Are there any female SE4 players? [Archive]

Ruatha

December 16th, 2002, 01:21 PM

I was writing a question about a player and wrote "does he have to..." and started thinking.
Are there any "she" players? I haven't seen any.
My wife thinks this forum has a somewhat prepubertal male touch!
I've read somewhere on this forum of a couple where both plays, who was that?
And if there are any "she" players, do they play PBW?

(Please answer the poll truthfully, and if you are a "she" player feel free to reply to this poll about how it is to play in a male-dominated universe.

[ December 16, 2002, 11:22: Message edited by: Ruatha ]

dogscoff

December 16th, 2002, 01:34 PM

If you dig through the "how old are you" thread, you'll find sightings of at least one or two ladies. Also, I seem to recall a woman visiting the Cantina a few months back, but Gryphin scared her off with his over-amorous advances. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

I'd be grateful if you could somehow record the findings of this poll here. (http://invirtuo.cc/phpwiki/index.php/player%20demographics)

Gryphin

December 16th, 2002, 01:40 PM

My sweetheart plays a hotseat game with me. Sometime back the "Gear Box Kid" asked the same quesiton. He was informed there were a couple in Germany.

tesco samoa

December 16th, 2002, 04:25 PM

what there is woman in germany.

Who Put them there ?

And how do we get them out ?

Stone Mill

December 16th, 2002, 04:40 PM

The best I can do with my wife is play electronic "Yahtzee." And neither one of us like to lose. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Despite my best efforts, I can't seem to convert her to Sci-Fi; I even tried to compromise, but she insists I watch testesterone-sapping movies like Ya-Ya Sisterhood, The Stepmom, and Fried Green Tomatoes. AGGGH! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

I guess SEIV will continue to be a guy thing.

David E. Gervais

December 16th, 2002, 04:50 PM

LoL! So far the results are 100% male,.. That's enough to scare off any woman! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Ruatha

December 16th, 2002, 04:59 PM

In a couple of years when my daughter gets a bit older I'll indoctrinate her with Sci-Fi strategy games!

geoschmo

December 16th, 2002, 05:15 PM

There was a girl that played pretty regular on PBW for a while Last year, but when school started back up in the fall she had to cut back.

She was a good player too. (She knocked me out of the UCT tourney)

Geoschmo

[ December 16, 2002, 15:16: Message edited by: geoschmo ]

Ragnarok

December 16th, 2002, 07:01 PM

Ohhh, Geo got beat by a girl?!?! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif Nothing wrong with that. Girls are good at games too. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif
I swore there was a chick around here recently. I'll find a post from whoever it is and find out. I shall return.

rextorres

December 16th, 2002, 08:19 PM

Her handle was babyshark she was in the first PBW game I ever played.

capnq

December 16th, 2002, 08:38 PM

My wife thinks this forum has a somewhat prepubertal male touch! And the references to "girls" and "chicks" in this thread are really helping to dispel that opinion. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

Some women will take offense at being called "ladies", for that matter.

Chronon

December 16th, 2002, 08:51 PM

Stone Mill, I think you're right that SEIV will probably continue to have a mostly male following. But I think it's more to do with the style of game rather than the overall Sci-Fi theme. I know plenty of women who are big fans of Star Trek (Picard and Spock are special Favorites). Not too many of them are really interested in conquering the galaxy, however.

Games like Civilization, which are rewarding for "builders" (ie have a victory condition that is not dependent on war) have more appeal for women because it's not just about who has the biggest military. I'm actually kind of surprised that SEIV doesn't have a "peaceful" victory condition (Civ and Alpha Centauri do). I'd love to see something like 'transcendence' in SEV; it's a tried and true Sci-Fi theme, and it would be a fun alternative to Last empire standing.

PS I enjoyed Fried Green Tomatoes, myself, more than, say, Star Trek I, V, Generations, or the Last two Star Wars movies... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

geoschmo

December 16th, 2002, 09:13 PM

Originally posted by Ragnarok:
Ohhh, Geo got beat by a girl?!?! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif Nothing wrong with that. Girls are good at games too. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif The worst part wasn't that she was a girl, the worst part was that she was half my age. Oh the shame... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Stone Mill

December 16th, 2002, 09:33 PM

Posted by Chronon:
PS I enjoyed Fried Green Tomatoes, myself, more than, say, Star Trek I, V, Generations, or the Last two Star Wars movies... Blasphemer!!! Guards, seize him!!!

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Just kidding! Ok, not to start a debate on the movies (which may fit into another thread), I can see your point. My post on this was more of a personal story. You have great ideas; esp. the transcendence ending.

Without meaning to offend anyone by making a generalization based on my personal experience:

Women don't really care for role-playing games that much either, which is too bad, bacause they add a great dynamic.

Women and Sci-Fi: kind of like BigFoot. I've heard of them and seen some pictures (like at Sci-Fi conventions) but I've never personally encountered one up close. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

As for the whole gender thing, I don't consider this a "guys" club. Heck, I think of most of you as aliens. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

DarkHorse

December 16th, 2002, 09:36 PM

Originally posted by Chronon:
I'm actually kind of surprised that SEIV doesn't have a "peaceful" victory condition (Civ and Alpha Centauri do). I'd love to see something like 'transcendence' in SEV; it's a tried and true Sci-Fi theme, and it would be a fun alternative to Last empire standing.
SEIV has at least two peaceful victory conditions, it's just that no one ever uses them. Galaxy at peace for x years, and First to score of xx.

