Introducing the iPhone...

[Wade]

Introducing the iPhone...Ammazing! I'll be purchasing it in June when it ships in the USA at Apple and AT&T/Cingular stores.

http://www.apple.com/iphone/

http://www.apple.com/quicktime/qtv/mwsf07/

http://www.cingular.com/cell-phone-service/specials/iPhone.jsp?source=IC9801j01R00n300&WT.mc_id=IC9801 j01R00n300

Look at the photographs of it here in Wikipedia. It's Beautiful.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPhone#_note-pogueFAQ

http://pogue.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/01/11/the-ultimate-iphone-frequently-asked-questions/

Just watch the introduction video: the second link; then the second selection labeled, "Watch iPhone Introduction".

I'll bring more links as I find them.

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/videos/the-three-new-apple-iphone-ads-teasing-us-with-the-june-29th-release-date-265519.php

http://technorati.com/videos/tag/iPhone

http://technorati.com/photos/tag/iPhone

[Fyron]

Mehtacular over-priced, over-hyped product.

[Combat Wombat]

You were joking that you were gonna be purchasing one right? I mean apple is over pricing them by like $300 and there are multiple phones out already that do more than the iPhone does for cheaper and you aren't locked out of using 3rd party software and you aren't stuck with one carrier.

[Wade]

Just watch the introduction video: the second link; then the second selection labeled, "Watch iPhone Introduction".

Most "smart" phones are about $300. The iPod Nano 4GB is $199. That equals $499 that many...many people are paying for two devices. The iPhone does...so...much...more. I'll be getting the 8GB iPhone for $599. The 4GB iPhone is $499.

Just... watch... the... introduction. It's OK...to be impressed.

[Fyron]

As a smart phone, the iPhone does absolutely nothing more than any other smart phone, and actually far less when you consider the lack of integration with MS exchange server et all in the corporate world. Integrating a portable music player of any sort into a phone is just plain stupid IMO.

iPhone is not impressive in the slightest.

[Kamog]

Can we play SEIV and SEV on the iPhone?

[Fyron]

Considering that it doesn't run a Windows-based OS, I doubt it. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Captain Kwok]

I have an old cell phone that I can tape an old mp3 player to. I'll just ask $100 US ...

[Wade]

Captain Kwok said:
I have an old cell phone that I can tape an old mp3 player to. I'll just ask $100 US ...



But... it's big and bulky and... the tape covers the buttons. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smirk.gif

[Spectarofdeath]

But it's....a.....Kwokphone...."it's ok to be impressed" http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Renegade 13]

Useless triviality, in my own personal opinion, just like most personal electronic devices.

It's the feds, man! They're all, like, brainwashing us with the electronic-ness! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[PvK]

Maybe the iPhone can emulate Windows and run SE4... for that price, maybe it "should" http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Meanwhile, I continue to refuse to own any sort of cell phone. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[Will]

Imperator Fyron said:
As a smart phone, the iPhone does absolutely nothing more than any other smart phone, and actually far less when you consider the lack of integration with MS exchange server et all in the corporate world. Integrating a portable music player of any sort into a phone is just plain stupid IMO.

iPhone is not impressive in the slightest.


1) Random Access voicemail
2) Apple isn't trying to sell the iPhone to corporate customers because it is not the right product for business use; it will still connect to POP3 and IMAP servers, which a lot of people use (plus Gmail has POP3, which leads to...)
3) You may think playing music in a cell phone is stupid, but that's not what the sales numbers are telling cell carriers and phone manufacturers. People are buying it, and that's all that matters.
4) Apple *IS* trying to sell it to the 21-35 gadget-loving demographic, which can afford it and will provide the highest visibility with the least marketing effort. I wouldn't be surprised if Apple created a more mass-market cheaper version if the first does well enough; if it doesn't, no matter, because it will still draw more attention to Apple's other businesses.

I would actually consider buying one if I were in different circumstances. But I won't, mainly because I would never be able to use it. It combines three things that are prohibited where I work: a camera (must remain in locked car if brought on property), a mass storage device (need a permit and a legitimate need to carry inside, renewing every year), and a personal cell phone (must be left in lockers outside the building if no camera; otherwise, camera rules take precedence).

[Azselendor]

As great as the iphone is when it comes to simplicity in interface, I think that we might just see a similar reaction to the PS3 take place. Given that nokia, research in motion, tmobile and others are all developing cheaper, yet similar capability iphone-style devices, I think apple faces a tough up-hill battle.

