Mod idea: Reborn Iron Faith

[Nerfix]

Hello

I have been tinkering with bringing back Iron Faith Ulm without the Black Fores elements, and with some new stuff. So far my ideas include:

- All the middle age Ulmish units
We know the drill.
- Black Templars & Hochmeisters
This drill is also a familiar one.
- Templar Guardians
Oh...what's this? Clad in best Ulmish black steel armor covered with silver, scribled with sacred symbols and anointed in holy oils, these holy tinned meats posses 25% fire and lightning resistance and above-ulmish MR. Their magic Halberds do extra damage to demons.
- Templar Lord
A Templar Guardian commander, 1 Holy.
- Iron Priests (1 Earth 100%WESA 2 Holy, Inquisitor, Forgebonus)
Slightly boosted up
- Iron High Priest (1 Earth 1 Astral 110%WESA 2 Holy, Inquistor, Forgebonus, starts Old)
The first and most skilled of Iron Priests, the Iron High Priests supervise the kingdom. They study magics of the forge and magics of the Spheres.
- Battle Chaplain
2 Holy commander with full black steel armor and a Maul, these commander represent the will of the Ulmish God on the battlefield because the Iron Priests tend to be too busy to inquisitorize/forge/preach/study.

They don't get smiths.


What do you think?

[Endoperez]

Not sure. It's a simple mod, so it should be easily done. You just need to find suitable graphics for Templar Guardian and Templar Lord. I suggest Eternal Knights or whatever the ethereal knights recruitable from the Tower of Nexus are called. They're usually never seen without etherealness.

I'd also use just Templar, Knight Templar or Templar Knight, OR Temple Guardian, as a name for what you call Templar Guardian.Just a matter of taste.

[Nerfix]

But I like TG because it creates allusions to the old military order of Ulmish Guardians who were saved from starving under a siege by a miracle... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif They're expensive both resource and gold wise but they are sacred.

They're also capital only, as are IHP's.

You don't think this is off-balance or anything?

And yes, the only problem is finding the graphics. I'd thought of just using a silvery Guardian for TG's, an Iron Priest with longer beard for IHP's and modified Lord Guardian graph for Battle Chaplain.

But alas, my graphic editing skills don't even go that far. :p

[Endoperez]

Hmm... I thought that the Temple Guardians would be mounted knights, but it seems I was mistaken.

I don't know about balance, but as I said, try it. Just use something rarely used for nations and rarely found elsewhere for the graphics. Perhaps the Iron Order mages? They have grey robes IIRC.

[Nerfix]

Hmmmm, that's a good idea. Thanks.

[reverend]

Still waiting for my full game, but I like the idea of this mod. I always liked Iron Faith, so any way to bring it back is welcome. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Daynarr]

What era would you put them in? Late?

[Tyrian]

Late era is credible, he talk about a miracle to protect the guardian from starving.

[Nerfix]

Daynarr said:
What era would you put them in? Late?

Late of course. The plot is that after Night of Treason the religious faction of the kingdom managed to properly seize the power and eradicate all "heretics". http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif

[Lleihsad]

Great idea! I think it'd be most useful to make it MA, seeing as how MA Ulm is widely seen as being too weak. Some stronger priests and a few sacred units would go a long way toward making MA Ulm more effective.

[HoneyBadger]

I agree it's a good idea. It would be a good nation to choose the Forge Lord as a Pretender for. I wonder if anyone's thought of having a summoned smith in a Nation's summoning repertoire? Maybe one of Hephaeastus' golden robots.

[PvK]

I was thinking about this same idea, except without adding much. Good idea! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Gandalf Parker]

Just a stray thought but there is a map command to force one of the old special faiths. Has anyone tested to see what the result of that is? Some of the map commands say "no effect in Dom3" or something like that, but this one didnt.

[HoneyBadger]

I'm really intrigued by this, Gandalf.

Could I get an explanation of "old special faiths"? And a list of them? Possibly a list of the "themes" present in Dom2 as well? It's something I wouldn't have access to even with a manual, so I don't feel bad asking about it, and-with details-some of them might make really good subjects for mods.

Thanks so much.

