SEV: Using custom races on PBW

[geoschmo]

As we know there's a bit of a problem with using custom races on PBW for SEV because SEV doesn't handle missing files as smoothly as SE4 did. It will process the turn, but when the players open their next turns they find their pics have changed permanently in the game.

Custom shipsets are an area with SE5 I've not really played with much, so I don't have a good handle on exactly what is involved. I see pics in a couple different folders. My hope was that if I waited a while Malfador would patch the problem and I wouldn't have to start adding these custom pics to the server. I think it's time to start investigating alternatives.

Can someone explain the process in simple terms as to where the various pics have to be located? And do I have to copy them to all the mod game type folders as well, or will the game find them in the stock folders?

And do we have a thread started somewhere that lists all the available custom SEV shipsets? If not I guess we can start that here. If it's not too complicated a process I'll start putting them on the server so people can use them.

Geoschmo

[Romulus68]

I copied the custom race folders to the Stock empires folder and it recognizes the race pictures. I'm playing the SE5 1.33 BM1.05 PBW game and it works fine.

[Captain Kwok]

I believe the key is just having the race's text files (especially the slot layouts) available for the mod's Empires folder.

[geoschmo]

Captain Kwok said:
I believe the key is just having the race's text files (especially the slot layouts) available for the mod's Empires folder.

The key to what? Are you saying I won't have to have the custom images as long as I have the text files?

[Captain Kwok]

I think so. When adding a custom race to the Balance Mod, I had no problems with the game displaying the images from the custom race's default install in the stock Empires folder. But the text files should be on hand in the Mod's empires folder under the custom set's name - all of them for a PBW game with AI generated players. But the most important text files for player controlled empires I believe are [Empire]_AI_Main.txt and [Empire]_InvConfiguration_Slots.txt.

[geoschmo]

Ok, I think you aren't saying I don't need the custom images, only that I don't need them in the mod folder. Only the custom text files need to be in the mod folder. I still need the custom images, but the game can find them fine in the stock folders. Is that what you mean?

Geoschmo

[Captain Kwok]

Yes, that's what I was trying to say. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

Although I don't think you need the images at all on the server since the game's graphics are never displayed - but if there's a way you can test or confirm this that would be good. As long as the players in the game have the custom race installed in their stock folder or mod folder, the image references should be intact and the correct images displayed in game.

[Romulus68]

geoschmo said:
Ok, I think you aren't saying I don't need the custom images, only that I don't need them in the mod folder. Only the custom text files need to be in the mod folder. I still need the custom images, but the game can find them fine in the stock folders. Is that what you mean?

Geoschmo



I said that 5 posts ago! lol http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[geoschmo]

Captain Kwok said:
Although I don't think you need the images at all on the server since the game's graphics are never displayed - but if there's a way you can test or confirm this that would be good. As long as the players in the game have the custom race installed in their stock folder or mod folder, the image references should be intact and the correct images displayed in game.

Isn't this the whole crux of the problem people are having? I don't have the images on the server now, and we are having issues with people using custom races. If the image references stayed intact we wouldn't be having an issue or this discussion.

There definetly is a problem. I guess I don't know what exactly the cause is. I thought it had been pretty well defined though.

Geoschmo

[geoschmo]

Romulus68 said:

geoschmo said:
Ok, I think you aren't saying I don't need the custom images, only that I don't need them in the mod folder. Only the custom text files need to be in the mod folder. I still need the custom images, but the game can find them fine in the stock folders. Is that what you mean?

Geoschmo



I said that 5 posts ago! lol http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

Yes, I know you did. But Kwok seemed to be contradicting you and I was getting confused. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

[Romulus68]

Would it hurt to put the Race files in the mod and stock folders? Worth a try.

[Fyron]

geoschmo said:
"I don't have the images on the server now, and we are having issues with people using custom races."

You don't have the images, but do you have the .txt and .csf files for the custom shipsets installed?

[se5a]

Captain Kwok said:
Yes, that's what I was trying to say. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif

Although I don't think you need the images at all on the server since the game's graphics are never displayed - but if there's a way you can test or confirm this that would be good. As long as the players in the game have the custom race installed in their stock folder or mod folder, the image references should be intact and the correct images displayed in game.




NONONO!!! This is what we've been *****ing about since day one of beta! get with it kwok! - didn't I explain what happens in the BM thread?

and for the record, I've tested this exstencivly.

