaved him in battle and he was then killed in this fight. He respawned for me in the province (not my capitol), and not as an enslaved unit but as a commander (with magic) and even if the province is still out of my dominion (he also kept his summon allies order, so I got a ghost with him).

Cool isn't it ?

[llamabeast]

Here's a screenshot of the Gift of Reason thing. I have to say it doesn't really bother me, but it definitely does happen.

[ano]

After attack of Thing of Many Eyes (monster 758) with weapon Weakness (294) affected unit has strength modifier +-2.
See screenshot

[ano]

Again that annoying slot shifting bug...
My thug lost an arm (with a sword) last turn and this turn he's got it back. Yes, he's got a new hand, but all the items were gone except a misc and a shield.
That is really VERY annoying.

I can send a turn file if necessary.

[Edi]

Please do. The address is info at illwinter dot com.

[ano]

Done. Notify me if anything else is needed.

[Edi]

Don't know if there is. The turn file from the previous turn would also be great, because then it could be observed happening. The thing is, despite my name showing in black and having those fancy wings next to it, I don't actually work at Illwinter, so it's up to Johan now to see if anything turns up. Thanks for this.

That bug has been around for a long time, but it's infrequent enough that it's very hard to get material where it could be pinned down. Best case would be if you run into it again, when item slots are lost, save a turn file then. Especially if two-handed weapons are involved, because that leads to strange situations.

[ano]

I sent two turn files - from current and previous turn. Can't give the game file, 'cause it's MP game and I just don't have it.
Some pages before I posted a similar bug: a dryad lost her helmet after getting her hand back (there was a turn attachment there).

It's seems to me that bug is reproducible when a unit loses hand and then gets it back again.

[Edi]

I know. The bug's in the shortlist under the item slots category.

[Edi]

Taqwus said:
Unit 1016, 'Commander of Ulm', for Late Era Ulm -- description says "The commanders of Ulm are clad in thick armor made from the Blacksteel of Ulm...", forging of which has been forgotten (and the commander has an ordinary Plate Cuirass, not Blacksteel).

Unit 739, Black Acolyte, should probably have a slightly different description from Black Priests; they don't yet know any magic, nor do they yet get an inquisitor bonus.


The 1016 description bug has been fixed. The description was correct but there was an error in the description file which caused it not to display and the unit defaulted to the MA commander description.

The Black Acolyte has had his description reworked.

Bogarus typos fixed.

[Bananadine]

/threads/images/Graemlins/Bug.gifMy pretender had been told to cast various spells in a battle, including Call Horror and Personal Luck. For some reason, when he cast Personal Luck, the spell-message display also said he was casting Call Horror in the same battle round. But no blood slaves were consumed and no horror appeared.

The Personal Luck casting appears to have succeeded. It may be relevant that the caster was a communion master at the time.

I saved the .trn file and will send it to info at illwinter dot com in a moment.

[Argitoth]

/threads/images/Graemlins/Bug.gifJotun Skratti chanes to wolf after battle if before battle the change shape order is given (intending to change to werewolf) thus losing all items except misc.

[Edi]

Those two aren't going to make it to patch 3.16, so they will have to go to the next one. I'll keep them in mind, though.

[Natpy]

Why fire shield effect from Charcoal Shield works underwater? Is this a bug?

[NTJedi]

/threads/images/Graemlins/Bug.gif

I found a new bug with twiceborn and demons. If demons have twiceborn then once killed the demons will return to the capital in their original form. Essentially giving them a type of immortality in friendly dominion because the twiceborn remains on them as well.

This is quite useful for nations which have demon commanders with death magic such as Lanka.

[Natpy]

Twiceborn on demons is realy gamebroken bug playing against Lanka or Yomi

[ano]

NTJedi said:

/threads/images/Graemlins/Bug.gif
I found a new bug with twiceborn and demons. If demons have twiceborn then once killed the demons will return to the capital in their original form. Essentially giving them a type of immortality in friendly dominion because the twiceborn remains on them as well.

This is quite useful for nations which have demon commanders with death magic such as Lanka.


I posted this bug twice somewhere above. Raksharjas with twiceborn are unstoppable, believe me)

[NTJedi]

ano said:

NTJedi said:

/threads/images/Graemlins/Bug.gif
I found a new bug with twiceborn and demons. If demons have twiceborn then once killed the demons will return to the capital in their original form. Essentially giving them a type of immortality in friendly dominion because the twiceborn remains on them as well.

This is quite useful for nations which have demon commanders with death magic such as Lanka.


I posted this bug twice somewhere above. Raksharjas with twiceborn are unstoppable, believe me)



You've posted the bug twice in different threads, but never posted the bug within the bug forum.

[Natpy]

NTJedi, just read the replyes #581441 and #578417

[Edi]

Twiceborn demons added to the shortlist spell section.

[ano]

When you cast Carrion reanimation with Lanka, only soulless Vanaras are raised. Not sure that it is a bug but I can't see the reason why they don't get all the kinds of the undead monkeys with this spell like with reanimating.
I think, this also applies to other non-human nations with specific undead troops.
Upd: one more issue with Carrion reanimation. Soulless commander has undead leadership 40 but this spell revives 100 undeads. So, if you move someone from the squad, you won't be able to put him back.

And one more thing... Spell "life after death" creates soulless from normal units that die in combat, but after combat those soulless stay in the same squad even if commander has no undead leadership.

[Edi]

Reanimation lists are nation specific, so the behavior of carrion reanimation is not a bug per se, but WAD. I suppose the lists could be tweaked, but I don't know for certain. It would depend on how the spell is tied to the reanimation lists and whether it can handle nonstandard reanimation lists the same as the default one.

The behavior of soulless commander is also WAD. Spells that summon units in that manner allow leadership capacity to be exceeded initially, but after that situation is altered, the game forces standard behavior. This is why you can't move the units back.

The behavior of Life After Death is, from what I can see, WAD. Units are assigned to squads on the basis of their individual unit identifier (the invisible one that keeps track of magic, afflictions etc). When they turn to soulless due to Life After Death, the monster ID changes to soulless, but the unique identifier stays the same. Therefore they must stay in the same squad or problems will start to occur. The alternative would be dropping them. After they are removed from the squad (i.e. unassigned), normal leadership rules start to apply.

[ryo_akashi]

For LA Argatha

Cave Lord (1451) will #secondtmpshape to Cave Drake (522). Meaning that, the Cave Lord will change to a Cave Drake upon suffering fatal wound. The Cave Drake will be removed at the end of combat and count as casualty.


Cave Knight (1450) will #secondshape to Cave Drake (522). The Cave Knight will change to a Cave Drake upon suffering fatal wound. However, the Cave Drake will be remain AFTER the end of combat.

Considering difference of behaviour of the two units, is this intended by the designer?

Also, is it intended that all the spider riders in Machaka uses #secondshape to either Great Spider (884) or Hunter Spider(886)? Considering that there are the spiders have no upkeep cost and huge hp, this encourages ppl to suicide spider riders into spiders...