And don't forget Google is working on an integrated phone too.

And meizu is gonna start a price war with the m8/minione
http://www.engadget.com/2007/01/29/meizus-m8-apple-lawyers-start-your-engines/


The less with the Iphone will be design a great, simple interface -- but price in reality.

[Fyron]

It seems that the only thing Apple products ever have going for them is "simplicity in interface," upon which they certainly have no monopoly. Their computers are the same hardware as PCs, but vastly more expensive. Their portable music players are at best middle of the road in terms of features and quality. The iPhone is nothing spectacular compared to the competition, and does nothing the competition does not do (Samsung has a touch screen smart phone with a foldout qwerty keyboard to prevent having to use a ****ty on-screen one).

[TurinTurambar]

PvK said:
Maybe the iPhone can emulate Windows and run SE4... for that price, maybe it "should" http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Meanwhile, I continue to refuse to own any sort of cell phone. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif


LMAO! omg you're kidding....

[aegisx]

It is 2007, it should run SEV.

[Renegade 13]

TurinTurambar said:

PvK said:
Maybe the iPhone can emulate Windows and run SE4... for that price, maybe it "should" http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Meanwhile, I continue to refuse to own any sort of cell phone. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif


LMAO! omg you're kidding....

About which part? If it's the cell phone part, he's not alone...I too refuse to bother with a cell phone http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Fyron]

Sometimes I think PvK would be happier living in the 18th century. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/stupid.gif

[Baron Munchausen]

Well, think about it. The main 'advantage' of the cell phone -- that people can reach you just about anywhere/anytime (there are still a few gaps in coverage) -- is also the main disadvantage. Some people don't like to be reachable every minute of every day.

[Fyron]

The main advantage is so you can call people when you want. Just turn off the ringer when you don't want to take calls. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

[AgentZero]

That's what I used to do. When I was living in Ireland, I always had my phone with me. I'd forget my keys, or my wallet or my smokes or my lighter, but I'd never forget my phone. The damn things just become indespensible after a while. But I think I had my ringer on literally less that 1% of the time. The rest of the time it was on vibrate so I knew if someone was after me, but I had the choice of ignoring them if I was busy, or just not in the mood for talking. And if I really didn't want to be bothered, they do have off buttons.

Now a question for those of you who do own cell phones: How much talking do you actually do on them versus text messaging? My old phone bills used to be 95% text messages because no one actually calls anyone unless it's really urgent. I'd think the fact that you have to pay for incoming calls (boo!) would make texts even more popular, or do you have to pay for recieved texts as well?

[Fyron]

I think you generally have to pay for incoming text messages too (or they count against the monthly limit). Most providers offer an unlimited text message option, though.

[Atrocities]

There should be one flat fee that covers everything. No more of this on peek, off peek, weekends, before 7, after 7, text this, photo that, download that, other hidden fees that, and bulls**t fees! $50.00 for 2,500 minutes, unlimited texting, phone services, and long distance.

[Azselendor]

They have to take your money somehow, you expect service at a reasonable fee! how preposterous!

I used to carry a cellphone with me all the time, but I stopped because I hated people calling me all the time over pointless crap and text messaging is a joke.

I can't figure out why anyone would want to spend ten minutes typing out a text message that you can spend two seconds and call them with the bloody phone -- after all, that's what a cellphone is for!

[AgentZero]

Imperator Fyron said:
I think you generally have to pay for incoming text messages too (or they count against the monthly limit). Most providers offer an unlimited text message option, though.



The fiends! That probably explains why cell phones aren't as prolific as they are in Europe. Well, maybe prolific is the wrong word, but they get used more over there. Like, if you see a group of 4 or more people walking down a typical Dublin street, 1 out of the 4 will have their phone out, it's almost a guarantee. Over here, not so much. Over there, it's common to own multiple phones. One of my flatmates had a weekday phone, a weekend phone, and emergency phone, and a phone only used to call her parents. Over here, people look at you funny for having a lot of phones. Actually, now that I think about it, maybe prolific is the word I'm looking for. That's not to say that cell phones aren't prolific in North America, just that in Europe, they're more prolific. Hell, even the homeless over there have them!
Not sure what my point was after all that though. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif I guess it's that over there the pricing schemes seem to encourage the use of the phones, while over here, the schemes seem to discourage their use. Which is odd.

[AgentZero]

Azselendor said:
I can't figure out why anyone would want to spend ten minutes typing out a text message that you can spend two seconds and call them with the bloody phone -- after all, that's what a cellphone is for!