[ December 16, 2002, 19:39: Message edited by: DarkHorse ]

Ragnarok

December 16th, 2002, 11:32 PM

Women and Sci-Fi: kind of like BigFoot. I've heard of them and seen some pictures (like at Sci-Fi conventions) but I've never personally encountered one up close.Nice example. But Bigfoot is a hoxe(sp?) The guy that made it up died and his family is finally admitting to it all. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif I'm sure you all knew it was fake anyways but this is just further proof. Ok, you guys can back to your subject now. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

And geo, as far as half your age... Just wait till I finally get my hands against you. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

Suicide Junkie

December 16th, 2002, 11:38 PM

SEIV has at least two peaceful victory conditions, it's just that no one ever uses them. Galaxy at peace for x years, and First to score of xx.There's also the "X years have elapsed".

Chronon

December 17th, 2002, 12:25 AM

SJ and DarkHorse, those are good points. I had forgotten about those conditions, and I really shouldn't have - considering that I use x% of other player's score when I play the AI.

In any case, even in games like Civ with the spaceship victory, most of the multiplayer games I've played with human opponents (or for SEIV, perhaps I should say sentient beings?) end in some kind of conquest victory. That can be fun, but for some reason those very rare transcendence victories are even more fun (perhaps because of their rarity?).

Stone Mill - Somehow I thought my comments about the movies might stir up the hornets' nest a little. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Those are just my preferences, and I'm sure there are as many different opinions about them as participants in these forums. I'd be happy to have a friendly discussion of movies in another thread, if you're interested.

Shoujo

December 17th, 2002, 01:18 AM

Originally posted by Stone Mill:
Without meaning to offend anyone by making a generalization based on my personal experience:

Women don't really care for role-playing games that much either, which is too bad, bacause they add a great dynamic.

[/QB]Things've changed (I hope), but if guys'd tried to put me in things like bikini armor, I wouldn't care for role-playing either... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif Pizza stains and empty cans of Mountain Dew don't exactly help the image of the stereotypical RPer either...

Suicide Junkie

December 17th, 2002, 01:22 AM

Chronon:
You can also do the "Player has 100% of tech areas researched"

That would be pretty transcendant, I think.
You could even toss in a new tech area, "transcendance" that requires all other techs maxxed out as a prerequisite.

Arkcon

December 17th, 2002, 01:29 AM

Tried to twist my sister's arm and get her to play SE4. I gave her the basics of ship design, and she built a colony ship with Aux Control.

And I said "Wha.. Why,... You're wastin..."

and she said, "You're in this game, I need every possible backup when you attack"

and I said "Oh, I won.. Oh, do what you want..."

She might have thought of tons of things that I wouldn't, but oh well, she just thought the game was too violent.

Probably shouldn't have shown her the planet killer in action. Heh.

Tampa Gamer's sound mod gave the organic seekers a real evil screech too. That freaked her out good once. "See, my ships don't fire missiles, they give birth to them -- and they're born angry."

Mephisto

December 17th, 2002, 01:30 AM

I have played one PBEM game with a lady for about a year now and one PBW game with another lady for several month. You see, there are ladies out there. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Arkcon

December 17th, 2002, 01:45 AM

Originally posted by Shoujo:
Things've changed (I hope), but if guys'd tried to put me in things like bikini armor, I wouldn't care for role-playing either... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif ...ROTFLMAO http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Well, that's even funnier when you go to this web site: see: #chainmail bikini (http://www.gamerjargon.com/gamer3_cd.html)

[EDIT] A better link, but you'll have to cut and paste because you can't enter URL's from the edit window.
[EDIT2] Sure you can.

[ December 17, 2002, 03:27: Message edited by: Suicide Junkie ]

PvK

December 17th, 2002, 02:09 AM

I've heard of three female SE4 players. I've known many female RPG players, too, most of them quite good players who enjoyed the games without gender-related issues, although a I have seen several er, unappealing male RPG players, who were not in games the female players played in.

As for SE4, my wife has thought SE4 looked interesting, but seemed way too complex for her to want to get into. I've heard that comment from several male players, too.

Also though, one thing that turns me off about SE4 that I expect would tend to turn off most female players, is the general assumption of antagonism, megalomania, and above all, the default to violence and genocide. Even when you try hard not to, it's all too easy to accidentally murder billions of peaceful unarmed civillians, who may even be of your own race if an enemy captured one of your planets. IMO, that really sucks, unless you assume everyone is a genocidal maniac. Then there's the "all ships fight to the death whenever they meet anyone without a treaty" thing. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/confused.gif

PvK

Stone Mill

December 17th, 2002, 03:31 AM

PvK: Absolutely, absolutely, absolutely!!! We have both touched on this topic several times, it's one of my biggest peeves as well. Hope they change it in SEV. Your troops should not obliterate billions until a Declaration of WAR is given!!! As for engagements, only Warlike races should fire first by default.