[zzcat]

C'tis's description in all three ages said they prefer Heat+1, but actually they prefer heat+2 in game.

[Edi]

Thanks for both of these.

The spider rider and black hunter secondshape thing is an oversight. The spider forms are the correct ones, but obviously they need to have gold cost added. I'll add that to the shortlist.

The cave drake thing I need to ask about, but if it works one way for Agartha, it should probably work the same way for Machaka and the Hunter Lords.

The C'tis Heat scale thing is an error. The descriptions were largely brought from Dominions 2 where C'tis did prefer Heat 1, but apparently it has been changed for Dom3 and the old description has been left. I'll add that.

[vfb]

Are you sure it's not intentional? What are spiders going to want a salary for? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif Riderless Cave Drakes don't require gold upkeep either.

The riderless spiders have an MR of 5, I think. So it's not all good news when the rider dies. In fact, it's pretty terrible news if you're up against any MR-type magic or missiles.

[Edi]

True. I need to ask about it. IF the cave drakes are changed, anew monster is needed, because 522 is also the one that comes from the summoning spell.

[Endoperez]

ryo_akashi said:
Considering difference of behaviour of the two units, is this intended by the designer?



Cave Captain's drake would be a commander. While Cave Drake patrol dropping from the sky with the help of Magic Carpet is a cool idea and worked pretty well for the guy who did it (I think it was in DomII and with Gift of Reason), it's still silly.

[ryo_akashi]

Just to clarify, the main question is...

Are the following units using #secondshape as intended?

Spider Rider (885)
Spider Knight (886)
Spider Lord (887)
Black Hunter (889)
Hunter Lord (890)
Cave Knight (1450)

It would be a moot point to change the upkeep cost for the spiders and cave drake if the above units are using #secondtmpshape. Most of the other rider/monster units (War Lobster (211), Gryphon Rider (612), Serpent Cataphract (764), Chariot Archer (1079), Tiger Rider (1140), Androphag (1176)) use #secondtmpshape. I would not be surprised if the #secondshape was unintended.

But hey, it could always be a feature for Mach and LA Arg... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[thejeff]

It's been a feature of Machaka since Dom2. I think it would significantly weaken Machaka not to keep their spiders after the rider's death. And I don't think they've ever been accused of being overpowered.

I'll grant having a Hunter spider leading troops is a bit weird. Having one as my prophet was even weirder.

[Edi]

Cleaned up the bug shortlist and added statfix issues for MA &amp; LA Ulm priests and LA Abysian slayers.

Added also Vampire Queen cost issue as a red entry.

[ryo_akashi]

Misbred (1661) has serious age issues...

The recruited Misbreds' age spread from ~130(250) to ~400(250). You can observe this in the Recruit Unit screen. Bring up the Misbred unit details, check the unit age, close the unit detail screen and reopen the unit detail screen again. The age will vary every time.

[ryo_akashi]

For completeness, the following nations do not state their temperature preference in the descriptions.

EA Ulm +1cold
EA Lanka +2heat
EA Kailasa +2heat
MA Bandar Log +2heat
LA Patala +2heat
LA Atlantis +2cold
LA Bogarus +2cold

[Edi]

Misbred is WAD. Thanks for the heat/cold listing.

[Edi]

All statfix issues for new units appearing in version 3.15 added. Blacksteel Full Plate entry for armor added. Revisited some old units for MA Ulm due to possible hit point discrepancy.

<font color="red">U 862 Vampire Queen</font> Cost should be reduced from 175 to somewhere around 100. VQ has been nerfed since Dom2 and at current prices it is not a viable pretender even for SP games.
U 1964 Slayer Newt mapmove 1 should be 2
U 1965 Slayer Worm Base AP 12 should be 11 (Abysian base)
U 1970 Longdead Giant Leadership should be normal 10, undead 10 (or 40) instead of normal 40, undead 10
U 1977 Fossilized Giant Leadership should be normal 10, undead 10 (or 40) instead of normal 40, undead 10. Hit points should be more than 17?
U 1978 Dust Priest Should have base undead leadership 40, not 10.
U 1973 Black Priest should have weapon 14 Maul to match graphic, not weapon 13 Hammer
U 740 Black Priest should have weapon 14 Maul to match graphic, not weapon 13 Hammer
U 1982 Priest Smith Age should be increased. MR only 9, should be more? Hit points 10, should be 12 like Black Priests?
U 325 Master Smith Hit points 10, should be 12 like Black Priests?
U 748 Siege Engineer Hit points 10, should be 12 like Black Priests? Almost all Ulm commanders have more than 10 hit points.

ARMOR
A 38 Black Steel Full Plate Has not been updated with the plate armor change. Should be -3 defense, not -4. Encumbrance should be 4, not 5

[Lingchih]

Thanks Edi. Your dedication to this game is remarkable. And, you hardly ever play in the MP games.

[Edi]

Thanks. With all the effort I've spent on the DB and other stuff, I've hardly had time to play MP games. Maybe I'll sign up for some newbie game or another sometime, because where MP is concerned, that's what I am, a newbie. Probably after midsummer.

Right now this stuff is something I have enough time for since the jump from 3.10 to 3.14 and then to 3.15 right afterward was much smaller than the jump from 3.08 to 3.10. They don't call 3.10 a megapatch for nothing...

[EricM]

Regressions in the nation data files:

ver 3.10
EA Oceania
Providence defense above PD 20 - no longer includes Mermen

ver 3.15
LA Abyssia
Data Corruption with the fort defense weapons? Please check the data files for errors with this.

[Edi]

Can you elaborate on that a bit? The Oceania PD is pretty self-explanatory, but the fort defense weapon draws a complete blank for me. I've never heard of that kind of problem.

However, it may be related to some fort bugs. What kind of fort was in question? Citadel and Ermorian Citadel both have broken graphics and a screwed up battlefield, so that could cause problems. A detailed description would be great, otherwise there's a risk that I'll get the problem wrong and it won't be fixed. If you could send a savegame where that problem occurs to info at illwinter dot com (be sure to include all active mods, if any), that would be even better.

[Edi]

Fixed locmask issues updated to the shortlist.

[fantasma]

A while ago (3.10, I think) it happened that I built a fortress the same time I discovered a magic site that gives a fortress (I think Kelp fortress). That was as EA Oceania, sea province.
This resulted in no fortress and until the usual time was spent to construct it. I'm not sure of what the intended behaviour should be. It seems strange that a site you discover loses its effect.

I haven't had registered then to post it immediately. Since this is a pretty rare coincidence, I'm not sure if this is a known issue.

[Edi]

It's not a known issue, thanks for reporting it.

I suppose one way to test this kind of mechanics would be to cast a spell like Three Red Seconds or Wizard's Tower on a province where a commander is building a fort. It's not exactly the same thing, but it's similar.

[Agrajag]

Or just put one of those sites in a map and test from that.