[Sandman]

Nerfix said:
Hello

I have been tinkering with bringing back Iron Faith Ulm without the Black Fores elements, and with some new stuff. So far my ideas include:

- All the middle age Ulmish units
We know the drill.
- Black Templars & Hochmeisters
This drill is also a familiar one.
- Templar Guardians
Oh...what's this? Clad in best Ulmish black steel armor covered with silver, scribled with sacred symbols and anointed in holy oils, these holy tinned meats posses 25% fire and lightning resistance and above-ulmish MR. Their magic Halberds do extra damage to demons.
- Templar Lord
A Templar Guardian commander, 1 Holy.
- Iron Priests (1 Earth 100%WESA 2 Holy, Inquisitor, Forgebonus)
Slightly boosted up
- Iron High Priest (1 Earth 1 Astral 110%WESA 2 Holy, Inquistor, Forgebonus, starts Old)
The first and most skilled of Iron Priests, the Iron High Priests supervise the kingdom. They study magics of the forge and magics of the Spheres.
- Battle Chaplain
2 Holy commander with full black steel armor and a Maul, these commander represent the will of the Ulmish God on the battlefield because the Iron Priests tend to be too busy to inquisitorize/forge/preach/study.

They don't get smiths.


What do you think?



How about an Ulm-style flagellant?

Penitent - Similar stats and gold cost to the flagellant, but wears cheap, crude heavy armour which they never remove. High encumbrance, but very suitable for an Earth bless. Wields a hammer. Recruitable everywhere.

I'd give them better magic. Some nations get terrible magic in the late era, others get vast amounts. I don't get it.

[HoneyBadger]

On that note, what if the Penitent had a more powerful national summon they propagated? Background-wise, the Penitant who lived and died in their armor, would be welded into it when they no longer could fight. When they died, their spirits would remain locked in the armor, forever serving as undead models of purity, chastity, and self-denial. They'd look like black steel armor with pure light flooding from the seams-kind of sort of maybe a little like the Hellspawn Slayer "The Disciple" from the Spawn series.

[zepath]

There are some pretty neat ideas bouncing around in here. Nerfix, you can probably pull this off without creating or changing any graphics. Simply borrow from other appropriate indie units that we don't see very often (the Iron Order mages as Endo suggests among them). I'd love to see this brought to fruition. Great concept!

[Sandman]

HoneyBadger said:
On that note, what if the Penitent had a more powerful national summon they propagated? Background-wise, the Penitant who lived and died in their armor, would be welded into it when they no longer could fight. When they died, their spirits would remain locked in the armor, forever serving as undead models of purity, chastity, and self-denial. They'd look like black steel armor with pure light flooding from the seams-kind of sort of maybe a little like the Hellspawn Slayer "The Disciple" from the Spawn series.



That's quite cool, although reanimated armour might be more of a Black Forest type thing. Because that theme should be reworked as well.

[HoneyBadger]

Thanks Sandman, I'm glad you like the idea.

I was thinking though that the game could use more holy-as opposed to unholy-sacred undead units, and that it would be nice if a human nation generated some, especially Ulm.

I'm drawing from ideas like King Arthur guarding over England or the scene in Bedknobs-and-broomsticks when all the armor comes alive. We already have lots and lots of evil undead in the game, enough to make you think the Dom 3 Afterlife must be a depressing place-and more noble guardian undead (atleast more in the more "western flavored" nations) would be a nice counterweight.

[Sombre]

I like the concept of this one - much like the marignon reborn nation it just tweaks a few crucial events and you get to switch a nation you're very familiar with for a fresher one. Mentioning the alternate history (such as the guardians being saved by a miracle rather than becoming undead during the civil war) is a nice treat for people who have played some LA ulm. Hope you get this one made (it's very doable in scope).

[Sombre]

If Nerfix is too busy to make this I can do it. It shouldn't take much work, after all.

What do you guys think?

[Sandman]

Go for it. One small suggestion I have is to split Black Forest and Iron Faith into two different nations, a la Vanhiem and Helheim. The same for Marignon.

[Sombre]

Hmm. Well I used to think new nations are always better than replacement nations, but since marignon reborn I'm not so sure.

I suppose it couldn't hurt to have it as a new nation, but in terms of the 'storyline' it doesn't make much sense. After all with Reborn Iron Faith the malediction is prevented/replaced by a miracle and the civil war is ended with the country following

On the other hand,.. if the #clear command doesn't get rid of national spells then I'd rather have this new Ulm use the ID number of MA Ulm, which will mean there would be no replacing (unless I simply made the mod remove LA Ulm as well).

We'll see. It's truer to Nerfix's idea as a replacement though.