I'd consider it a matter of etiquette. Phoning someone is sort of like saying, "Drop whatever it is you're doing and pay attention to me NOW!" which is rather rude and not considerate of the fact that the person might be busy at work, in the middle of class, or otherwise not available to take the call. Whereas a text message is sort of like saying, "Hey, I need to relay this information to you, but don't mean to interrupt what you're doing. Read this and respond when you can." Which is a fair bit more polite, don't you think?

[TurinTurambar]

AgentZero said:

Azselendor said:
I can't figure out why anyone would want to spend ten minutes typing out a text message that you can spend two seconds and call them with the bloody phone -- after all, that's what a cellphone is for!



I'd consider it a matter of etiquette. Phoning someone is sort of like saying, "Drop whatever it is you're doing and pay attention to me NOW!" which is rather rude and not considerate of the fact that the person might be busy at work, in the middle of class, or otherwise not available to take the call. Whereas a text message is sort of like saying, "Hey, I need to relay this information to you, but don't mean to interrupt what you're doing. Read this and respond when you can." Which is a fair bit more polite, don't you think?


Bingo. I especially appreciate text-messaging being married. My wife and I can exchange small, concise, useful pieces of information that don't interrupt my heavy workload. Texting is far more efficient when dealing with females; they love to talk.
I live in Los Angeles. I would say that cellphones are probably as "prolific" here as they are in Europe. Dealing with the unavoidable downtime of sitting in traffic, in a job where meetings and schedules and appointments dance on a razor's edge, the concept of life without a cellphone to me is unfathomable.

[Renegade 13]

AgentZero said:
I'd consider it a matter of etiquette. Phoning someone is sort of like saying, "Drop whatever it is you're doing and pay attention to me NOW!" which is rather rude and not considerate of the fact that the person might be busy at work, in the middle of class, or otherwise not available to take the call. Whereas a text message is sort of like saying, "Hey, I need to relay this information to you, but don't mean to interrupt what you're doing. Read this and respond when you can." Which is a fair bit more polite, don't you think?

I must say I disagree about texting being more polite. After all, if you didn't want to be interrupted by the phone, you wouldn't have it on, would you? Therefore, by extension, it wouldn't be impolite to give them a call.

You could make the same arguement about a regular land-line that you made for cellphones. Perhaps we should all just stop talking and text everyone about everything? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[Azselendor]

AgentZero said:

Azselendor said:
I can't figure out why anyone would want to spend ten minutes typing out a text message that you can spend two seconds and call them with the bloody phone -- after all, that's what a cellphone is for!



I'd consider it a matter of etiquette. Phoning someone is sort of like saying, "Drop whatever it is you're doing and pay attention to me NOW!" which is rather rude and not considerate of the fact that the person might be busy at work, in the middle of class, or otherwise not available to take the call. Whereas a text message is sort of like saying, "Hey, I need to relay this information to you, but don't mean to interrupt what you're doing. Read this and respond when you can." Which is a fair bit more polite, don't you think?



It takes me 2 seconds to turn off the ringer and let voice mail take the call.

[Fyron]

On my phone, I can just squeeze the sides and turn the ringer off (the side volume buttons function as mute during ringing). Not even 2 seconds if its in my pocket, heh.

[Captain Kwok]

Fortunately I can throw a sharpened pencil in only 0.6secs in a typical exam/lecture or meeting atmosphere.

[AgentZero]

Maybe it's just my crazy Irish mindset, but to me someone's intentions play a significant part in the whole politness thing. It's like if you're having a conversation with someone, and another person marches up and interrupts the two of you. You can chose to ignore him and carry on, that doesn't make his interruption any less rude. Same idea with texts messanges vs. calling someone.

But in the end, different parts of the world have different rules of etiquette, and the rules I'm used to say that calling someone is a bit rude, and rather presumptuous but it seems you zany colonials have different ideas on the matter. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[GuyOfDoom]

I wouldn't say that calling someone is rude per say, because it's the phone holders resposibility to manage the volume of their ring tone. Texting is definitely preferable when you're in a venue where having a phone conversation would be difficult due to background noise, etc.

[Wade]

Wade said:
Introducing the iPhone...Ammazing! I'll be purchasing it in June when it ships in the USA at Apple and AT&T/Cingular stores.

http://www.apple.com/iphone/

http://www.apple.com/quicktime/qtv/mwsf07/

http://www.cingular.com/cell-phone-service/specials/iPhone.jsp?source=IC9801j01R00n300&WT.mc_id=IC9801 j01R00n300

Just watch the introduction video: the second link; then the second selection labeled, "Watch iPhone Introduction".