[Edi]

Why didn't I think of that? That's what I get for posting at 1 am after tinkering with the DB all day, not thinking straight anymore...

[Sombre]

Spells/Behaviour: Legions of Steel the spell is still being cast on units with no armour. In fact it seems to happen more often now than before, with no armour casters basically casting it on themselves rather than nearby troops.

[Kristoffer O]

Strange. Might be a negative number or something. IIRC I made it less likely to be cast on casters. A negative would increase the chance instead.

[vfb]

Sometimes armies refuse to move when they are given orders to do so. No events or battles or rituals affected the province when the bug occurred.

Here is a thread where this bug is being discussed:

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/showflat.php?Number=586100

Other threads have also mentioned this problem.

I have sent my .trn and .2h files to the developers.

[ano]

Found a nice bug recently.
If you order a mage to forge something and then give him a slave collar, he will still do his task. I understand this can be explained with "he forged that item before becoming feebleminded" but feeblemind is instantaneous and forging is not.

[lch]

ano said:
Found a nice bug recently.
If you order a mage to forge something and then give him a slave collar, he will still do his task. I understand this can be explained with "he forged that item before becoming feebleminded" but feeblemind is instantaneous and forging is not.


The game carries out orders given in the previous turn regardless of what happened, as long as that unit is still alive in the next turn. Removing an item from a unit usually resets their orders, especially if it has to do with casting or forging. Other orders (like research) might not reset that fast. But giving an item to a unit doesn't change the orders given at all.

[ano]

I know all that. But it is a bug. Probably, orders should be reset if the given item causes afflictions

[ryo_akashi]

Spider Armor (A 111) is plate armor used by Machaka. It is not updated by the plate armor change. Currently -5 def +5 enc.

Sun Armor (A 95) does seem like plate armor that should be updated too.. Currently -5 def +5 enc.

[ano]

I just thought, why losing of an eye causes stats reduction of a soulless and losing a head just disallows wearing helmets...
See attachment.

Or maybe he just cannot lose a head without losing both eyes?

[Edi]

Ryo, thanks for the reminder about Spider Armor and Sun Armor

[NTJedi]

/threads/images/Graemlins/Bug.gif

Hero - 'Master of the Games'

Description reads this individual is old, yet upon arrival his age is in the early 20s... making him just a young whipper snapper. This hero isn't very good compared to other heroes so perhaps increased skills, ambidextrious, reinvigoration, experience bonus(like Orion yet not as high), etc., .

My brother found this bug.

[Edi]

Just noticed that the new item modding commands introduced in patch 3.14 did not make it into the modding manual.

[Edi]

Holy crap...

No, no new bugs to report, I just realized that it's been a year and couple of weeks since I was put in charge of the bug lists. The Shortlist thread had its one-year anniversary on March 1st. Sure doesn't feel like it was that long on one count and on another it's as if I had been doing this a lot longer.

Where DOES the time go?

[AStott]

UI: neighbor indicator scaling bug

If you are playing in a window and resize the window so that the size is a non-4:3 ratio, then the neighbor lines do not properly point to the center of the neighbor province. In cases where the line is particularly long, this can make it extremely difficult to tell where the link leads.

[ComTrav]

The Marveni "Champion of the Horn" pretender is available as a pretender choice for EA Abysia, which doesn't make any sense to me.

[Edi]

ComTrav said:
The Marveni "Champion of the Horn" pretender is available as a pretender choice for EA Abysia, which doesn't make any sense to me.


There is no such unit in the unmodded game. You're using the Worthy Heroes mod where that unit appears and since it has pretender characteristics due to being a copystatted mother of lions, it appears in the list. Not a bug.

[ComTrav]

Oh, and it was really, really funny for me to make him the Pretender God of the Abysians.

[fantasma]

Sorry if it got reported already.

I got the patrol message where many unruly subjects still need to be eliminated although unrest was at 0.
I have the .trn file if you need it.

[Saulot]

I'm not sure if this has come up before or not, and if it hasn't it's certainly odd (I did search the shortlist, and the forum at large).

Anyway, the Staff of Elemental Mastery (the Air/Earth one) has the wrong description in game (though the manual is correct), where it mentions two forms of resistance, and does not mention the stoneskin.

[Zeldor]

Treelord with Flying Ship cannot move between provinces, even though he gets mapmove 1.

[Endoperez]

Zeldor said:
Treelord with Flying Ship cannot move between provinces, even though he gets mapmove 1.



Immobile creatures can't move. Giving them flying items gives them +1 mapmove (usually to mapmove 1), but they still can't move. Treelords, Oracles, Sphinx... anything and everything immobile.

[Zeldor]

Well, then mapmove still should show 0. Bug anyway http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Edi]

Saulot said:
I'm not sure if this has come up before or not, and if it hasn't it's certainly odd (I did search the shortlist, and the forum at large).

Anyway, the Staff of Elemental Mastery (the Air/Earth one) has the wrong description in game (though the manual is correct), where it mentions two forms of resistance, and does not mention the stoneskin.


WAD, as far as I know. Both elemental staffs use the same description and stoneskin is a resistance of a sort, since it gives resistance to damage (armor).

[Edi]

feeble_dom_3 wrote

Bless Weapons
Earth 9 Protection does not seem to work

I was playing marignon with a pretender with earth 9. Simple test, create a high inquisitor, Knight of the Chalice, and a flagellant on turn 1, attack a province with them on turn 2 with the order to divine bless. Bless occurs, but protection value does not seem to change. Am I missing something?


Who doesn't get protection and where? Earth bless only affects armored units, which is indicated in the FAQ.

[Edi]

And here's the answer Shovah32 posted:

Shovah32 wrote:
Knight of the chalice wont get +4, but he will get a bonus. Any unarmoured units wont get a protection boost at all.

[Edi]

The above two posts quote two posts that were deleted from the shortlist thread. Looks like I had accidentally left it open.

Everyone (except Illwinter): DO NOT POST IN THE SHORTLIST THREAD EVEN IF IT HAS BEEN ACCIDENTALLY LEFT OPEN. EVER.

[feeble_dom_3]

Edi said:
And here's the answer Shovah32 posted:

Shovah32 wrote:
Knight of the chalice wont get +4, but he will get a bonus. Any unarmoured units wont get a protection boost at all.





Thanks to you (and the previous poster). When I open the Knight's Protection detail (pause the battle, select a Knight, select Protection heading) I do not see any addition. Should I?

[Edi]

Yes. Check an unblessed knight's protection. After one has been blessed, check that the candles on the sacred marker are burning, then check the protection detail and you should see both head and body protection values increased by 4. Note that only Divone Blessing hits all units on the battlefield simultaneously. Lesser blessings may miss sacred units if they do not hit that square.

[feeble_dom_3]

Thanks, I see my confusion now. I expected a marker indicating that the additional protection came from bless. I did not look soon enough. Indeed, a Knight of the chalice gets +4 protection, and a flagellant does not (because he has no armor).