But... alas... to get back on topic, I just about wet myself laughing from the Last few Posts!!! ROFL!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

and Mephisto posted:
I have played one PBEM game with a lady for about a year now and one PBW game with another lady for several month. You see, there are ladies out there. I noticed you hail from Germany. Gryphin mentioned playing with a German lady as well...
Hmmmmmm... Is this a German woman gaming thing? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Kamog

December 17th, 2002, 04:24 AM

Originally posted by capnq:
And the references to "girls" and "chicks" in this thread are really helping to dispel that opinion. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

Some women will take offense at being called "ladies", for that matter.I didn't know that... I thought "lady" was polite. How do they wish to be called?

Desdinova

December 17th, 2002, 04:29 AM

Originally posted by Kamog:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by capnq:
And the references to "girls" and "chicks" in this thread are really helping to dispel that opinion. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

Some women will take offense at being called "ladies", for that matter.I didn't know that... I thought "lady" was polite. How do they wish to be called?<hr /></blockquote>Your Majesty, Your Magnificence, Mistress, M'lady, Queen. just for starters. of course you have to say this with a straight face, otherwise it just makes them angrier.

[ December 17, 2002, 02:31: Message edited by: desdinova ]

Arkcon

December 17th, 2002, 04:40 AM

Originally posted by Kamog:
I didn't know that... I thought "lady" was polite. How do they wish to be called?Women is a good starting point. If they're real picky, they want to be called womyn, pronounced the same in American English, just doesn't contain the word men inside.

A lady is something delicate who you open a door for, you know car doors, theatre doors, etc. Just not the doors to the work place, political doors, door to your social club, etc.

'Course when a group(gaggle?, herd? flock?) of womyn arrive, the little evil person inside me has to be bound, chained, gagged and sat upon to prevent him from makeing me say, "Aww, who let the skirts in here?"

[ December 17, 2002, 02:43: Message edited by: Arkcon ]

Thermodyne

December 17th, 2002, 05:12 AM

Originally posted by Arkcon:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Kamog:
I didn't know that... I thought "lady" was polite. How do they wish to be called?Women is a good starting point. If they're real picky, they want to be called womyn, pronounced the same in American English, just doesn't contain the word men inside.

A lady is something delicate who you open a door for, you know car doors, theatre doors, etc. Just not the doors to the work place, political doors, door to your social club, etc.

'Course when a group(gaggle?, herd? flock?) of womyn arrive, the little evil person inside me has to be bound, chained, gagged and sat upon to prevent him from makeing me say, "Aww, who let the skirts in here?"<hr /></blockquote>I would say that perhaps you experience may be a little narrow on this point. I know and have known women that were not at all as you have described here, but they were ladies in every sense of the word. Some were powerful and independent, others were proud. Some were just plain stubborn, but they were all ladies.

Krsqk

December 17th, 2002, 05:26 AM

I must have been brought up wrong, then. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif I was taught to open doors out of respect, not sympathy (not the word I want, but can't think of it tonight). And to open them for both men and women--out of respect. Guess my parents failed again... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Chronon

December 17th, 2002, 05:53 AM

Originally posted by Suicide Junkie:
Chronon:
You can also do the "Player has 100% of tech areas researched"

That would be pretty transcendant, I think.
You could even toss in a new tech area, "transcendance" that requires all other techs maxxed out as a prerequisite.SJ, yes that would be pretty close to transcendence. Some games, like Civ, do require all just about all the techs for the "builder" victory (spaceship to Alpha Centauri), but some, like Alpha Centauri, have some techs outside the transcendence beeline (quite a few of the late game military techs are excluded). For SE4 I think some of the later weapons techs wouldn't really be necessary for 'transcendence.' Then it would be fun to have some kind of insanely expensive 'facility' (temple? sanctuary?)where your race transcends. Hmm...considering the way this game works, I'll bet this kind of thing could be modded...(although I doubt I have the expertise to do it myself).

On the topic of "ladies," I think we're running into regional (and even national) cultural differences. I imagine that in the southeastern United States, and most of Europe, lady is a term of respect (like Signora in Italy, Madame in France, and perhaps even Lady in Great Britain). In the northeastern US, on the other hand, and especially in New York, lady is usually attached to some rather colorful expression like "hey lady, get your #$%$ cat off my new car" So, in my part of the world, Ms. is the proper direct form of address, and women is preferable to ladies as the general term.

[ December 17, 2002, 03:59: Message edited by: Chronon ]

Arkcon

December 17th, 2002, 06:16 AM

Originally posted by Thermodyne:
I would say that perhaps you experience may be a little narrow on this point. I know and have known women that were not at all as you have described here, but they were ladies in every sense of the word. Some were powerful and independent, others were proud. Some were just plain stubborn, but they were all ladies.Oh I've met these, they don't mind the terms lady, ms, ma'am. And they don't mind an off color joke in the lunch room. Go with their husband to eat at Hooters. et cetera

[ December 17, 2002, 04:21: Message edited by: Arkcon ]

Arkcon

December 17th, 2002, 06:20 AM

Originally posted by Krsqk:
I must have been brought up wrong, then. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif I was taught to open doors out of respect, not sympathy (not the word I want, but can't think of it tonight). And to open them for both men and women--out of respect. Guess my parents failed again... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif Me too, I always hated in school when someone let the door slam in my face in a crowded hallway.