Kamog said:
Can we play SEIV and SEV on the iPhone?



I'm not sure about this but it certainly has games and programs. Other games, programs, music, audiobooks, videos, TV shows, and movies you can add at places like iTunes.

The operating system for the iPhone is OS X and at Cingular.com there is a line that states, "Works with Windows PCs and Macs"

Can Space Empires IV and V be played on Macintosh computers? I'm not familiar with Macintosh. It would be cool if we could play many PC and console type games on the iPhone! Microsoft will probably compete with their own version of an iPhone soon. Microsofts version of the iPod is the Zune.

iPhone has the real internet and e-mail that we are used to on our PC's:(from Cingular.com)
"Breakthrough Internet Device:
iPhone features a rich HTML email client and Safari - the most advanced web browser ever on a portable device - which automatically syncs bookmarks from your PC or Mac. Safari also includes built-in Google and Yahoo! search. iPhone is fully multi-tasking, so you can read a web page while downloading your email in the background over Wi-Fi or EDGE."

An Apple store associate told me that it's like a Macintosh for your pocket.

Here is a list of some features at Cingular.com:
-Fully functional touch screen iPod which syncs with iTunes
-Wireless service from AT&T and all the benefits of network reliability, Rollover® minutes, and more
-Visual Voicemail: a first on any mobile phone available in the United States
-2MP camera
-Unique internet browsing capabilities
-Choose from 4GB ($499) or 8GB ($599) memory models
-EDGE, GPRS, GSM Quad-band, and WiFi capable
-Works with Windows PCs and Macs

And at Apple.com:
-Technical Specifications
-Screen size 3.5 inches
-Screen resolution 320 by 480 at 160 ppi
-Input method Multi-touch
-Operating system OS X
-Storage 4GB or 8GB
-GSM Quad-band (MHz: 850, 900, 1800, 1900)
-Wireless data Wi-Fi (802.11b/g) + EDGE + Bluetooth 2.0
-Camera 2.0 megapixels
-Battery Up to 5 hours Talk / Video / Browsing Up to 16 hours Audio playback
-Dimensions 4.5 x 2.4 x 0.46 inches / 115 x 61 x 11.6mm
-Weight 4.8 ounces / 135 grams

[Fyron]

The iPhone might be crippled by Apple's lockout of 3rd party software. Contrast this with any smart phone made by any other company... Nearly everyone else supports (or at least tolerates) 3rd party devs, but it appears that Apple will lock them out.

"The operating system for the iPhone is OS X..."

Not quite. It is a stripped down, heavily modified version designed to be runnable on and suitable for embedded systems (aka the iPhone). It is similar to OS X, but it is not OS X. Its just like the relationship between Windows Mobile and XP (2k?).

"An Apple store associate told me that it's like a Macintosh for your pocket."

That Apple store associate is an idiot. It is most certainly not like having a Mac in your pocket, any more than having a Windows Mobile smart phone is like having a PC in your pocket. Smart phones are handy devices, to be sure, but they are not portable general purpose computers (ie: a Mac/PC laptop/desktop).

[Wade]

Well, yes I'm aware of all the factors that you state. I'm just wondering to what degree of the operating system the iPhone will be utilizing. Certainly the Apple store associate is aware of these factors also. I believe that he was generalizing. I did not ask him to elaborate with details.

He basically said that currently the known information about the iPhone is that found on the internet. He said that even thoough it is still scheduled to be released in June 2007 Apple has given little to no new information or set date in June to the Apple and AT&T/Cingular stores.

[aegisx]

I'd be surprised if the OSX OS on the iPhone has a Virtual Machine or Emulator on it capable of running SEIV or SEV.

[Wade]

PC games, or some sort of version of them, are heading towards phones. The iPhone would be nice with a huge screen and touch control.

"Sid Meier's Civilization IV Mobile, Sid Meier's Railroad Tycoon Mobile and Sid Meier's Pirates! Mobile are scheduled for release in 2008."

http://www.tmcnet.com/usubmit/2007/05/22/2642466.htm

Civilization IV, Beyond the Sword second expansion will be released in July 2007.

http://www.civilization.com/

[aegisx]

Thats neat, so they are making mobile versions. Civ on a phone, sweet.

[Fyron]

So instead of fixing the glaring memory allocation bug, they waste time on a crappy mobile version of civ4? Oi.