[EricM]

EricM said:
Regressions in the nation data files:

ver 3.15
LA Abyssia
Data Corruption with the fort defense weapons? Please check the data files for errors with this.



Sorry for the vagueness.

LA Abyssia previously had Ballista x 2 for each fort when attacked after a sieging enemy breaks down the walls. The data files have become corrupt and it now has some some strange sprite x 206, that get fired at the enemy each turn.

[EricM]

EricM said:
Regressions in the nation data files:

ver 3.10
EA Oceania
Providence defense above PD 20 - no longer includes Mermen




This regression is in 3.15. I'm just quoting this as I noticed it wasn't in the shortlist.

[Edi]

Added the Abysia fort defense and Oceania PD to shortlist. Also added Sun Armor and Spider Armor and Black Plate Infantry helmet issue based on the discussion of MA Ulm in the Halt Heretic thread.

[Zeldor]

Hmm... shouldn't Maelstrom be possible to cast under water only?

[Edi]

Added heat scale description errors to the shortlist. If I get to proofread the new stuff for the next patch, they'll be fixed at that time.

[Micah]

I just noticed that some poor amphibian units I have have +3 encumberance underwater, as opposed to the ability description which specifies only 1.

Friendly currents also seemingly has no effect on enc values as stated in the spell description, although the movement effects do work properly.

I skimmed the shortlist and didn't see anything, sorry if this is a repost.

[ryo_akashi]

The following is still missing from the heat scale description error.

"C'tis's description in all three ages said they prefer Heat+1, but actually they prefer heat+2 in game."

[Kamamura]

I have persistent lockups when entering the "Create pretender tool". I can play the game okay otherwise.

[NTJedi]

Kamamura said:
I have persistent lockups when entering the "Create pretender tool". I can play the game okay otherwise.



You are the only one having this problem... it's either a mod or an issue specific with your system.

[Rathar]

I just grabbed a bug in Priori, a MP game that Velusion is hosting atm.

I had the good fortune to have the "Scholar finds such and such etc" gain 1000gp and a magic item occur twice in the same turn. It happened in two separate provinces. I only received the gold for one of them but I did receive the items for both.

I have or think I have noticed a rare but seemingly greater than normal tendency for the same event to occur twice in a row, more than would seem reasonable but RNG's are what they are and..

I shall attempt to bring this to Velusions notice and get you a copy.

[Edi]

Micah, not a repost. Thanks.
Ryo, C'tis added as part of a general overview of the shortlist based on discussion with KO
Rathar, that's a new one. I'll see about adding it and the encumbrance issue later.

[Kamamura]

Well, maybe there is someone else, it might be driver/graphics specific. I recently bought GeForce 8800GT, using driver 169.21 under Windows. Strange thing is that it happens also under Fedora Linux I have on the same system. On a different HW (Pentium 4 on 2,80Ghz) and FreeBSD (Linuxbase), I can play just fine. Can anyone with Geforce 8800GT confirm or refute?

[chrispedersen]

My heat index went from +3 to 0 in my capitol in one turn.
It is gradually creeping up in adjoining territories, currently.

[Zeldor]

No wolven winter cast on you?

[chrispedersen]

No. Heat scale was gone first time I thought to look for it.. maybe turn 2-3.. with no random events and no cold units or pretenders.

[hnchrist3]

With the introduction of 3.14 (and continuing into 3.15), the Conjuration-9 spell "Ghost Riders" is broken. It either does not work, or it sends a few riders without a commander.

I have confirmed this and have more information.
If the province is empty, nothing happens at all.

If there are enemies present, it seems that 3 Longdead Horsemen appear, alone and weary.

In the "empty" province I had both a human scout and a Black Servant.

In the provice full of Devils, I only had a human servant.

On the turn summary, it shows that the spell was cast, but there is no other entry regarding it.

[Edi]

If Ghost Riders behaves like that consistently with everyone, then it belongs in the list. Can anyone else confirm this behavior?

One question I would ask is how big a game is it that you're playing? Because that sort of behavior would start happening if the game had reached the unit limit and/or the commander limit. There are only so many units that can be on a map all at once and only so many commanders. Once those limits are reached, new units or commanders can no longer be recruited and can no longer appear from spells such as Earth Attack, summons or Ghost Riders.

[lch]

I am making heavy use of Ghost Riders in a game of mine and the spell works fine, like it always has. 3.14 and now 3.15.

[thejeff]

I'm going to resurrect the complaint about Astral Shield overriding scripts for powerful Astral mages, mostly because a) it happened to me, and b) I ran debug and got some data.

E3S6D2N2 pretender scripted to start with Summon Earthpower.
Casts Astral shield instead.

Here's the relevant debug info:
com Sigbert cast spell (favspell Summon Earthpower) (mayusegems 1)
est. choices 80
&lt;snip&gt;
spellscore, Summon Earthpower score 265 (boost 110 scorat 0)
Eval: Summon Earthpower score 265 (fat 10)
comp_castspell: eval Summon Earthpower result 265
best spell so far Summon Earthpower (score100265)
&lt;snip&gt;
spellscore, Astral Shield score 95766 (boost 114 scorat 0)
Eval: Astral Shield score 102974 (fat 3)
comp_castspell: eval Astral Shield result 102974
best spell so far Astral Shield (score102974)

So it looks like there's a 100,000 bonus for a spell being scripted, but Astral Shield gets an incredible base score.
I'm not sure why the final number is bumped up, by 7000+, from the initial spellscore. (Hmmm, some others are reduced maybe based on fatigue?)
Summon Earthpower has a very low base, which I'd disagree with, but Astral shield is ridiculous. Only two other spells even rate above 10,000, much less have a chance at overriding the script.
Ironskin: 14283
Invulnerability: 47456

Body Ethereal, which I'd much rather have than the Shield only rates 5227
Personal Luck, which I'd also rather have as a buff, isn't even checked: comp_castspell: No eval Personal Luck, choices 80

I guess I just can't see why Astral Shield is so high. If it's multiplied because he had S6, then the multiplier is just too high.

If it is rated higher for being earlier in the battle, hopefully, I can adjust the order so that Earthpower isn't overridden. Other buffs get high enough ratings that with favspell boost, they'll get cast.

[Kristoffer O]

Seems something is not right. Too high a multiplier might be the case.

[ano]

From the description of Horse Tribe Cavalry (Monster number 137):
"...They use light lances and and bows..."
Should be:
"...They use light lances and bows..."

[vfb]

Here's another weird one with random events and sieges working strangely:

The nation sieging the castle can get a 'Lab burned down' event. This burns down the lab in the castle, much to the surprise of the besieged nation. The besieged nation does not even get a message about the event. The lab just goes missing.

[Edi]

vfb, that seems like another instance of special siege behavior, which has a slew of similar things. The game isn't too good about handling events in provinces where ownership is not clearcut.

Ano, I'll fix that typo for the next patch. Thanks for catching it since it's the result of my own mistakes.

