finalizing new mod...

[trooper]

I'm finishing my new race mod...

As usual, I have some very stupid questions :

1) Culture, Demeanor : do they have an impact on the game ? must I choose one of those listed or could I create another one ?

2) characteristics and traits : is there a norm for giving race points ? I mean, does a rule limits the characteristics and adv traits allocated to a race, in order to have a "balanced" game ?

3) mini icons : to have transparent ship images, the background should be black (RGB 000)?

4) starting research levels : Can I create a race with a specific research field developed ? (like armor I)

5) AI_Research.txt file : is this file often modified, or is it generally standard for AI races ?


http://diesel2035.free.fr/pexlerr.jpg

thanks...

[Suicide Junkie]

1) Culture settings have bonuses and/or penalties to such things as space combat, maintenance rate, and happiness. Load SE4, and "add new empire" to see the details.
1b) Demeanor, I believe is just a descriptive thing, but I don't know if SE4 will complain if you enter a new one.

2) You are editing AI_general.txt? There are three sets of entries in there, the first is for 2000 point games, the second for 3000 point games, and the Last for 5000 point games.
See SE4's "Add new empire" to make sure the items you choose will add up to exactly that price.

3) Right. There is a viewer, possibly on the CD, that will display the whole shipset, and has a toggle to change the transparent parts from black to hot pink and back, so you can be sure it looks right.

4) No. All races start with the techs defined by techareas.txt. The specific techs given also depend on whether the game is a low, medium, or high tech start.

5) That file is critical. For example: If your shipdesigns.txt call for ships with Antimatter Torpedoes, you darn well better research that tech area early! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[Jmenschenfresser]

Well technically you could make a race have a specific field developed, if you made a duplicate of that field and it's tech and made it racial.

Yes, that race would have a duplicate, say, armor field, but AI or human behind the wheel, either way, it doesn't really matter.

Merely a visual annoyance.

[Suicide Junkie]

But that would require editing the data files, and making it incompatible with everything else out there.

This is just a new race & AI, not a data mod, right?

[Jmenschenfresser]

Dunno...he mentioned creating a new culture or demeanor. Don't think that is doable at runtime.

[Captain Kwok]

I like the look of your ships. Are they hand drawn and scanned?

[PvK]

Originally posted by Suicide Junkie:
...
2) You are editing AI_general.txt? There are three sets of entries in there, the first is for 2000 point games, the second for 3000 point games, and the Last for 5000 point games.
See SE4's "Add new empire" to make sure the items you choose will add up to exactly that price.
...<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Whoa! Really? I always thought the specific set was randomly selected, to give variety each time the empire was generated!

PvK

[trooper]

so, if I make a summary :

- no exotic culture and demeanor, or it won't work on another PC.

- 3 levels for the race abilities (I was wondering what was opt1, 2 and 3. Now I know!)

- I'll have a look on the icons with the viewer. BTW, I saw that some of the mini icons designed for the game was not totally transparent (black spots on the screen)

- Impossible to start with a specific research field for a compatible race & AI . But it's possible to design heavely armored ships by editing the AI DESIGN TYPES file ? (what are "spaces per one" values ???)

- AI_Research.txt : not understand clearly what was its purpose. Is there a generic file for that , that I can use ?

Kwok : My ships are hand drawn, scanned and colorized with photoshop. I tried to create various designs for each ship size, not simply a main body and add-ons.

[trooper]

By the way, how can I play with my new race (or have it played by an IA). I added the race directory, but it doesn't appear in the "Add existing" race list ?

[TerranC]

to have your race shown in the add empires thingy you need to make an emp file

It's easy. Just make a race with your race pics, set all the things *down to the description and history* and save the empire after you are finished.

One word of note: if you want your race to perform at all race point settings, you will need to make 3: 1 for 2000, 1 for 3000, and 1 for 5000.

Edit: remember to save your race file(s) in the Empires Folder.

[ October 07, 2002, 22:46: Message edited by: TerranC ]

[Rollo]

you need to create empire files (.emp)

[TerranC]

nah nah nah nah nah...
I got here first http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

[Jmenschenfresser]

-Yes, you can make new culture and demeanor, and even as I mentioned earlier, races with specific tech on start up, but as SJ mentioned you have to mod some files in the data folder. It's no biggie if you are just going to use the race in your own games, but if you distribute the race you'll have to distribute the changed data files as well.

-the research file for the AI is the order the AI researches tech. The numbers (25, 33, 50, 100) correspond to how many other research projects will be allowed to run along side that one. As SJ mentioned if you modded your attack ships to use, say, meson bLasters, you have to make sure Pysics 1 is researched and then the tech for Meson bLasters. There is no generic, unless you design ships to fit the so-called generic research file. It's a difficult process to do this file. I've tried a few times. Just ask yourself how you want the AI to go through the techs. Hope that helps.

[Phoenix-D]

Impossible to start with a specific research field for a compatible race & AI . But it's possible to design heavely armored ships by editing the AI DESIGN TYPES file ? (what are "spaces per one" values ???)"

Well, you CAN add racial traits. Otherwise you just have to tell it to research something. The "spaces per one" defines how MANY get put on the ship (so your heavily armored ship). Basiclly, the lower the number of more of that you end up with on the ship.

Phoenix-D

[Suicide Junkie]

Re: Spaces per one.

If you have a spaces per one value of, say 40, and the hull size happens to be 400 (light cruiser), the AI will put 10 of those components on.