[Desdinova]

by making a mobile version that works wouldnt they be fixing the horrible memory problems? i doubt the iphone has anywhere near the capacity of a pc. then again like it was pointed out its a different os so i guess not.

[Fyron]

There is very little relation between the code base of a PC app and a mobile app.

[Yimboli]

I'd think the brains of a civ4 app could be recompiled to a format executable on a phone very easily, while the graphics engine would need some work.

[aegisx]

DirectX would be a big issue. Also, I'm sure there are a load of support libraries that would have to be altered to compile on a bsd system, as the dll's do not exist there. I don;t think it would be trivial at all, going from Windows to a BSD mobile that is.

[Wade]

Here's some from Microsoft that might be preferable. The "Pocket PC". See the 360 Degree tours and demo. Pretty decent.
Compare them to the iPhone.

$400:
http://business.cingular.com/businesscenter/8525/index.jsp]Link (http://business.cingular.com/businesscenter/8525/index.jsp)

http://www.cingular.com/cell-phone-service/cell-phone-details/?q_sku=sku310005&source=IB640311600144C1]Link (http://www.cingular.com/cell-phone-service/cell-phone-details/?q_sku=sku310005&source=IB640311600144C1)

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsmobile/smartphone/details.mspx?id=3bf04ecb-8390-4b5a-bd72-8f1cb2218298&backUrl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.microsoft.co m%2fwindowsmobile%2fsmartphone%2fdefault.mspx]Link (http://www.microsoft.com/windowsmobile/smartphone/details.mspx?id=3bf04ecb-8390-4b5a-bd72-8f1cb2218298&backUrl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.microsoft.co m%2fwindowsmobile%2fsmartphone%2fdefault.mspx)

$100:
http://www.cingular.com/cell-phone-service/cell-phone-details/?q_list=true&q_phoneName=Cingular+8125+Pocket+PC&q _sku=sku1000007-1]Link (http://www.cingular.com/cell-phone-service/cell-phone-details/?q_list=true&q_phoneName=Cingular+8125+Pocket+PC&q _sku=sku1000007-1)

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsmobile/smartphone/details.mspx?id=d0d1218b3-90bd-449e-b73a-e54845d8e5f9&backUrl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.microsoft.co m%2fwindowsmobile%2fsmartphone%2fdefault.mspx]Link (http://www.microsoft.com/windowsmobile/smartphone/details.mspx?id=d0d1218b3-90bd-449e-b73a-e54845d8e5f9&backUrl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.microsoft.co m%2fwindowsmobile%2fsmartphone%2fdefault.mspx)

[Fyron]

The "brains" include a lot of python code, which is probably going to have to be redone in a faster language runtime to run well on a phone. There is lots of CPU intensive processing that needs to be optimized for the really slow processors of phones. The entire display engine has to be started over from scratch. The C++ core can probably be ported without too much hassle, but I doubt that a phone version of the game exe will resemble the PC version very much at all.

Wade:
Please edit those links to have short display parts; the super long urls break the forum page formatting.

[Wade]

Imperator Fyron said:
Wade:
Please edit those links to have short display parts; the super long urls break the forum page formatting.



Okay. I was wondering about that. How, exactly, do I do that without altering the link command path?

[Fyron]

<font class="small">Code:</font><hr /><pre>display text (http://www.example.com)</pre><hr />

[Wade]

Imperator, (hehe)I'm experimenting with that since you didn't explain.

display text (http://www.example.com)
----------
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsmobile/smartphone/details.mspx?id=d0d1218b3-90bd-449e-b73a-e54845d8e5f9&amp;backUrl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.microsoft.co m%2fwindowsmobile%2fsmartphone%2fdefault.mspx]test (http://www.microsoft.com/windowsmobile/smartphone/details.mspx?id=d0d1218b3-90bd-449e-b73a-e54845d8e5f9&amp;backUrl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.microsoft.co m%2fwindowsmobile%2fsmartphone%2fdefault.mspx)

[Fyron]

You have the URL in there twice...

[aegisx]

its a shame this phone is going to be so expensive (at first anyways). They are going to have to give some good rebates since it will start at $499.

[Fyron]

Thing is, everywhere else in the world has a market for high end phones. The US consumer market is dominated by "free" phones with 2+ year service contracts, so the high end phones often don't even get marketed over here.

[Wade]

I'm waiting...I'm waiting...this is a feeling similiar to what it was like waiting for Space Empires V.

Starting today, June 3 2007, television comercials for the Apple iPhone began and announcements that it will be available June 29 2007.

