Gryphin Mod v.3 - Troop Question

[Gryphin]

That escort is still there.
What did I do now?
My first mod.
Any Ideas?

[ June 21, 2003, 19:01: Message edited by: Gryphin ]

[Krsqk]

Is this tactical or strategic combat? If tactical, check the total hit points for any unexpected funniness (funnyness?) and check each component for damage resistance (maybe you have typos with an extra zero or two on some component). Is your escort damaged, and how much?

IS IT FUNNYNESS OR FUNNINESS??? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/confused.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

[Gryphin]

Stratigic,
I belive all I did was add wepons and armor and more sizes of storage.
I must have done something else.

[Krsqk]

No "Phased Shield Generation - 60000" as a hull ability? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

[Gryphin]

Krsqk
You are almost right.
I just did a Simulation
My ships are knocking out every thing except the Supply Bays. Further. Once everything else is gone, they can't hit the ship. I ran 5 LCs with 4 Anti Matter Torps III each.
Once there was only a supply bay left, they could not hit the ship.

What should I be looking for in my components file?

[Ragnarok]

Originally posted by Krsqk:


IS IT FUNNYNESS OR FUNNINESS??? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/confused.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">If I am not mistaken it is Funniness. Although it looks... Well... Funny...
Dictionary.com says it's Funniness as well.. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

[Krsqk]

Look at the Tonnage Structure entry, for starters. It may have extra zeros.

One other thing. Did you do anything funny with Offense To-Hit Plus and Defense To-Hit Plus in your hull sizes (vehiclesizes.txt) and components? Maybe a component with a high negative to defense is being destroyed, leaving a very good defensive chance. Just guesses, since I can't see your files or savegame.

[edit: sticky stuff on the backspace key again]

[ December 13, 2002, 04:10: Message edited by: Krsqk ]

[Gryphin]

Krsqk
I'm using Daves mod utility.
It is a Rage Escort with:
Bridge, Crew, Life, 6 Engines, 1 Cap Ship Missle I, 1 Supply I.
It has to be something I entered wrong. I can fix it by copying over the entire supplys storage area. Does anybody want to look and see what could give this supply bay,
100 Percent defence?

[Krsqk]

I'm willing to take a look. Post your components file. Or, zip your datafiles and a savegame, and I'll load it up to see if there's any weirdness.

[Gryphin]

Krsqk,
I'll do that. I want to try a few things first.
I'm going to put a "standard" components.txt in its place. I will then copy and paste each component group I changed 1 group at a time.
It is really strange.
Ships without the supply bay die. Ships with it, cannot be hit once all other components are gone.

[Gryphin]

Here is the file:
http://www.windingstream.com/se/gryphin_components.htm

[Krsqk]

I think I found the problem:

Name := Supply Storage I 10kT
Description := Area on a starship to store supplies.
Pic Num := 117
Tonnage Space Taken := 10
Tonnage Structure := 0
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Since it has the smallest tonnage structure, it's very likely to be hit Last. In fact, depending on how the combat system works, it probably have a 0% chance of being hit! Then, your ship has 100% damage (by numbers), but still has components left! The weapon hits the ship, checks for components to damage/destroy, and can't find any with a chance to be hit.

BTW, your descriptions and ability numbers on your smaller-sized cargo and supply components don't match. Just noticed while scrolling through.

Hope this fixes the problem!

[Gryphin]

Thanks Krsqk
I changed them all. It apears to have worked.
Um, let me get this straight,
From the Description of
Tonnage Structure:
"The number of points of damage this component can withstand before being destroyed."
If the number is "0", it can't be hit because of a quirk in the combat algorythm?

[ December 15, 2002, 11:59: Message edited by: Gryphin ]

[Wanderer]

Originally posted by Gryphin:

If the number is "0", it can't be hit because of a quirk in the combat algorythm?<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Yup! Now HMS Invincible really can be invincible (and would make an excellent minesweeper http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif )

More formally, if you have three surviving components with tonnage structure values of x, y and z, the chance of component x being hit first by a shot is:

x
P(x) = ------
x+y+z

So if x=0, P(x) (the chance of hitting x) is also 0.

[Krsqk]

Glad it worked. It's always nice when I spout and it comes true. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

I guess there's an error-handling routine in the combat subroutine, though, since 0/0 would definitely cause an error.

[Gryphin]

Ok, next,
I would utimately like to have:
TDM in d:\SEIV
ImagePack in the default pictures directory
Fyrons Quadrant Mod in the default location
Am I dreaming or is this possible?

[Fyron]

What do you mean by FQM in the default location?