I just made sense to me to hold it, look over your shoulder, and wait for the next person to grab it.

The concept seemed lost on just about everyone else.

Thermodyne

December 17th, 2002, 06:24 AM

Originally posted by Arkcon:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Thermodyne:
I would say that perhaps you experience may be a little narrow on this point. I know and have known women that were not at all as you have described here, but they were ladies in every sense of the word. Some were powerful and independent, others were proud. Some were just plain stubborn, but they were all ladies.I've meet these, they don't mind the terms lady, ms, ma'am. And they don't mind an off color joke in the lunch room. Go with their husband to eat at Hooters. et cetera<hr /></blockquote>Um�..Not the ones I had in mind, but yes they would be ladies too. It would be easier to say which people were not ladies. And some ladies are more lady-like than others. My point was that a lady did not have to be overly feminine or meek and mild of disposition to be a lady. Some ladies would run you over and leave you in the dust if you paused to open a door. On the other hand, some that would wait until the door had been opened for them are no kind of lady that you would bring home to meet your mother.

Baron Grazic

December 17th, 2002, 06:45 AM

I am sure I remember another post along these same lines, but can't remember the title.

I orginally got my wife hooked by playing hotseat games together and slowly introduced her to Space Empires. She enjoyed it cause we could beat up the AI together and we didn't have to fight each other, never a good idea for a happy marriage. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

She normally plays a Peaceful race and I'm the agreesive one. But in her second PBW Game, she has turned the tables and started destorying a race cause the other Empire "Didn't reply to either of my requests for a treaty and I asked them 3 times".
Since then I've ensured I have replied to her every communication. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif
In Bad form, the player (who is staying nameless) then quit because he couldn't take the heat. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Women - No.
Girl - OK
Lady - Good
Princess - Bonus points.

[ December 17, 2002, 04:46: Message edited by: Baron Grazic ]

SamuraiProgrammer

December 17th, 2002, 07:04 AM

My Wife plays this and other games. She prefers RPGs such as Baldur's Gate and the Might & Magic series. She has also played mucho grande hours of Heroes of Might & Magic.

She enjoys strategy games much better than tactical as she is a bit of an empire builder. She does complain that wishes the games didn't always come down to fighting, but I keep explaining to her that unfortunately, force is the final answer when survival is at stake.

She does like Quake, however, because, as she says, "it is very satisfying to blow my husband up with a grenade launcher." I don't know what to say about that. I'm torn..... to shreds (if you get my drift).

But anyway... she is working on her skills and is getting used to the idea of venturing out to PBW against opponents other than myself. She has played a few games in a tight group of local friends.

She would make the observation that "more women would play if they knew about it".

I would make the observation that women generally enjoy the exploration and expansion but most pale at the thought of backing up their policy with force.

If you want to introduce a member of the better gender to this (or other games), start by setting ground rules that prevent armed conflict. At the very least, they will have the opportunity to learn the workings of the game (and have a chance to build an addiction) before they are forced to learn strategy and tactics the only way they are effectively taught... by getting stomped.

For the record, we are both on the other side of 40 years old & one of the reasons I married her was because she understood my hobby.

P.S. --- we also play bridge... the best wargame around (believe it or not).

President_Elect_Shang

December 17th, 2002, 07:08 AM

Lady woman girl how do you know which is which? I don�t know. The only thing I am sure of is that my wife all woman. How can I tell you ask? It is something you just know, same as I know that I love her more ten years later. We can each give our own differing descriptions of what a woman is and maybe not come out with two views alike. I believe that we all would agree that you (and only you) know for sure she is a woman for the same reason you know you love her.

Skulky

December 17th, 2002, 08:36 AM

i don't doubt hte bridge comment, btu could you please explain? O, and i'm working up an idea for a non-violent pbw game/mod. Just dont' have the time to type it out now. off to sleep thank god.

Mephisto

December 17th, 2002, 11:17 AM

Originally posted by Stone Mill:
I noticed you hail from Germany. Gryphin mentioned playing with a German lady as well...
Hmmmmmm... Is this a German woman gaming thing? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif I dunno. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif I have meet ladies who hated computer games and others that love it. I play Shadowrun, The Black Eye and Mechwarrior (RPGs) with the two ladies here, too, and it is always a joy as the are ROLEplaying it, not just whacking opposition. In general I think ladies like the building part of a game more. Further, when you introduce one to a game you like, don't come of with all the neat tricks you already know. They want to explore the game just as you did when you started it and it is just no fun to have a wiseass in front of you telling you the way your empire should be run.

SamuraiProgrammer

December 17th, 2002, 05:42 PM

We play bridge. The card game made popular by the likes of Culbertson and Goren.

I play it because it is one of the best strategy games I can find. Also there are regular organized tournaments - probably 9 or 10 a year within driving distance.