The reason why you don't specify "add exactly 10 of this item" is because the design patter will fit more than one hull size (minimum tonnage up to Maximum tonnage), and this will scale the number to match the latest tech hull.

[oleg]

Originally posted by PvK:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Suicide Junkie:
...
2) You are editing AI_general.txt? There are three sets of entries in there, the first is for 2000 point games, the second for 3000 point games, and the Last for 5000 point games.
See SE4's "Add new empire" to make sure the items you choose will add up to exactly that price.
...<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Whoa! Really? I always thought the specific set was randomly selected, to give variety each time the empire was generated!

PvK</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Aaahhhh !!! That's why you made such bizzare AI_general files for Proportions AI ! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif
And I thought you were smoking something... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[trooper]

mmmm... when I create an new race, a .emp file is created. But all the provided infos (description, demeanor...) are written in this file, not in a .txt file in the pictures/race directory like default game races ?

And also :

default races have 2000 race points. how can I create 3000 and 5000^points races ?

[Ragnarok]

"mmmm... when I create an new race, a .emp file is created. But all the provided infos (description, demeanor...) are written in this file, not in a .txt file in the pictures/race directory like default game races ?"
That is correct.

"And also :

default races have 2000 race points. how can I create 3000 and 5000^points races?"

To do this, go to "Player Settings" when you're starting a new game. (This screen has how many starting planets ans such on it) Then on the bottom box it says; "Racial points for new players." The default is "Low (2000)" just change that to Medium (3000) or High (5000). That should do it. Hope it helps.

[trooper]

So what's the use of AI_General.txt files ?

[oleg]

Originally posted by trooper:
So what's the use of AI_General.txt files ?<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">It is used when race is added as random choice. EMP. file worksd only when you add empire manualy.

[trooper]

and is there a way to generate the general.txt file in rder to have it cmpatible with the .emp ?

[Andrés]

General file is used when the race is selected randomly as an AI race.

AI files are not normally needed to play the race, only by AI (and ministers).

To start, for the first release, my suggestion is to copy all AI files from any other race that uses technologies appropriate for your race, and edit the descriptions in AI_general, and make .emp files, and perhaps a custom design names file.

Then you can then edit and refine Research, Design (the most defining ones) and the other files to make it more unique (for example you can’t make them start with armor, but you can make them research and start using it very early), but that is not as easy as it seems and takes a long time of editing and playtest to get it right. I have made several races and consider myself somehow an expert in that matter, however I’m still a relative newbie when it comes to AI.

[Andrés]

You can make the Generic file first, start a game using another race (repeat this step until your race is selected as an AI race), change to players to play with your race and save the empire.
However it’s sometimes easier to just copy the data and descriptions between the .EMPs and the AI_General and for example get the right values for your racial characteristics.

IMHO we’re using .Emp files to cover an important missing function in the game, that is the “add default data from this race general file”
Empire files should only be used to save starting options for your race, and setting up multiplayer games.

[capnq]

There are "generic" Versions of all the AI files in the Ai folder; they're all named Default_AI_&ltsomething&gt.txt

Another time that the AI files are used is in multiplayer games like on PBW. If you miss a turn deadline, the AI ministers take over for that turn.

There's a setting in (F11) Empire Status/Empire Options that's supposed to "turn off" the ministers in simultaneous games, but it doesn't work very well. It inspired Geo's "No AI" mod on PBW, which does a better job on that.

[Andrés]

But your custom AI files will only be used in multiplayer games if the host has them installed, something that does not normally happen in PBW.

[oleg]

Originally posted by trooper:
and is there a way to generate the general.txt file in rder to have it cmpatible with the .emp ?<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Well, I usualy edit general.txt file first, then start SEIV with some default race and max. number of random AI -restart till you get lucky and the race you are modding is selected, convert the race to my control and save EMP file ! No conflicts between emp file and AI_general file !

[trooper]

Originally posted by oleg:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by trooper:
and is there a way to generate the general.txt file in rder to have it cmpatible with the .emp ?<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Well, I usualy edit general.txt file first, then start SEIV with some default race and max. number of random AI -restart till you get lucky and the race you are modding is selected, convert the race to my control and save EMP file ! No conflicts between emp file and AI_general file !</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">How can you convert an AI race to your control ???

[oleg]

Originally posted by trooper:

How can you convert an AI race to your control ???

[/QB]<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Go to the left game menu, one that has "save game", "load game", etc. Click on "players". It will show you the list of all races in a current game. AI controled colored green. Click on one and will convert to your control. Click on "end turn" and you will get a former Ai race to yourself.

[trooper]

Originally posted by oleg:
Well, I usualy edit general.txt file first, then start SEIV with some default race and max. number of random AI -restart till you get lucky and the race you are modding is selected, convert the race to my control and save EMP file ! No conflicts between emp file and AI_general file !<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">To test new IA strategy files, the good method is to chose the race and let all the ministers active to do the job... it has the same effects as seeing the race played by IA player ?

[oleg]

Originally posted by trooper:
To test new IA strategy files, the good method is to chose the race and let all the ministers active to do the job... it has the same effects as seeing the race played by IA player ?<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Basically yes. There might be some discrepancy how AI proceeds with grouping ships for attack (just my observations) but research, designs, ship building, colonization, etc. are absolutely identical either it is formal AI player or it is "your" race with all ministers on.

[ October 11, 2002, 01:32: Message edited by: oleg ]