Assuming that D is a second hard drive, then yes, it is possible. The Image Mod should be installed in the default pictures folder anyways. It doesn't alter any default images, only adds more.

[Gryphin]

Yes, Drive D is the second partition.
I would like to be able to start up SEIV
Be able to generate a map
Load TDM Races
Have a few of the data files modifyed to my taste.
Currently I load FQM
Generate a Map
Exit and load TDM
When installing new ship sets or races I have to make sure they go where they should.
I would like one set of folders.

[President_Elect_Shang]

About the 0 structure comment by krsqk. I found the same problem as I was working on my Personal Mod. I am attempting to create true XO racks and after some work I came to find that a Space Taken of zero and a structure of one with the armor ability does the job like a champ. I am so happy with the way it works and the AI has no problem obaying the guidelines that I have set up for its proper use. This does of coarse mean that if I ever finish and pass my mod out a player could cheat like heck by not following the on screen instructions in the component description but lets face it. Which one of use needs to cheat when given two minutes or less we could create a component called the "Doomsday Gun" that does a bazillion damage or some such insane amount to win the game? Anyway sorry I drifted off but the point is I hope this helps with whatever the component is your are attempting to create.

[Gryphin]

President Elect Shang , All coments are always welcome. In terms of helping. Krsqk did find the issue. Your informaiton gives a heads up to other issues. Topic drift works for me.
what is 'XO"?

[ December 16, 2002, 11:37: Message edited by: Gryphin ]

[President_Elect_Shang]

Originally posted by Gryphin:
President Elect Shang , All coments are always welcome. In terms of helping. Krsqk did find the issue. Your informaiton gives a heads up to other issues. Topic drift works for me.
what is 'XO"?<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Geez now I feel bad, I have a really bad habit of thinking everyone knows just what I am saying. I would suppose that it stems from ten years of having the same women finish my sentences. XO is External Ordinance Rack. In my Mod it holds missiles that can only be fired once per combat (reload 30).

[Puke]

you know women that talk about external ordinance racks?

[President_Elect_Shang]

Originally posted by Puke:
you know women that talk about external ordinance racks?<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">My wife does not have a choice! She must listen to my madness about the computer games I play if she wants me to play her board games. It is a nice trade off. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

[Gryphin]

mlmbd,
Thanks for the bump. yes, I will send the latest Gryphin mod post haste.

[PvK]

Why not use the "X of these components allowed per ship" restriction?

PvK

Originally posted by President Elect Shang:
About the 0 structure comment by krsqk. I found the same problem as I was working on my Personal Mod. I am attempting to create true XO racks and after some work I came to find that a Space Taken of zero and a structure of one with the armor ability does the job like a champ. I am so happy with the way it works and the AI has no problem obaying the guidelines that I have set up for its proper use. This does of coarse mean that if I ever finish and pass my mod out a player could cheat like heck by not following the on screen instructions in the component description but lets face it. Which one of use needs to cheat when given two minutes or less we could create a component called the "Doomsday Gun" that does a bazillion damage or some such insane amount to win the game? Anyway sorry I drifted off but the point is I hope this helps with whatever the component is your are attempting to create.<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">

[mlmbd]

*BUMP*

Gryphin, are we about ready to start testing?? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

<font color=purple>mlmbd http://www.shrapnelgames.com//ubb/icons/icon6.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif </font>

[dogscoff]

you know women that talk about external ordinance racks?
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">
My wife does not have a choice!
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">"Hey baby, that's one hell of a nice external ordinance rack you got there."

*Slap!*

[mlmbd]

Gryphin, excellent. I can hardly wait. I have lots of time opening up.

<font color=purple>mlmbd http://www.shrapnelgames.com//ubb/icons/icon6.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif </font>

[Gryphin]

mlmbd,
Ok, I promise here in front of everybody to email a game turn tonight.
< now I've done it >

[tesco samoa]

Gryphin... since i know you read this thread....

That map for Rifts 1....

Fantastic.... I have seen a little bit of it.... Very good....

[mlmbd]

I am stoked! I am, am, am.........stoked! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

<font color=purple>mlmbd http://www.shrapnelgames.com//ubb/icons/icon6.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif </font>

[Gryphin]

tesco samoa
You are most welcome. Anytime you need a map, please let me know. If I can I will.

mlmbd. Got the Last emp file this morn. I'll be sending the first game file before 7 your time.

[mlmbd]

Thanks, I am doing my turn as we speak/type.