[Wikipedia Quote]
OS X
Apple has confirmed an optimized, full version of the Mac OS X operating system (without unnecessary components) will run on the iPhone, although differences between the operating system (OS X) running on Macs and the iPhone have not been officially explained.

It is expected to take up considerably less than 500 mb.[27][28][29] It will be capable of supporting as-yet undetermined bundled and future 1st and 3rd-party applications, the latter of which are currently limited to a "controlled environment".[30][28][31]

Apple intends to offer a smooth method for updating the iPhone's operating system, in a similar fashion to the way that Mac OS X and iPods are updated, and touts this as an advantage compared to other cell phones.[27][End Quote]

Look at the photographs of it here in Wikipedia. It's Beautiful.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPhone#_note-pogueFAQ

http://pogue.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/01/11/the-ultimate-iphone-frequently-asked-questions/

[Wade]

I'll bring more links as I find them.

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/videos/the-three-new-apple-iphone-ads-teasing-us-with-the-june-29th-release-date-265519.php

http://technorati.com/videos/tag/iPhone

http://technorati.com/photos/tag/iPhone

[Wade]

http://www.apple.com/iphone/easysetup/rateplans.html

Very nice monthly service payment plans! The lowest is $59.99.

Unlimited Stuff!:
Data (Email/Web)
Visual Voicemail
Nights &amp; Weekends
Rollover® Minutes
Unlimited Mobile to Mobile (Wow!)

"All iPhone service plans include Visual Voicemail and unlimited data — Internet and email — so you only have to decide how many minutes and SMS text messages you need. You’ll select your plan when you activate your iPhone using iTunes on your computer."

[Fyron]

Those look like above average prices to me. Plus its AT&amp;T only...

[aegisx]

Looks cool, just need the price of the phone to come down http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Kamog]

Well, iPhone came out today, right? If you got one, what do you think of it? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/confused.gif

[Spectarofdeath]

You could ask Paris Hilton, I'm sure she and the rest of hollywood all got free ones. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Fyron]

But will they have to pay outrageously pricey monthly rates too? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Atrocities]

The question is, is the Iphone for you? After do consideration I would have to say that I, feel that I do not need an Iphone. Especially when any of the content sent over the Iphone, ie text, pictures, voice, video, etc will belong by definition of the TOS to the Iphone service provider. Much like your IM conversations belong to AOL, MSN, Google, and so on. NO THANK YOU. I will be sticking with what I have.

[Spectarofdeath]

Hell, give me a free one and jack the price up $20 a month for the two year contract and it's still cheaper than having to buy the phone itself.

[Will]

Imperator Fyron said:
Those look like above average prices to me. Plus its AT&amp;T only...


It's not above average for what's being offered. AT&amp;T's regular 450 peak-minute plan is 39.99. Their bundle with 200 text messages and unlimited web access is 19.99. 39.99+19.99 = 59.98... and if you are gonna complain about the iPhone plan being 1 cent more expensive, you got some serious issues.

There isn't any wireless carrier that is offering similar usage (with similar coverage area) for less. So the only real price consideration is the price of the phone itself, which is still expensive for what people are used to for phones in the US (free - $250 or so).


Kamog said:
Well, iPhone came out today, right? If you got one, what do you think of it? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/confused.gif



Well, I didn't buy one because it isn't really practical for me... I work in government, so I am not allowed to carry various things into my office, and the iPhone falls into several of the categories of banned items (cell phone, wireless transmitter, camera, removable storage device). Which sort of makes getting one impractical, since I would hardly ever be able to actually USE it.

However, I do happen to live about a five minute walk away from an Apple store. So I strolled over around 7 last night to check it out. And it is very cool. Smaller than I expected, even knowing its dimensions beforehand. Works pretty much just like you see it in the commercials, there wasn't any doctoring going on there.

It was ridiculously easy to type one-handed with my thumb, and its prediction was pretty decent (I only had to backspace twice in typing around 150-200 or so characters).

The contact list was done very well, better than pretty much any phone I've ever used. You can scroll entry by entry by just dragging your finger down, or there is a column on the right side that has A-Z, and you can scroll directly to those letters by just moving your finger into that area. I already use a Mac, so the synching with Address Book and iCal is a big plus. I'm sure someone will figure out a way to get e.g. Outlook contacts and calendars synched as well. The interface to the calendar is just as nice as the contact list interface. There's also a bunch of other little mini apps that are done well (e.g. weather like in Apple's Dashboard widgets).