Imagine if there was a gamers convention almost every month. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif

In fact, of the group of 6 Space Empires players that I play with locally, 4 of them are avid bridge players as well.

LazarusLong42

December 17th, 2002, 07:30 PM

Originally posted by Stone Mill:
Without meaning to offend anyone by making a generalization based on my personal experience:

Women don't really care for role-playing games that much either, which is too bad, bacause they add a great dynamic.

Women and Sci-Fi: kind of like BigFoot. I've heard of them and seen some pictures (like at Sci-Fi conventions) but I've never personally encountered one up close. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif Whoa, whoa, what universe are you living in? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

I am on the convention committee for a local SF convention, which is chaired by a woman, vice-chaired by a woman, and half the committee are women.

My SF/fantasy writer's group includes three women and was started by a woman.

The Star Trek role-playing club (OK, it was more interactive fiction than role-playing, but still) I used to belong to included perhaps thirty percent women, with similar representation at the leadership levels.

Um. Shall I continue?

Stone Mill

December 17th, 2002, 08:19 PM

Originally posted by LazarusLong42:
Whoa, whoa, what universe are you living in? Well, mine seems to be much different than yours. Yours sounds pretty refreshing, though. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif I have never been to a SciFi or gaming convention either; although I always toyed with the ideas amongst my friends.

My universe involves the mundane drudgery of East Coast suburbia. Women around here like to talk about puppies, babies, and clothes. They like expensive restaraunts and NYC outings, plays, social escalation activities, and home decorating (which does not involve Star Wars posters).

I almost fell over when I told a Yoda joke to my 18 year-old sister-in-law, and she looked at me with a blank stare. "You don't know who Yoda is?" I asked. She had never seen any of the Star Wars movies. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/blush.gif

Now, that's a drastic example. But I find Sci-Fi and women a rare combo in my circles, with only rare exceptions.

oleg

December 17th, 2002, 08:19 PM

Originally posted by SamuraiProgrammer:
We play bridge. The card game made popular by the likes of Culbertson and Goren.

I play it because it is one of the best strategy games I can find. Also there are regular organized tournaments - probably 9 or 10 a year within driving distance.

Imagine if there was a gamers convention almost every month. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif

In fact, of the group of 6 Space Empires players that I play with locally, 4 of them are avid bridge players as well.I play more duplicate bridge than any computer game (SEIV included). Just yesterday we got 65.5% game ! Here is the link: http://www.manchesterbridge.co.uk/monday.php

DirectorTsaarx

December 17th, 2002, 11:29 PM

Originally posted by SamuraiProgrammer:
My Wife plays this and other games. She prefers RPGs such as Baldur's Gate and the Might & Magic series. She has also played mucho grande hours of Heroes of Might & Magic.
<snip>
P.S. --- we also play bridge... the best wargame around (believe it or not).My fiancee' and I played Baldur's Gate on the Playstation (one of the few games you can play cooperatively, besides the major FPS-type games that neither of us like). We also play spades & bridge with her parents; unfortunately, her parents can't stand to be on the same team (very different bidding styles) so I'm always partnered with her father & she's always partnered with her mother. Not generally a problem, except when Dad & I are winning... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

Stone Mill

December 17th, 2002, 11:58 PM

DirectorTsaarx,

We also play spades & bridge with her parents; Small world. I just started playing Spades with my In-laws who live in Northern VA. They are very good at Bridge, so they have beaten the pants off of us 3 times. I just taught my wife how to play... I hope we beat them, or I'll have to configure the teams as you have! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

SamuraiProgrammer

December 18th, 2002, 05:48 AM

Originally posted by oleg:
I play more duplicate bridge than any computer game (SEIV included). Just yesterday we got 65.5% game ! Here is the link: http://www.manchesterbridge.co.uk/monday.php[/QB]Woah! Congratulations - 65% is pretty darn good! My wife & I bid a modified KS with 12 to 14 point NoTrumps. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif Would we fit in with your club?

(I have always hear that English ridicule Americans for their security blanket of the 'strong' no trump... I am assuming your are English from the url.)

Ruatha

December 18th, 2002, 09:57 AM

41 answers and no trace of any female.

If you just entered this thread go to the first post and enter the poll.

[ December 18, 2002, 07:57: Message edited by: Ruatha ]

oleg

December 18th, 2002, 11:25 AM

Originally posted by SamuraiProgrammer:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by oleg:
I play more duplicate bridge than any computer game (SEIV included). Just yesterday we got 65.5% game ! Here is the link: http://www.manchesterbridge.co.uk/monday.phpWoah! Congratulations - 65% is pretty darn good! My wife & I bid a modified KS with 12 to 14 point NoTrumps. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif Would we fit in with your club?

(I have always hear that English ridicule Americans for their security blanket of the 'strong' no trump... I am assuming your are English from the url.)[/QB]<hr /></blockquote>Thanks ! Even though I live in UK, I learned bridge when I was in Texas (Austin). So we play "modern Standard American" - 2over1 GF.
Most people here still play Acol (4card Majors, 12-14 NT, strong twos). I suspect our bidding system gives us more tops than my card playing ability deserves. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif People very often play in NT with 8-card fit in majors or wind up in 4-3 fit. You would do very well playing Kaplan-Sheinwold ! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

SamuraiProgrammer

December 18th, 2002, 05:00 PM

Do you think your bidding system confuses your opponents or do you think it is superior? I once knew someone that was planning on learning ACOL and I once faced a couple of guys at a regional that were playing something based on it (I think).