<font color=purple>mlmbd http://www.shrapnelgames.com//ubb/icons/icon6.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif </font>

[Gryphin]

5 Humans, 3 TDM, 5 Neutrals
FQM Small Dence Threaded Spiral Paradice
Gryphin Mod
Bunch of components including Repair Pod Sattelite, Long Range Low Intensity PDC, Short Range High Intensity PDC, Incremental Sizes of Armor and Cargo Bays. A Scout Hull that can hold 8 engins by gentmans agreement cannot carry weapons. It can use "Steath Plating". No other ship can , (unless run by the AI)
5000 Racial Points

Learning Game - Anyone can Login as anyone and see how they are doing what they are doing. Questions are asked and suggestions given. If there is war it will be by mutual agreement to work on testing various weapons and strategies.
This is a "Non Zero Sum" Game.

[ February 21, 2003, 12:24: Message edited by: Gryphin ]

[mlmbd]

Gryphin, I think that there should be more systems. I think that we are all going to get into it, very shortly. Just no room to expand. I have over 20 colony ships looking for homes!

Or maybe only 1 or 3 starting planets! Or both more systems and 1 or 3 starting planets.

<font color=purple>mlmbd http://www.shrapnelgames.com//ubb/icons/icon6.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif </font>

[ February 22, 2003, 15:49: Message edited by: mlmbd ]

[Gryphin]

mlmbd
That was the intent. Small quad lots of players. This will cause potential conflict early. Since conflict is by mutual concent it does not need to occure. We will start a new game with a new map and number of AI when every one is is ready.

Current Stats are here:
http://www.windingstream.com/se/gryphin1astats.htm

[ February 22, 2003, 20:14: Message edited by: Gryphin ]

[mlmbd]

Gryphin, since it was your intent. Forget I mentioned it. It is your mod we are play testing. I will just have to look harder for homes for my people! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

<font color=purple>mlmbd http://www.shrapnelgames.com//ubb/icons/icon6.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif </font>

[Gryphin]

"I will just have to look harder for homes for my people"
You mean my future workers? < The Gryphin Gryns >
You can trust I'll give them good homes. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

[ February 23, 2003, 16:54: Message edited by: Gryphin ]

[mlmbd]

Gryphin; Oh, good! Then I won't need to spend my time building facilities. Since, you will be suppling them for my invading forces! Thanks! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

<font color=purple>mlmbd http://www.shrapnelgames.com//ubb/icons/icon6.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif </font>

[ February 24, 2003, 13:44: Message edited by: mlmbd ]

[Gryphin]

You think you have what it takes to take what I have?
If you do successfully invade and capture my planets I will consider it a major success for me. It always pleases me when one of my students gets the better of me. < The Gryphin Gryns >

[mlmbd]

Gryphin; You think you have what it takes to take what I have? <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I don't think. I KNOW, I have what it takes! I am a bit distressed about making you so 'Happy'. But, I will live with it. To bad I can not say the same for you, 'teach'!

On second though, I will let you live. I will keep you caged, for posterity!

<font color=purple>mlmbd http://www.shrapnelgames.com//ubb/icons/icon6.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif </font>

[ February 25, 2003, 16:30: Message edited by: mlmbd ]

[Gryphin]

mlmbd, um, what do you want with my posterior?

Incident
An unarmed scout ship caught in th middle of a Rage system sussessfuly caused two Rage destroyers to be damaged without ramming them. The scout was destroyed but the captian of the ship died with a satisfied smile.

[ February 26, 2003, 11:21: Message edited by: Gryphin ]

[mlmbd]

mlmbd, um, what do you want with my posterior? <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I didn't say 'posterior'. I said 'posterity'. But, I will keep your posterior for posterity.

I have not had the pleasure of running into the Rag, yet! My compliaments, to your deceased Capt. and crew!

<font color=purple>mlmbd http://www.shrapnelgames.com//ubb/icons/icon6.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif </font>

[Gryphin]

Don't you want to know how the ships were damaged without using wepaons or ramming?

[gregebowman]

Not that I'll be able to download it for awhile until I get a new computer (my computer got zapped by lightning Sat. night), but where can I find this mod?

[Gryphin]

gregebowman
It is currently in play test. Looks sorta like this:
Battle Bridge - Aux Con that includes extra sensors that gives the ship +15 percent to hit and to dodge. Very Expensive
Tech Required – Sensors III and Combat Support III

Satellite Repair Bay Repair Pod – SJ’s idea. Reasonably priced
Cargo Bays – 10kT and 5kT to fill in the left over space
Supply Bays - 10kT and 5kT to fill in the left over space
Normal Armor – 10kT and 5kT to fill in the left over space
Cargo, Supply and Armor scaled proportionally in cost and rounded up a small amount. Appropriate techs required.