[capnq]

thejeff said:Body Ethereal, which I'd much rather have than the Shield only rates 5227

Body Ethereal doesn't automatically target the caster; I stopped trying to script it as a self-buff after I realized that.

[thejeff]

But it's too good to pass up. A caster may occasionally miss himself, but if he's going solo or can be positioned away from other troops he won't target others.

[Dedas]

Legions of steel often favor units with little armor over those with much. This is very bad for Ulm.

[Weryl]

I recently installed dom3 on a toshiba satellite laptop running winxp and everything was fine at the beginning. a few days ago dom3 started mixing all the keys on my keyboard (replaces 'a' by 'q', ';' by 'm', etc) and I can't use most hotkeys. Nothing else's wrong with my laptop though, i didnt install anything since then and everything's fine in any other program.

[Edi]

Not enough information in that to make any definite pronouncements, unfortunately. I've never heard of that problem with anyone else.

[ano]

Weryl said:
I recently installed dom3 on a toshiba satellite laptop running winxp and everything was fine at the beginning. a few days ago dom3 started mixing all the keys on my keyboard (replaces 'a' by 'q', ';' by 'm', etc) and I can't use most hotkeys. Nothing else's wrong with my laptop though, i didnt install anything since then and everything's fine in any other program.


Probably, you just pressed CapsLock http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Twan]

IA : Bean sidhe (or perhaps any stealthy mage discovered in the patrol phase or any lone mage with level 1 paths and 3 gems) seem to not be weighted correctly. My army with about 400 troops and 40 mages didn't considered a lone bean sidhe discovered in patrol phase too weak to avoid to waste gems. Even after her was soul slayed by one of the first mages, the full round one script was followed by all (= about 25 gems of diverse mass spell).

[atul]

Weryl, that sounds like you'd have turned your keyboard into French mode (or back). That area has this "awerty" layout instead of qwerty, and it also does some funny stuff with letter 'm'. IIRC.

[stecal]

Ver 3.15 multiplayer. Just received this message:
"message from host:
Ulm had an unexplanable increase in weath this turn. This could be caused by cheating"

Now since I am hosting AND playing LA Ulm, I am pretty sure I am not cheating myself.

My income has not in fact gone up much at all. All I noticed was a random event that discovered increased tax revenues by 20 gold.

"An unexpected even has occurred in Garilon. Copper deposits have been found and a new mine is being built. Tax rewvenues have been permanently increased by 20 pounds of gold."

[Endoperez]

stecal said:
Ver 3.15 multiplayer. Just received this message:
"message from host:
Ulm had an unexplanable increase in weath this turn. This could be caused by cheating"



Alchemy has sometimes reported similar problems when you've stacked enough multipliers on it (alchemist and Alchemist's stone, for example), and I think it can also happen if you cancel recruitment in some rare cases (I think it had to do with the province in question being besieged).

[StormCrow434]

Variation on a theme...Affliction (missing arm) and item slots:

Warenharis is missing an Arm. No big thing, gave him a single handed weapon and soldiered on. All other slots and items (just his original gear) were in place.

Gave him new armor. Evidently he put it on over his original gear. Now wearing Black Steel Full Plate AND a Scale Mail Hauberk. Helmet now gone, however...

The encumbrance values stacked, as did the body protection. With this rig he has zero head protection, but 35 body!

Head slot still exists, but I have no Helmet to check it with. Will build one this turn just to see if that 'fixes' the issue.

Worthy Heroes mod, game FruitBat on llamabeast's server.

[Edi]

Post the bloody turn file ASAP! We need examples of this, as it rarely happens! And I'd like to have the turn file for the next one as well. Thanks!

[StormCrow434]

Warenharis and the armor are in Province 51. At the start of the turn the Black Steel Full Plate was on an Ulmish commander, same area.

Happy to send where to whomever you want me to. I'll save this .trn file in a separate folder for posterity.

[Edi]

Send the trn file to info at illwinter dot com. The following one as well. Include a thorough but clear description of what happened, what you did and what resulted from it. That will allow Johan to take a good look at the item slot behavior and the underlying causes. Especially if the problem is interesting from a coding/problem solving point of view, it might get quick attention.

[StormCrow434]

I'll send the current turn now. I did decide against Forging a helmet just yet; my Smiths were otherwise engaged. But can make it a priority next turn.

Did you want to see the next turn to check out the Helmet affects? If so, even when Forged it will take another turn to get to Warenharis since there is no Lab in Prov 51.

[Cor2]

Not sure if this is a bug. Either way need more reports.
During an assainattion attempt AI victim cast gift of flight on the assassin as if it were an attack spell. Assasin pops across the feild and kills him in one round.

edit: one more relivant fact, the AI was Caelum and could fly, so the only vaild target on the feild was my assassin.

[Edi]

Stormcrow, please send the turn when Warenheris has the helmet so the behavior can be observed. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Cor, that's certainly unusual behavior. We'll see about it.

[Weryl]

atul said:
Weryl, that sounds like you'd have turned your keyboard into French mode (or back). That area has this "awerty" layout instead of qwerty, and it also does some funny stuff with letter 'm'. IIRC.



I don't know how to stop it from happenening, but everytime I open dom3 I must switch to either fullscreen or window mode to fix it until next time. It doesnt matter which one im using as long as i changed mode on startup.
Also even when i do that SHIFT key still doesnt work so i cant use most hotkeys. And no I didnt press Caps Lock http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

[chrispedersen]

A priest attacks a square with no PD and 0-6 undead.
Priest has

Case
1: Banish Banish Banish Retreat
2: Banish Banish Banish Retreat
3: Banish Banish Retreat Orders.

In all three cases, the priest casts blessing ... and retreats.

I can understand the AI decides to cast blessing.. because of range.. or AI reasons. But I can't understand why.. with NO ONE in the region - why it decides to go against orders and retreat early.

Ditto the second time.. with ONE undead on the other side of the battle field - without a commander, and with the other sides army already routed.. again the commander decides to retreat early!

I don't have the old trn files.. but I have this turns.

Also - the uncommanded undead do not undergo mindless dissolution they just route like other units.

[Kristoffer O]

Might be ghouls. THey are not mindless.

Retreat seems strange.

[thejeff]

I'm not sure why the priest would retreat. Maybe if he can't find a valid spell to cast he moves on to the next order, which would be the final retreat?
Can you replay the battle with debug on? That might give more info.

[chrispedersen]

It has happened again. The first case was with NO undead in the province.

The second - fourth cases was with one ghoul. One case with a soulless.

The way it happens is this.


1. I attack.
2. Ermor routes. Ghoul moves back
3. I cast bless.
4. I route. (No idea why)
5. I move back (Second action for me - order is to retreat on 3rd action).
6. Enemy doesn't move
7. I route off the screen..

its -ddd or -ddddd... can I do this multiplay?

will try

[chrispedersen]

It has happened again. The first case was with NO undead in the province.