4 Card Majors ---UGH!

[ December 18, 2002, 15:00: Message edited by: SamuraiProgrammer ]

mottlee

December 18th, 2002, 05:24 PM

Stone Mill

December 18th, 2002, 05:34 PM

Originally Posted by Mottlee:
I do beleave we have scared them off!
That is sooo funny reading that while looking at your avatar!

ROFL!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[ December 18, 2002, 15:34: Message edited by: Stone Mill ]

Arkcon

December 18th, 2002, 06:06 PM

Originally posted by Ruatha:
41 answers and no trace of any female.

If you just entered this thread go to the first post and enter the poll.Well, there's 2% voting as neither. So a message for any alien beings that are true hermaphrodites, any pure energy beings, or pure AI entities on this board:

If you can reproduce by yourself, Isaac Asimov said in "Foundation And The Earth" that you are defined as female.

So answer up, we can't hurt you through cyberspace.

[ December 18, 2002, 18:56: Message edited by: Arkcon ]

mottlee

December 18th, 2002, 06:38 PM

Originally posted by Stone Mill:
Originally Posted by Mottlee:
<blockquote>quote:<hr /> I do beleave we have scared them off!
That is sooo funny reading that while looking at your avatar!

ROFL!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif <hr /></blockquote>OK OK OK so I scared them off http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

Stone Mill

December 18th, 2002, 09:30 PM

OK OK OK so I scared them off
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif There you have it. It's not SciFi, it's not the SEIV game... It's Mottlee's avatar!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

Maybe you can soften it up a bit... you know, put some flowers in the 'ol ribcage, or spruce it up with some pastel colors... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Cheeze

December 19th, 2002, 04:08 AM

Stone Mill,

How do you manage to play spades without cursing and trashtalking your in-laws?

Especially the cursing part!

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

oleg

December 19th, 2002, 03:40 PM

Originally posted by SamuraiProgrammer:
Do you think your bidding system confuses your opponents or do you think it is superior? I once knew someone that was planning on learning ACOL and I once faced a couple of guys at a regional that were playing something based on it (I think).

4 Card Majors ---UGH!I think it is because Acol and other 4-card Majors suffer in competition. In unopposed auction there is no much difference.
Suppose your partner opens 1S (may be 4 cards), RHO overcall with 2C or 2D. If you have 3-card support should you raise or not ? If you decide to play responsive doubles to ammend this problem (double shows 3 spades while 2 spades shows 4 cards), how to show 4 card heart suit ?? On the other hand weak no trump, escpecialy when non-vulnerable against vulnerable can be a killer. Yesterday we were cold for vulnerable 3NT. I had flat 14 points in forth seat, LHO opened 1NT, CHO passesd, RHO bid 2h (transfer), I passed, LHO bid 2S, pass, pass to me. I passed. We set them 2 for +100. Par result +600. CHO had 11 count with 5D. We play ASTRO and the only way for her to show her hand is to overcall 1NT with vulnerable 3D which is obviously insane. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

[ December 19, 2002, 13:43: Message edited by: oleg ]

Stone Mill

December 19th, 2002, 04:08 PM

Originally posted by Cheeze:
How do you manage to play spades without cursing and trashtalking your in-laws?

Especially the cursing part!
That's not the worst of it... We haven't picked up on their signals yet... Those CHEATS!!! I'll get 'em!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif

SamuraiProgrammer

December 20th, 2002, 05:14 AM

+100 when game is cold... I HATE it when that happens. (Unless I am going down in which case http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

I have often wondered about learning 4 card majors... then I come to my senses.

I actually threatened to learn Culbertson.. I have 3 of his books (red, blue, & gold), but bidding has come so far, it is useless to bother.

Do you have any budding converts to 5-Card majors?

Ruatha

December 20th, 2002, 09:44 AM

45 votes, no woman.

Ruatha

December 20th, 2002, 05:16 PM

Originally posted by mottlee:
45 to 0 WE WIN!!!!!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/confused.gif

What we win?A sad, sad life....

oleg

December 20th, 2002, 10:51 PM

Originally posted by SamuraiProgrammer:
[QBDo you have any budding converts to 5-Card majors?[/QB]Not many, just 1 pair. Traditions die slowly. One reason is that you MUST alert 1c and 1 d openings if they promised just 3 cards (EBU regulations). Most people reasonably think less alerts is better. Another factor is popularity of rubber bridge. Yes, I'm not kidding. There are as many rubber tables per week as duplicate in Manchester bridge club. And in rubber all play exactly same system - Acol.