I can't comment much on the internet access. Speed was about similar to dialup in the store, but the phone was using the store's Wi-Fi connection instead of the EDGE cell network; and I know that the store's connection is fairly crappy, probably a single 768kbit DSL line. And with 50 or so phones in the store accessing the network, and who knows how many more outside around the store, it's not surprising that the speed was slow.

The other thing I'm not so sure about is battery life. Unlike the iPods 1G-5G, and the Minis, the battery isn't user-replaceable with minimal effort. It's pretty easy to open the iPod cases, but I haven't seen much success in opening the iPhone without substantially deforming the outer casing. Plus, the leads are soldered directly onto the PCB rather than using a small plug, so it requires using a soldering iron to replace the battery. I've also seen that it's a lithium-polymer battery rather than a lithium-ion, which I've heard the polymer variant gets fewer power cycles than the ion.

Anyway, my overall verdict is it's definitely worth it to find a place selling them and at least get a demo of it to see for yourself. It really is very cool.

[Spectarofdeath]

Can't wait till they shrink them down to the size of a micro chip and implant them in our skulls. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

[BlueTemplar]

That would be the iPhone Micro? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

I really wonder about the 3rd part software openness... Symbian S60 has a great community out there.

The iPhone being cool and all that, I don't think I would buy it for more than 50 euros: my phone is already good enough.

EDIT:Interesting... how do you place the "euro" symbol?
I only get &amp;#8364; instead...

[Fyron]

Will said:
It's not above average for what's being offered.


I recall seeing cheaper rates for similar amounts of service in a Sprint store a few weeks ago...

[Will]

Imperator Fyron said:

Will said:
It's not above average for what's being offered.


I recall seeing cheaper rates for similar amounts of service in a Sprint store a few weeks ago...


Sprint also offers 450 peak-minutes for $39.99 a month. But no rollover. And no data access. However, you can add unlimited data bandwidth for $15 more, and 300 text messages for $5 more. which is... $59.99, for a similar amount of service. How much was the iPhone plan again? Oh yeah, $59.99...

[Wade]

I got my iPhone! I'm posting this with it! The Internet on it is real like on a PC. It can be horizontal or vertical. The key board is easy and smart. I'll post more another time.

I'm sure Apple will do software updates also. See the forums of users at apple.com then support tab then read more then see all at bottom.

It's like a device from the future!

-Wade

[BlueTemplar]

It's great if you have Internet for a reasonable price...
I have 10 free Mb per month, after that its 1 euro per Mb. And it was a New Year promotion! Now it doesnt exist anymore, even if you can still pay 6 euros for 10 more Mb, or 20 euros for 60Mb.
So Opera Mini without images is lot better choice for me, and you don't need a big screen for that...

[Fyron]

A device from the future without any compelling new features? (touch screen keyboarding is not a very compelling feature IMO) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif As with the ipod, it looks like another clone device that does just what everything else does, but has some overhyped "simple" interface (big TFT screen only in this case) of dubious value... I'm sure that as with the ipod, its an adequate device, but it probably isn't worth all the hype.

[narf poit chez BOOM]

Atrocities said:
The question is, is the Iphone for you? After do consideration I would have to say that I, feel that I do not need an Iphone. Especially when any of the content sent over the Iphone, ie text, pictures, voice, video, etc will belong by definition of the TOS to the Iphone service provider. Much like your IM conversations belong to AOL, MSN, Google, and so on. NO THANK YOU. I will be sticking with what I have.


There's a good reason to not get one.

[BlueTemplar]

A touch screen keyboarding is certainly not a compelling feature (though I didn't try this one, maybe it's not so bad). But a bigger screen and multi-touch certainly are.

About the intellectual property problem, the question is: what can you do? I think refusing it will just make you extinct, you have to try to change the thing from the inside...

[aegisx]

At least this should force competitors into trying to match/beat it, which should push the tech along.

I'll get one eventually I'm sure, maybe not iPhone though.

[Fyron]

Samsung (IIRC) has a similar large touch screen phone/device, but I forget if its coming out now or soon. They started working on it around the same time that Apple started the iPhone dev, so its definitely not a "copycat."

[Will]

BlueTemplar said:
About the intellectual property problem, the question is: what can you do? I think refusing it will just make you extinct, you have to try to change the thing from the inside...