[se5a]

ok, you might get away with not having the textures, as long as you have the models...

shipsets have the
3d model
this is a .txt file with a .X extension
the texure for the above
this is a .bmp it is called from the .x file
it has flags
which are .bmp
and portrates
these are .jpgs which are an image of the renderd ship 'photos' if you like of the ship.
there's also AI, names and other files.

you may get away without having the textures... but I doubt it SEV will probibly give errors, not sure on this.
you may get away with removing the portrates, might have a little more luck there.
removing the flags will result in the server slecting at random annother flag - permanantly.

but removing all this stuff is going to be more trouble than it's worth just to save a bit of hard disk space.

[Captain Kwok]

Look at it this way:

The Balance Mod has folders for all the stock races with a few of the .txt files and no other images besides the small flags. The PBW server runs Balance Mod games using the stock races just fine right? So, any custom set should work just fine if they are setup in the same fashion...

Now, does the server need the custom ship images in order to run correctly? Perhaps. If there's a flag in the code that is set to TRUE when the images are found, it might mean if it returned FALSE (no images found) it would make the game pick a new set to display for that race... we should check that out as this might also be true for the first .gam file generated by the host in a PBW game as well. If it works along those lines, then the custom sets should just need their images on the server (or hosts' install) in the stock empires folder.

[se5a]

Kwok you're confusing things by talking about what goes into the mod folders when geo is talking about what gets installed in the default stock empires dir. (or at least not being entirely clear which you're talking about)

if it's in the stock empires dir then yes, the mod only needs a few of the .txt files, because it can use the models from the default stock empires dir

Geo, There's also a flag in the mod definition.txt that if set to TRUE on the first turn will allow a mod to use the shipsets in the default stock folder. however since the first turn is not run on PBW it doesn't help you a huge amount unless the guy running the first turn knows to switch it.


and for the record kwok - I apolagize if my post was a little... harsh. I tend to overeact when I feel people have ignored what I've said. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/redface.gif

[geoschmo]

I'm not too concerned about the harddrive space issue. We've got space, and if we run out I can add another harddrive. I'm thinking about doing that anyway just for the SE5 stuff.

What I'm trying to do is establish what exactly the process is that I need to go through to put a custom shipset on the PBW server. It sounds like I'm going to be dealing with putting different files in different folders, not even taking into consideration if it's needed for a mod.

Fortunatly to this point we aren't talking about too many mods, but we are starting to get a few custom races. I'm looking forward to the day when we have dozens of mods and hundreds of custom races like SE4 does and I'm not real happy about having to go through a confusing and tedious manual process for every new custom race.

But until we can convince Malfador that it's an issue that needs fixed, I need to do something about all the games that are breaking because of the custom races. So what I need to know is where the files all go. So if someone could explain that I'd appreciate it.

Geoschmo

[Baron Grazic]

Next PBW game I play I'm sticking with a default race.
Hopefully Aaron will listen and make the change with the next patch.
Thanks for all the hard work you guys are putting in.

[Captain Kwok]

Geo,

If the mod has an Empires folder, I'd add a folder for each custom set with at least the set's inventory layout file and its [Empire]_AI_Main.txt file. It might be a good idea to edit the two entries that point to script files to use the default ones.

ie:

From:
AI Script File := [Race Name]\[Race Name]_Main_Script.csf
AI Script Empire Setup File := [Race Name]\[Race Name]_Setup_Script.csf

To:
AI Script File := Default\Default_Main_Script.csf
AI Script Empire Setup File := Default\Default_Setup_Script.csf

[se5a]

if you want to convince aaron that it's a problem then you need to get everyone to email him about it. the thing is that it's a big code change to fix it properly. which is why he's stalling.

[se5a]

What the mod devs need to do is make sure they have these races (the needed files) in the mod empires folder.

that way PBW only needs to worry about having the shipsets installed in the stock defult empires folder.

[arthurtuxedo]

So are custom ship sets working now? I'm planning on launching a game this coming week, and would like to know which ship sets are installed in the SE5 and mod folders.

[arthurtuxedo]

Answered my own question with a test game. It doesn't work with the Romulan flag and shipset. Since there are so few ship sets out and mods out, why not just install them all on PBW?

Anyway, does anyone have a time frame for when it will be working? If not by next week when the new patch comes out, then we'll have to use stock ship sets instead, much as it pains me.