SamuraiProgrammer

December 20th, 2002, 10:56 PM

I wish we had more rubber bridge games around here. It is the most effective way to charge (or be charged) for lessons http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Gozra

December 20th, 2002, 11:08 PM

I just remembered Javah's Wife plays PBW

oleg

December 20th, 2002, 11:16 PM

Originally posted by SamuraiProgrammer:
I wish we had more rubber bridge games around here. It is the most effective way to charge (or be charged) for lessons http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif No. every time I play rubber I have Yarborough in my hand. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif Too much depends on luck. Unless of course if you play in TGR with Zia...
But it never will happen to me.

mottlee

December 21st, 2002, 02:22 AM

Originally posted by Ruatha:
45 votes, no woman.45 to 0 WE WIN!!!!!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/confused.gif

What we win?

couslee

February 2nd, 2003, 03:06 AM

I can just imagine the 8 women gamers that voted their were male saying.... "LOL, look at these vain arseholes"... you win, ok billy, now carry out the trash.

Kamog

February 3rd, 2003, 09:22 AM

50 vs. 1

We're still winning... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Ruatha

February 3rd, 2003, 11:29 AM

Originally posted by Kamog:
50 vs. 1

We're still winning... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif Actually it's 52-0 (the 1 is "Assume I'm male")

Ragnarok

February 3rd, 2003, 06:10 PM

Originally posted by Ruatha:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Kamog:
50 vs. 1

We're still winning... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif Actually it's 52-0 (the 1 is "Assume I'm male")<hr /></blockquote>No, we have a women around here now. Check the Cantina. She's posted in there. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Ruatha

February 3rd, 2003, 08:36 PM

Yes. Now it's 54-1, some way left to go...

F Te antKe

February 4th, 2003, 04:48 AM

There is no option for Genderless or Hermaphrodites. Since our existance is neither > both > and Other I will have to abstain from "voting". What do you call a being that contributes to something akin to fusion in order to perpetuate its "race" for lack of a better word.

geoschmo

February 4th, 2003, 04:59 AM

54-0-1 then. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

Ruatha

February 4th, 2003, 07:05 AM

Originally posted by geoschmo:
54-0-1 then. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif But who posted the new 1 then?
And I do relate do the genderless stuff. Being viewed as an object can be somewhat booring I guess.

MacLeod

February 4th, 2003, 07:41 AM

Originally posted by Ruatha:

My wife thinks this forum has a somewhat prepubertal male touch!
Wow does your wife read the same Internet as I do?

This is probably the most mature forum I've ever seen in my life! It's almost completely devoid of flames and personal attacks.

I guess the 4x genre isn't very attractive to women. Why? Who cares, women are beyond the comprehension of mortal minds. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif You'll find more of them in RTS or RPGs, my theory is that those genres are easier to socialize in as they unanimously feature real time communication as compared to SEIV's slow pace of communication (with it's very slow in game communication system).

Krsqk

February 4th, 2003, 05:50 PM

Women tend to be more about equal relationships than subjugative ones. "How about we work together for our mutual good?" as opposed to "Work harder, you slaves!" http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif However, women who get ticked off in a game would probably be a bit like the AI--they declare war and will never have peace with you again. Probably including your next 10 games with them. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif At least, that's how my wife would be. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif And yes, she reads parts of this forum, too.

Andr�s

February 5th, 2003, 04:58 AM

Just added my vote to increase the difference.
57 - 0 - 1 - 1

Mephisto

March 11th, 2003, 12:52 AM

Still waiting for a female SE IV player?
I am one - though I fear we won't get any closer together... being it as it is I live in Germany...
Ask Mephisto for details...

Anja http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Master Belisarius

March 11th, 2003, 12:54 AM

Originally posted by Mephisto:
Still waiting for a female SE IV player?
I am one - though I fear we won't get any closer together... being it as it is I live in Germany...
Ask Mephisto for details...

Anja http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif Hey Philipp, have you a double personality???

Master Belisarius

March 11th, 2003, 12:57 AM

Originally posted by F Te antKe:
There is no option for Genderless or Hermaphrodites. Since our existance is neither > both > and Other I will have to abstain from "voting". What do you call a being that contributes to something akin to fusion in order to perpetuate its "race" for lack of a better word.Genderless???
I don't think Michael Jackson would like to play SE4... but who knows? Maybe he like to play with their kids before go to sleep.

DavidG

March 11th, 2003, 01:13 AM

Originally posted by Krsqk:
Women tend to be more about equal relationships than subjugative ones. "How about we work together for our mutual good?" as opposed to "Work harder, you slaves!" http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif However, women who get ticked off in a game would probably be a bit like the AI--they declare war and will never have peace with you again. Probably including your next 10 games with them. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif At least, that's how my wife would be. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif And yes, she reads parts of this forum, too.Wow that explains a lot!! The friends I play must be women! You hear that Longstreet? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

[ March 11, 2003, 00:43: Message edited by: DavidG ]

Mephisto

March 11th, 2003, 01:59 AM

Originally posted by Master Belisarius:
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif Hey Philipp, have you a double personality???Nope. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif I visited Anja just an hour ago and we sat in front of her Laptop. I mentioned that there was once this thread on the board and that it would be fun if she would post here. She readily agreed but we didn't want to go through all the hassle of creating a new login for her so she used my account. Search for "Kayleigh" on PBW.