The second - fourth cases was with one ghoul. One case with a soulless.

The way it happens is this.


1. I attack.
2. Ermor routes. Ghoul moves back
3. I cast bless.
4. I route. (No idea why)
5. I move back (Second action for me - order is to retreat on 3rd action).
6. Enemy doesn't move
7. I route off the screen..

It seems as if whats happening is the priest is ignoring orders and processing the next order in the queue, which is retreat - which I think is the reason for the Ryalleh routes message...

its -ddd or -ddddd... can I do this multiplay? Will try..

[Endoperez]

chrispedersen said:
its -ddd or -ddddd... can I do this multiplay? Will try..



Log of the battle will be generated whenever you view a battle, even if it's a battle from MP, IIRC.

[thejeff]

Yes. Just start the game from the command line or a shortcut with -ddd and play the battle out.

[Kristoffer O]

If you have retreat as third order your priest might start retreating earlier if he cant cast any spells (due to range etc). If unable to follow one order he switches to the next one. If that is also impossible to perform he will go for the third order (retreat).

[Cor2]

Global enchantment Icon appears randomly on one of my PD. I have only noticed this with Ulm but could be going on with other nations.

Here is a pic. attaching turn file and map.
http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa92/allothernamestakenreally/Dominions/Pikeneerbug.gif

[Cor2]

Here is the map, called Likeside

[quantum_mechani]

That looks an awful lot like a curse. A different icon would probably be helpful.

[vfb]

What happens if you mouse-over it? Does it say "Global Enchantment"? Or "Cursed"? Maybe the green grass somehow made your brown curse icon look green? Looks weird though.

[Edi]

Is that in late game in a large game?

There is a bug with persistent global spells that stay in effect even though the nation that cast them has been defeated. In such cases, the global is of necessity tied to the unique ID of the caster and if the caster is dead, the number may have been temporarily assigned to one of the PD units.

[chrispedersen]

its what I thought - but your AI doesn't check to see if the enemy has already routed??????

[Cor2]

In regards to the icon. It does say "global enchantment" and not curse. It is a PD unit, I think and starts the battle with it, so no way it could have been cursed.

Edi: It is fairly large late game. I think you may have it. Started with all MA nations on a map and now down to 5.

Its certainly not a game breaking bug, just kind of strange.

[lch]

Bracers of protection are affected by earth bless, and stack. Bug or WAD? http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/showflat.php?Number=592714#Post592714

[Edi]

The Bless thing seems to be WAD due to the protection being overall instead of either body or head. It may be that it would be non-trivial to code a separate check for the non-specified protection type. Two bracers stacking on the other hand seems like a bug.

[thejeff]

It's WAD in the sense that we can make a guess how it happens. It doesn't seem like an intended effect. More likely a side effect of the new body/head armor system.

Are there any other non armor/helmet items that give protection?
Shields, but they're handled differently.

[Edi]

Gift of Kurgi, but that's a unique artifact anyway. Skull necklace is an armor for some monsters but no item gives it. Some other artifacts also give non-specified protection.

[ologm]

The fire helmet gives overall protection.

I think there is a bug with AI taking over enemy AI castles. In a single player game I was playing. The AI had massive armies sieging enemy AI castles for a long time. But it never took over the castles. When I finally got rid of the large sieging AI armies and stormed the castles they were almost empty of enemy troops.

[lch]

ologm said:
I think there is a bug with AI taking over enemy AI castles. In a single player game I was playing. The AI had massive armies sieging enemy AI castles for a long time. But it never took over the castles. When I finally got rid of the large sieging AI armies and stormed the castles they were almost empty of enemy troops.


That's already on the shortlist since a long time.

[zzcat]

EA Abysia's income is affected by growth/death scale. According to the race description, They should immune to the bonus/penalty like MA abysia.

[Edi]

zzcat said:
EA Abysia's income is affected by growth/death scale. According to the race description, They should immune to the bonus/penalty like MA abysia.


Widely known issue, but I suppose it has slipped being added to the shortlist.

[ologm]

A mage of mine cast shark attack underwater and around 60 sharks showed up and completely decimated the enemy.

I think this was caused because the enemy has gift of health up and thanks to dominion shifts all his units started in battle with a red bar indicating that they had been wounded.

[Kristoffer O]

Nice of him http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Saulot]

I was going to post this last week, but I got distracted. (Did not check if this was posted earlier.)

One of the transformation results is very strange (and presumably a bug) ;

Hydra Hatchling (#719) (size 3) - With the sprite image of a large (size 6) hydra with two heads missing.

Edit:
Oh, quick followup question for KO, is transformation affected by any scales like luck?

[Wrana]

It's probably already known, but I've seen at least 2 times the following: an island is generated on random map and has borders drawn. However, it can't be selected as a separate province. Another bug is wrong terrain type (i.e., plain province looking as sea, etc.)

[sansanjuan]

I have a Skratti in werewolf form with an affliction that state AP-4 (among a couple other minuses iirc). However the creature's AP now shows as 2 (with quickness cast it becomes a 5). Is this a bug?
-SSJ

[Endoperez]

sansanjuan said:
I have a Skratti in werewolf form with an affliction that state AP-4 (among a couple other minuses iirc). However the creature's AP now shows as 2 (with quickness cast it becomes a 5). Is this a bug?
-SSJ



Perhaps it's due to armor? Most humans have the same basic AP, but heavily armored troops are slower.

[sansanjuan]

Endoperez said:


Perhaps it's due to armor? Most humans have the same basic AP, but heavily armored troops are slower.



ahhh... I'll check when I get home. I think I did but that heavy green troll armor on him.

Sheepishly,
SSJ http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/redface.gif

[llamabeast]

Very minor one: The description for the Grave Consort says she can "revive the newly dead". In fact she can also reanimate longdeads.

[Cor2]

I think moss body explosions are killing poison immune troops. Is this intended?

I have a save game where I cannot discern any other cause for 100% immune serpent preists to be dieing.

[Edi]

llamabeast said:
Very minor one: The description for the Grave Consort says she can "revive the newly dead". In fact she can also reanimate longdeads.


That's probably a Dom2 holdover from before the priest level adjustment downward and the accompanying changes in reanimation.

[vfb]

Cor2 said:
I think moss body explosions are killing poison immune troops. Is this intended?

I have a save game where I cannot discern any other cause for 100% immune serpent preists to be dieing.



I've seen this before too. Poison immunity does not help.

[Dedas]

That is... strange.

[Edi]

Probably the poison tag is missing from the explosion damage type.

So, what I need to add:
- Mossbody explosion
- Serpent Cataphract and Hierogallus statfixes
- EA Abysia Death income issue (possibly MA as well)
- Gift of Flight issues

[llamabeast]

When the LA Pythium Serpent Cataphract rider dies, the armour on the lizard changes from gold to silver.

[thejeff]

The early Age Sidhe Lord has regular armor and weapons, not the bronze and Golden versions the other Sidhe and Tuatha use.