Point Defence Canon – Long Range Low Intensity
Range - 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10
Damage 30 30 30 20 15 15 10 5 5 5

Requires PDC V
Same size and cost as PDC V

Rocket Pods – Short range high damage. Can only Fighter, Sat, Seeker, Drone. I see them as a Last line of defence against incoming Fighter Squadrons. Range 2 – Damage – 200 – Rate of fire – 2. Is mounted as armor to put it outside the ship where I envision rockets. I may delete these because some TDM AI put as many as 4 of these on a LC.

Armored Solar Sail – In my mind it is on the outside of the ship and should be destroyed before the internals. I’m toying with the idea of giving it ECM ability on the concept that it would throw off tracking. On the other hand I’m considering the opposite because it makes the ship easier to track. Who knows, maybe I got the idea from the asteroids in FQM.

Scout Class ship that can take 8 engines. Gentleman’s Treaty that it will not carry weapons, (the AI has not signed this treaty)

Am working on a Unit Launch Bay that will launch 1 bouy, (very small sat with no weapons), per turn. I would like to put these on my scouts and drop a “marker” off in the systems it passes through.

Currently mlmbd, Pooh Star, and some other friends are play testing this in a Non Zero Sum Game. PBEM

Feed back welcome on all of this.

[ February 26, 2003, 23:21: Message edited by: Gryphin ]

[mlmbd]

Gryphin, Don't you want to know how the ships were damaged without using wepaons or ramming? <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Not particularly! But, if you feel the need. OK!

<font color=purple>mlmbd http://www.shrapnelgames.com//ubb/icons/icon6.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif </font>

[ February 27, 2003, 15:31: Message edited by: mlmbd ]

[Gryphin]

Could not run or hide
Death was Inevitable
Damaging Space Rocks

[gregebowman]

Originally posted by Gryphin:
gregebowman
It is currently in play test.
Currently mlmbd, Pooh Star, and some other friends are play testing this in a Non Zero Sum Game. PBEM

Feed back welcome on all of this.<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Thanks for letting me know. I don't have the time to do PBEM on a regular basis, so I'll have to pass on that. But as long as you make it so that a solo game can be played, i'll download it when I can.

[Gryphin]

gregebowman and folks
I'll be uploading the mod and my ship set as soon as I can figure out how.

[mlmbd]

Gryphin, upload them to your website. Then, just supply the links to the upload. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

<font color=purple>mlmbd http://www.shrapnelgames.com//ubb/icons/icon6.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif </font>

[Gryphin]

mlmbd,
Master Belisarius, did in the thread he created. I will upload it to my site.

[mlmbd]

Gryphin, 'Excellent'. There are a couple images that are duplicated in the zip.

FYI, I will be finished with my shipset by the end of the week. Hopefully!

<font color=purple>mlmbd http://www.shrapnelgames.com//ubb/icons/icon6.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif </font>

[Gryphin]

Latest additions will incorporate
Space bouys and a Launcher bay that will only launch one per turn. When you pass through the a system you can drop off just one.

Colony ship Fast that can move 8 but has no room for cargo. (I expect this is unballencing and I doubt the AI will use them )

Colony ship large - 600kT

Using these toys too much might throw you off when you play in a game without them.

[ March 03, 2003, 04:35: Message edited by: Gryphin ]

[mlmbd]

Gryphin, I am ready!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

<font color=purple>mlmbd http://www.shrapnelgames.com//ubb/icons/icon6.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif </font>

[Gryphin]

We are off and running.
New Items include:
Bouy Launcher - Launches 1 Sattellite per Stratiegic turn
Space Bouy - 20kT Sattellite able to hold the 5kT Stealth Plate
This combo allows you to drop off a Bouy to mark and monitor the systems you pass through.

[mlmbd]

Gryphin, I like the bouy idea. Have not built a scout with one yet. But I will.

<font color=purple>mlmbd http://www.shrapnelgames.com//ubb/icons/icon6.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif </font>

[Gryphin]

Does anyone else see the value in a
SEIV Calculator?
Basicaly something where you could
Punch in a production rate and get list of how many minerals / rads / orgs per turn it would constroct over 1, 2, 3, 4, an 5 turns

Put in cost of ship and it would show the maintenance cost and the max cost of a possible Retrofit.

Yes I'm beling lazy. This is what computers, (not me), do best.

[mlmbd]

Gryphin, sure, I can see a use for one! For addind up all the new data in some of the SEIV files!

<font color=purple>mlmbd http://www.shrapnelgames.com//ubb/icons/icon6.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif </font>

[Gryphin]

I'm working on it again using DavidG's 1.72

I noticed something.
You have to research Fighters to get
Small Combat Sensors

Questions:
1) Is that correct?
2) Do they help Troops?