Ok, so here's the unit lineup. The nation focuses on priests waaay more than magic and features lots and lots of hammers. Black steel is in greater supply than in vanilla LA Ulm, but less than MA Ulm. I might go nuts and give them some new holy spells. Obviously sort of a bless nation.

Domspawned Units.

Penitent - New unit, but basically a flagellant. Domspawned by all Ulm Reborn priest units. Sacred.

Recruitable Units.

Infantry of Ulm - from MA Ulm. Chainmail, tower, hammer
Crossbow - From MA Ulm, but might have a crossbow instead of an arbalest
Pikeneer - From MA Ulm. Again, the chainmail not the Black Steel version.
Black Zweihander - Basically same as LA Ulm Zwei, but with armour upgraded to full plate of ulm.
Anchorite - This one is strange. They are animated suits of blacksteel armour in which madmen, heretics and criminals are placed. The armour fights with a maul until it is struck hard (high prot, lowish hp) at which point the occupant tumbles out fully converted to the new faith. So when they die you get a Penitent.
Black Templar - from LA Ulm, cap only sacred knights.
Neugeboren (reborn) Guard - Guardians reborn into the new faith when they were saved from starving by the Aufklarung (enlightenment). New sprite - look like white/silver armoured MA Ulm Guardians. Sacred. Cap only.

Commanders
Captain of Ulm - from MA Ulm, chainmail and hammer.
Hochmeister - from LA Ulm
Grand Hochmeister - A hochmeister with H2.
Neugeboren (reborn) Lord - The reborn guard's version of the MA Ulm Guardian Lord. H1 at least.
Black Acolyte - From LA Ulm
Black Priest - From LA Ulm
Black High Priest - New unit. H3 E2-3 (maybe death magic?) Important for flavour. Maybe needs a snappier name/gimmick.

For the heroes I'll probably take the LA Ulm ones and basically reverse them into good guys who were converted by the Aufklärung (enlightenment) which replaced the malediction.

What do we think? It's a relatively laidback project for me (like vaettihiem), but is there enough new content and whatnot?

[SlipperyJim]

Sombre said:
Black High Priest - New unit. H3 E2-3 (maybe death magic?) Important for flavour. Maybe needs a snappier name/gimmick.



Black Bishop? Black Cardinal?

...

Yeah, I love this idea. Standard LA Ulm doesn't have much appeal for me. On the other hand, reborn Iron Faith Ulm looks terrific. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif

[Sombre]

As promised the neugeboren guard have lovely* new sprites. The sprite of the commander, Neugeboren Lord, is attached. And yes, they will have attack sprites as well, made from scratch (I can't be bothered to extract attack sprites from the game - too complex).

I've basically finished making all the basic units. I just have to rewrite some descriptions, add in the black high priest/cardinal/bishop/demigogue and do countless other balancey stat changing type things.

Oh and the heroes. Those are going to take longer than anything else, so don't expect them in the first version.

If you have any other suggestions on what Ulm Reborn should have, now is the time to make 'em. Comments on the new sprite also appreciated.

*- I guess that's up to you to judge.

[SlipperyJim]

I like the new sprite. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif

For heroes, my only idea right now is a beefed-up version of the Neugeboren Lord. He was the commander of the Guardians when the miracle saved them all, and now he has become the patron saint of the Neugeboren Guard. Jack him up to H3 (for Divine Blessing), increase his max age (saints are a long-lived bunch) & leadership, and give him a standard effect. If you really wanted to go crazy, you could even give him a small Awe effect, but that might be overbalancing.

Looking forward to the mod! Let me know when you need a beta-tester! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[Sandman]

I'm not keen on domspawned Penitents. It would give the Ulmish player a strong incentive to take sloth. Unless it could be linked to productivity somehow...

[Sombre]

Bear in mind that they are domspawned /by/ priests and not the kind of auto domspawn that rlyeh and ermor get. The domspawn summoning won't be overpowering, believe me - it's more like an extra incentive to use all those priests, a way of providing more flavour and a way to increase the numer of holy units in your armies. As I said, this is a very holy heavy nation. Dominion is obviously going to be more important than with LA Ulm, but you'll still need all that production to make your regular/sacred units.

I could certainly do a Neugeboren Lord hero - the reverse of the ghoul baron in fact. NG Lords already have fear and standard effect though (they're pretty powerful and you'll want them to fight rather than sit back, but they're expensive and have no H magic now)

I'll upload a first release in a couple of days. Then you can all be beta testers ;]