His description doesn't mention bronze armor, but the other Tir descriptions do talk about the Sidhe not using iron.

[Lingchih]

Voice of Aspu should not be able to be used to break down domes in Enemy provinces. This is a site searching spell, and should not be usable in enemy provinces.

[Reay]

Why is Current HP for the pretender based on the dominion in the province they were in last turn?

Max HP, strength and MR dominion bonuses seems to be based on the dominion in the current province. So why isn't Current HP?

It can cause strange regeneration rates since they are based on Max HP. It can also cause more afflictions since the chances of getting one are based on the damage percentage of the Max HP.

It just seems unintuitive to me.

[Endoperez]

Reay said:
Why is Current HP for the pretender based on the dominion in the province they were in last turn?

Max HP, strength and MR dominion bonuses seems to be based on the dominion in the current province. So why isn't Current HP?



If you teleport/fly to a far-away province, you know how many hp your pretender will start with. If it was the other way around, if it happened to be dominion 8 province of your enemy, your pretender would just POOF! against the defenders.

Also, I'm not sure if current hp go all the way to max hp every turn, or if the change is more gradient. Having 2x hps and going into an enemy province (0.8xhp) might leave you at 1.3xhp or something.

[Reay]

Yes, well I think it would be the risk you take for teleporting yourself into an unknown province. You are probably going to assume it has a reasonable amount of enemy dominion there.

It just seems very confusing for a newbie.

[Kristoffer O]

Max HP is based on the current province, but current HP is based on the HP they had last turn. They gradually loose HP until it is at the level they should have in the province they enter. So it's more like you have some residual bonus HP hanging on even when you enter an enemy dominion.

This is to alleviate dramatic changes in HP if you go from one land and have like 100 HP and enter another and have 10 or 20. I think you loose half the excess HP each turn or something.

[Reay]

Hmm.. I guess that sounds thematic.

Perhaps then, the Max HP should also do this?

[Cor2]

At first it was confusing, but I have grow to like the rule quite alot.

[ano]

Lingchih said:
Voice of Aspu should not be able to be used to break down domes in Enemy provinces. This is a site searching spell, and should not be usable in enemy provinces.


Why actually?
It is these "voices" specific feature that they are usable no matter who controls the target province. And the feature of Air dome is that it has a 20% chance to be dispelled.
Use more than one dome instead and better support Air dome with damaging ones - fire or water.

[vfb]

ano said:

Lingchih said:
Voice of Aspu should not be able to be used to break down domes in Enemy provinces. This is a site searching spell, and should not be usable in enemy provinces.


Why actually?
It is these "voices" specific feature that they are usable no matter who controls the target province. And the feature of Air dome is that it has a 20% chance to be dispelled.
Use more than one dome instead and better support Air dome with damaging ones - fire or water.



KO's explanation is here:

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/showflat.php?Number=595147&amp;bodyprev=#Post595147

[coolnathan01]

ever since i patched my game it freezes and I have to shut it off. What should I do?

[Cor2]

I have been noticing a similar bug to the one i reported earlier about the global enchant icon showing up on normal units. This time its a ritual of returning showing up on units. I have seen this several times now. Here is a pic:

http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa92/allothernamestakenreally/Dominions/Ritualofreturnbug.gif

Seems to me to have started since the new patch (.15). Still not a major bug. I don't care if its ever fixed. Just wanted to let you know its happening.

[lch]

Cor2 said:
Seems to me to have started since the new patch (.15). Still not a major bug. I don't care if its ever fixed. Just wanted to let you know its happening.


You probably have only noticed that recently since only recently there have been icons added for that stuff.

[Dedas]

coolnathan01 said:
ever since i patched my game it freezes and I have to shut it off. What should I do?



http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/showflat.php?Cat=&amp;Board=dom3&amp;Number=557734

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/showflat.php?Cat=&amp;Number=555274

If this fits on you you should sail off and buy the game.

If not, contact Shrapnel Support.

[Cor2]

lch said:
You probably have only noticed that recently since only recently there have been icons added for that stuff.



hasn't there always been a icon for ritual of returning?

[Cor2]

Here is another. This one is really wierd.

Assassination attempt (3rd one down) the assassin has a living water bottle. Ice elemental kills all 4 body guards. Defender is a mage: casts Pheonix Pyre then smacks the Ice elemental with a magma bolt, the elemental survives. I get a message that my forces have routed. First question why? Then the elemental kills the mage, which explodes, CREATING TWO identical mages? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/confused.gif WTF?


save game attached. You need the map "wraith bunny" to view

[Cor2]

Okay, this ritual of returning bug is becoming serious. It actually works. Random units and commanders are popping up with rituals of returning and when they get hit they end up in my capitol.

Attached is a file. Notice the commander who found woundflame. He appears in my capitol after battle despite being 3-4 provinces away.

You need wraith bunny map to use this file.

[vfb]

Cor2 said:
Here is another. This one is really wierd.

Assassination attempt (3rd one down) the assassin has a living water bottle. Ice elemental kills all 4 body guards. Defender is a mage: casts Pheonix Pyre then smacks the Ice elemental with a magma bolt, the elemental survives. I get a message that my forces have routed. First question why? Then the elemental kills the mage, which explodes, CREATING TWO identical mages? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/confused.gif WTF?


save game attached. You need the map "wraith bunny" to view



I know why you routed. Your forces started with a total of 10+45 = 55HP. You will auto-route when you go below a total of 55/4 = 13HP. Your Ice Elemental has multiple forms, but at morale check time, its current form had 1HP. Probably the morale check code should add up the HP remaining in all forms of all creatures in the battle, not just the current form's HP.

The combat bug is very weird, with the defending mage appearing to be in two places. Just before it dies, it has 9 HP in both locations. The elemental squishes just one of the image, but both go down to 8 HP. Weird! It's the same unit, it's just in two places at once. You've discovered the particle-wave duality of Shugenjas!

[Cor2]

vfb said:
You've discovered the particle-wave duality of Shugenjas!



LOL!
I love quantum physics, I used to always make jokes like these. Was alway met with blank stares. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

I have never understood the more complicated routing mechanics. I should study up.

[Cor2]

I think the ritual of returning bug is linked to the Armor of Virtue. I have only seen it appearing in the same province.

[Amhazair]

Units retreating from a combat started by autospawning maenads in your province (spawned by stealthing Pans) seem to disappear after the combat, instead of actually retreating to any adjacent province.
( http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/showflat.php?Cat=&amp;Number=595413&amp;page=0&amp;view=collap sed&amp;sb=5&amp;o=&amp;fpart=1 )

I can attach the gamefiles if they're needed, but someone will have to explain how to go about it. (sorry, I'm no good at computer stuff - except gaming of course) The bug is very easy to reproduce though. Just have a Pan stealth around anywhere, and have an opposing force with retreat orders lounging in that province, et voilà.