I'm pretty sure that's more of a legal liability thing from the carrier. If you look into your ISP agreement, it probably has similar language. Same with email providers, forums, etc. Basically it covers them when they "reproduce" your messages, etc. so you can't sue for copyright infringement. The language is purposefully vague to cover many possible transmission modes; so for cell phones, it's transmission from the phone to the tower, and then down normal phone lines to its destination, or converted to digital and sent via IP down a fiber-optic cable, or relayed wirelessly to another tower, or some technology that hasn't been thought up yet, etc.

[Atrocities]

I really don't like Steve Job's. And I laugh that Bill Gates is now number 2. HA HA HA

[aegisx]

Yea, him and his billions are a lot to laugh at http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[PvK]

I still don't want any kind of portable phone nor PDA.

At most, I'd like a lightweight laptop computer with a low pricetag, a long battery life, a good keyboard and a screen that's easily readable outside.

[Caduceus]

I stayed away from a portable phone for as long as I could, but with my job, I need accessibility. I also need a Palm so I don't have to lug textbooks around to peruse at 2 AM. I finally got a Palm Treo, which serves a ton of my needs and puts two devices into one. Now, if I could bundle my pager into that...

[geoschmo]

Caduceus said:
I stayed away from a portable phone for as long as I could, but with my job, I need accessibility. I also need a Palm so I don't have to lug textbooks around to peruse at 2 AM. I finally got a Palm Treo, which serves a ton of my needs and puts two devices into one. Now, if I could bundle my pager into that...

Can't your treo function as a pager? I've never understood why people that have a cell phone also have a pager. Just have people that need to page you call you phone number. I'm pretty sure all cell phone packages these days come with voice mail and most have caller ID. What can you do with a pager that you can't do with a cell phone?

[Caduceus]

geoschmo said:
What can you do with a pager that you can't do with a cell phone?



Not answer it.

[Caduceus]

Sorry, I couldn't resist the one-liner.

The pager allows me to take time to answer a call, so to speak. At 2 AM, I need a moment to focus and collect my thoughts. Not to mention swear a few times when it is the Emergency Room. Again.

And the hospital can page me to a patient's number to bypass having to call them first to get the number I need to call.

[Slick]

Unfortunately there are still lots of ancient *coughgovernmentcough* systems in use that only work with similarly ancient pagers.

Also, newer phones have features that are prohibited in certain sensitive areas - cameras, data storage, etc. Pagers are dumb enough to be allowed just about anywhere.

Deevolution at its finest.

[geoschmo]

Caduceus said:

geoschmo said:
What can you do with a pager that you can't do with a cell phone?



Not answer it.

I screen calls all the time with my cell phone. If it's a number I don't recognize, or if it's someone I don't want to talk to right them I let it go to voice mail and it doesn't use my air time. And even if they don't leave a message I know who called.

[Caduceus]

And I can turn the phone off between pages so an irate patient can't call me back at any hour of the day or night.

[geoschmo]

Caduceus said:
And the hospital can page me to a patient's number to bypass having to call them first to get the number I need to call.


Ok, this makes a little sense. They could leave the number as a voice mail, although yo ustill have the extra step of checking yoru voice mail to get the number.

I would be very suprised if there aren't services available out there that would address this though. It would be a simple matter to have a separate phone number that from the callers perspective was like a pager, let them punch in a number which would then come through to your cell phone as a text message. I can't say I've seen such a service, but I've never had the need for it so I've not looked. It would be a simple matter to set something like that up though.



Slick said:
Unfortunately there are still lots of ancient *coughgovernmentcough* systems in use that only work with similarly ancient pagers.

Also, newer phones have features that are prohibited in certain sensitive areas - cameras, data storage, etc. Pagers are dumb enough to be allowed just about anywhere.


What systems do you mean?

I've heard of the secutiry issues. The Federal building in my town has a rule like that, for what sense it makes. If that's an issue you ought to be able to get one that doesn't have those features though.

[geoschmo]

A quick Google search shows I'm not the first one to consider this.

Using your cell phone as a pager (http://www.howardforums.com/archive/topic/610296-1.html)

The issue about reception inside buildings is one I hadn't considered, althogh my cell service is pretty good so I don't have a problem with it. With some carriers it's probably more of an issue.

[marhawkman]

BTW... do these thing actually work yet?

[Slick]

geoschmo said:
What systems do you mean?




Let's just say that there are ancient communications systems still in use because they still work acceptably well and would cost big $$$ to upgrade. The cost isn't mainly associated with hardware and software, but rather in changing complex processes &amp; procedures, retraining personnel, testing reliability and interfacing with other ancient systems, etc. "Red Tape" stuff. It ain't broke enough yet to fix it, unfortunately.