Puke

March 11th, 2003, 02:39 AM

Originally posted by MacLeod:
I guess the 4x genre isn't very attractive to women. Why? Who cares, women are beyond the comprehension of mortal minds. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif You'll find more of them in RTS or RPGs, my theory is that those genres are easier to socialize in as they unanimously feature real time communication as compared to SEIV's slow pace of communication (with it's very slow in game communication system).its hard to generalize.. a friend of mine is big into RTS's and RPG's, but she hates people who stand around and socialize instead of playing.. go figure. I couldn't get her interested in se4, though.

Originally posted by Andr&eacutes Lescano:
Just added my vote to increase the difference.
57 - 0 - 1 - 1good god, how many categories are there now? Male, Female, Other, Left of Center, Not telling, Dressing to the Right Today, I like Furries, Too Confused to Tell, and Give Me Another Drink Please. I remember the good old days when "what gender are you" was a easy choice, instead of an essay question that is judged on the OSRT scale. sh*t. I live in the Tenderloin, or the transvestite district of San Francisco, and things are not this complicated. (and no, im not a tranny. thanks for asking.)

Master Belisarius

March 11th, 2003, 03:29 AM

Originally posted by Mephisto:
Nope. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif I visited Anja just an hour ago and we sat in front of her Laptop. I mentioned that there was once this thread on the board and that it would be fun if she would post here. She readily agreed but we didn't want to go through all the hassle of creating a new login for her so she used my account. Search for "Kayleigh" on PBW.http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif I saw their name... and of course it was a joke (a bad one!).

Kamog

March 11th, 2003, 07:12 AM

I'm male, no hesitance here, 100 % testosterone. 97% (60)
I'm female but never plays PBW. 0% (0)
I'm female and plays/has played PBW. 2% (1)
I'm neither or I don't want to tell my gender (Assume I'm male). 2% (1) I have a suspicion that there are way more men in the world than there are women. People say that there are roughly equal numbers, but it certainly does not seem that way. When I was in school, there were only about 3 girls out of about 200 students in my department. At work, most of the people in the company are guys. And in the SEIV community, it's mostly guys. I go to the gym and it's mostly guys there. Everywhere I go, it's mostly guys! In my estimation, the ratio of males to females in the world is not 1 to 1 but somewhere in between 10 to 1 and 100 to 1.

baetis

March 11th, 2003, 09:03 AM

God, i hope i never end up living where you are http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif At my college there were way more girls than guys. However, in my department (computer science) there were very few girls. And only one hotty. And i'm living with her now http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

DavidG

March 11th, 2003, 01:30 PM

Originally posted by Kamog:
I have a suspicion that there are way more men in the world than there are women. People say that there are roughly equal numbers, but it certainly does not seem that way. When I was in school, there were only about 3 girls out of about 200 students in my department. At work, most of the people in the company are guys. And in the SEIV community, it's mostly guys. I go to the gym and it's mostly guys there. Everywhere I go, it's mostly guys! In my estimation, the ratio of males to females in the world is not 1 to 1 but somewhere in between 10 to 1 and 100 to 1.I think you may be right!!! Ever seen how many women work in Land Surveying? Must be some kind of government coverup.

[ March 11, 2003, 11:30: Message edited by: DavidG ]

Wardad

March 11th, 2003, 07:49 PM

Originally posted by MacLeod:

I guess the 4x genre isn't very attractive to women. Why? Who cares, women are beyond the comprehension of mortal minds. My wife is from Roswell, and I understand her.

Aloofi

March 11th, 2003, 11:56 PM

Nah, girls don't care about strategy games in general. They kind of have their feet on the ground, if you know what I mean. I've tried a zillion times to get my wife to play, and the only ones I got her interested was in Caesar 3 and Simcity 3000. Who knows, maybe girls are not capable of abstract thinking... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif .

Cheeze

March 12th, 2003, 07:49 AM

Originally posted by Wardad:
My wife is from Roswell, and I understand her.Maybe your wife is Octurian. [obscure movie reference]

dogscoff

March 12th, 2003, 09:58 AM

They kind of have their feet on the ground, if you know what I mean. I've tried a zillion times to get my wife to play, and the only ones I got her interested was in Caesar 3 and Simcity 3000. Who knows, maybe girls are not capable of abstract thinking... .
My girlfriend often gets really hooked on soap operas. For a while now I've been toying with the idea of getting "The Sims" to try to draw her into gaming...

DirectorTsaarx

March 12th, 2003, 04:17 PM

I prefer to avoid generalizations about why women appear to avoid this game; however, in my particular situation, my girlfriend has a VERY low tolerance for micromanagement. Not to mention that she prefers a somewhat faster-paced game (not first-person-shooter twitch-game fast, but faster than SEIV).

Wardad

March 12th, 2003, 06:46 PM

Originally posted by DirectorTsaarx:
I prefer to avoid generalizations about why women appear to avoid this game; however, in my particular situation, my girlfriend has a VERY low tolerance for micromanagement. Not to mention that she prefers a somewhat faster-paced game (not first-person-shooter twitch-game fast, but faster than SEIV).A low tolorance for MM!!!! Damn, I married the wrong woman.