[Aezeal]

KO if you read this there is a bug in the game, this turn (currently played) I just put my turn on save and exit, the game explicity says that i need to finish the game via end turn if I want it to be send (which is good, I didn't want it send yet) but when I look at the status page it's send none the less.

3 turns ago this got me into war with dr P. it's not good.

[llamabeast]

I can confirm Aezeal's bug there, I think it's well known.

[Zeldor]

1. Undead can be affected by Decay, gets 5 years per batttle turn then starts to get old age sympton and new affliction from that [lots of them].

2. With a big number of affliction you may lose some after battle or one can change into a different one.

3. Elixir of Life works on lifeless beings.

4. Maelstrom castable on land.

[Agrajag]

1 makes sense for some undead (mainly the corporeal none-immortals)
EDIT: Thematically, that is.

[Gregstrom]

This is probably a known issue, but...

It appears to me that if you have an Air Dome and an Astral Dome on a province and a spell breaks the Air Dome, all spells cast after that automatically penetrate the Astral dome.

[edit] Cancel that. The Astral Dome did work - once. More like a 5% than a 50% stop rate, but it was still having an effect.

[chrispedersen]

As if Oni didn't have enough problems.

I have 25+ times now, attempted to have two generals with appropriate gems, and mage levels cast End of Weakness and End of Culture national spells.

I could *never* get the spells cast. The AI apparently found better things to do .. ALL the time.

Case in question: Cast with the armies with only flame throwing demons.....

[vfb]

Don't worry, you're not missing out. I should put my "End of Culture" cast in the Hall of Doh thread.

Step one: Recruit large quantities of Hannya, I think I was going to blast Banefire or something on my foes. Prepare to rain some smack down with Aka and Kuro Onis, before charging into battle.

Step two: Cast "End of Culture" because it sounds cool.

Step three: Watch in horror as my Onis stop throwing flames, and my Hannya ignore their spells and charge into battle. Doh!

Are you sure your mages are carrying the gems needed for the casts? And do your really want to do this to your poor flame throwing Aki Onis?

[Zeldor]

Gregstorm:

Didn't you cast the astral dome the same turn when attacking spell were cast? I think you didn't have astral one turn before. So if you cast it then it gets randomly added to the line, with enemy spells. Your air dome seemed to fall down on first spells, then there was nothing. So probably your new astral dome got a far roll and got cast just before few last enemy spells.

[ryo_akashi]

Monster Boar (M1910) and Brigand Leader (M1912) do not have their stealth updated with the recent change to scout updates. Should their stealth be increased?

[Edi]

Monster boar, perhaps, but I wouldn't bet on it. For brigand leader, no. Commander stealth affects all stealth units under his leadership if I've understood some dev comments correctly, so non-scouts don't too easily get given a stealth bonus.

[Endoperez]

Edi said:
Monster boar, perhaps, but I wouldn't bet on it. For brigand leader, no. Commander stealth affects all stealth units under his leadership if I've understood some dev comments correctly, so non-scouts don't too easily get given a stealth bonus.



I thought Brigand Leader is only used in the monster boar-type event.

[Edi]

He is.

[Edi]

Added to shortlist:

- Sidhe Lord statfix
- Abysian death scales
- Mossbody explosion damage not poison as it should be
- Gift of Flight being cast on enemies when it shouldn't
- Stacking domes of same type
- Voice of Apsu castable on hostile provinces as conditional dependent on stackable domes

[lch]

There's some issue with the Hydra heads again it seems, a small mod was made by DrP to fix it. More info in the PPP game thread (http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/threads/showflat.php?Cat=&amp;Number=597672&amp;Main=586994#Post59 7672).

[Edi]

Yes, form 1856 has firstshape 1856 instead of 1850. Been on the list for over a month. Can someone run a test for me and tell me which regular hydra has the same problem?

[capnq]

If a bug listed on the shortlist is in black rather than color-coded, does that mean its severity hasn't been determined yet?

[Edi]

Yes, it means indeterminate/average classification. I should probably change the notation, since purple has come to denote something that is a bit more important than a completely regular thing while red is still major stuff.

[Wick]

Hydra 1837 also is it's own firstshape. Edi, thanks for all you work in the buglist and DB and...

[Edi]

Thanks.

I updated the hydra entries to include 1837. I also corrected the mistake I'd made in the entry text where I had confused firstshapes and secondshapes. Should be correct on all counts now.

Also upadted the classification section so that purple is now a significant bug (wrt other bugs in same category without an assigned priority), while red is reserved for the big bastards.

[Cor2]

Am I the only one experinceing the ritual of returning bug (about two pages back)? Seems to be linked to armor of virtue.

[Loren]

Am I the only one running into the battlefield overload bug? I've posted multiple games that will crash due to it. It was killed some time ago but it came back.

[Edi]

Cor, I've never heard that report from anyone else. It looks much like the persistent global enchantments bug. I bet that if people used Dragon Mastery, that would show up exactly the same way and so would Inner Sun and Twiceborn but only if those units died due to dominion killing a nation or retreating from battle with all avenues of escape cut off.

Loren, no, I have not heard additional reports on that one either. Nor have I had time to look at the games you posted.

[Cor2]

Thanks Edi. With the regularity that it pops up for me, I imagine we will be getting more reports. Not the worst bug out there for sure.

[Edi]

IS that only n late game large games when it appears?

[Cor2]

I guess it depends where you place late game. I my opionion it started mid-game, but cerrtainly seemed to get worse with late game.

BUT there seems to be a problem with the thoery of recycled unit numbers in that commanders I have had for many rounds (sometimes with 3-4 stars of xp) pop up with ROR. It is not isolated to new commanders.

BTW, I am not casting ROR at all, but that is most likely moot as the AI is.

[ano]

When insane, commanders can perform actions that are impossible at all (I don't mean many prophets as it seems a feature, not a bug).
For example, during the siege of enemy castle my priest performed a site search and found several sites that benefited the besieged nation.

[Edi]

Cor2 said:
I guess it depends where you place late game. I my opionion it started mid-game, but cerrtainly seemed to get worse with late game.

BUT there seems to be a problem with the thoery of recycled unit numbers in that commanders I have had for many rounds (sometimes with 3-4 stars of xp) pop up with ROR. It is not isolated to new commanders.

BTW, I am not casting ROR at all, but that is most likely moot as the AI is.


Then that's just you for some reason. I have not heard this report from others.



ano said:
When insane, commanders can perform actions that are impossible at all (I don't mean many prophets as it seems a feature, not a bug).
For example, during the siege of enemy castle my priest performed a site search and found several sites that benefited the besieged nation.


WAD. Insane commanders do what they will when not lucid. Other possible commands are "Ftaghn" and "That is not a star" and other equally strange one.

[thejeff]

Not a bug, but a request: I really wish the weird insanity commands were one-turn actions.
I can deal with commanders disobeying orders and ftaghning for a turn, but it's really annoying that they continue doing it once they've returned to sanity. If they went back to defend, I could find them with 'n'. As it is you have to manually check every province.