Horrible Doom

[ZeroAdunn]

Horrible doom on PBW. New game, check it out. Join, or I will send the mafia after you.

It is a P&N game, 12 players max (though we will most likely start before that) It is an RP game, with no surrender or gifting your empires away. Thought gifts will still be enabled.

The victory conditions are peace for 10 years, hopefully we will get some people who are not all about the peace, otherwise it will be a short game.

Also: We will be waiting for the next patch so all the cool toys in PBW that currently are bugged (due to the Xdamage to shields bug) can be used.

Any questions?

[dumbluck]

Are you going to wait for SJ's PBW Version? Is this a Gold game?

[ZeroAdunn]

As stated on the site, this will be a gold game. We are waiting for the next SEIV patch which I am informed should be out either this month or next. If there is a new Version of P&N by then, we will use it too.

[ZeroAdunn]

Any other quesitons?

[Fyron]

When will the host be joining the game?

[Suicide Junkie]

I'm almost done the changes for the latest PBW Version... There's a final tweaking of the cloaking techs, and the adding of mines and training facilities.

For the Version after that, I will be rebuilding the weapons to make more use of the fixed Xdamage types, and adding more dimensions to a lot of the techs.

[Matryx]

*applied to join*
I hope we can get the next P&N for this =D

*contemplating playing a pirate.. just for the hell of it*

[Ragnarok]

Originally posted by Matryx:


*contemplating playing a pirate.. just for the hell of it*<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Hey that reminds me of a joke..... This Pirate walks into a............. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif (Had to do it)

[ZeroAdunn]

Feel free to be a pirate, I myself will be a nomad. I will join when I finish my new racestyle, if I get it finished in time http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

[dumbluck]

My question might be better phrased this way: Is this going to be P&N, or P&N PBW? They are two different mods. Well, P&N PBW is really a mod of a mod, but who's counting.

[Ruatha]

Originally posted by Ragnarok:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Matryx:


*contemplating playing a pirate.. just for the hell of it*<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Hey that reminds me of a joke..... This Pirate walks into a............. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif (Had to do it)</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Arghh, It's driving me nuts!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif

[Ragnarok]

Originally posted by Ruatha:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Ragnarok:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Matryx:


*contemplating playing a pirate.. just for the hell of it*<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Hey that reminds me of a joke..... This Pirate walks into a............. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif (Had to do it)</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Arghh, It's driving me nuts!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">ROFLOL! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

[tbontob]

Thinking of joining... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

But what does the P & N mod do? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/confused.gif

And where can I go to get some information on it?

[ZeroAdunn]

It is going to be straight P&N. P&N on PBW (I believe) is only for originall SEIV, not gold.

The P&N mod does a lot. It was first created to Add pirates and Nomads (races that don't colonize) but has since expanded to add tons of new stuff. My favorite being battlemoons. It also expands on shields, adds new armor (and makes armor usefull) quasi-newtonian propulsion, etc, etc, I suggest you check it out, it is a great mod.

[Cirvol]

you should try for a gold game of p&n http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

(imho, at least;) too many good patches are only on gold)

[dumbluck]

I believe he's almost finished with the gold Version of P&N PBW. I think.

[Suicide Junkie]

My best description of the mod so far is, the one found Here (link) (http://www.sneakybuffalo.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=2486&highlight=pirates+nomads)

Here is my ToDo list for P&N PBW, which should be most of the items since I wrote that description above:
X add no-ai files
X add TDM formations
X add super popmodifiers file.
- Add stellar manip barge Hull Size
X Add larger stationary base hulls by the time Battlemoons are researched
90% switch to split cloaking tech.
X Split master computers into Covert and Standard.
X adjust prices for characteristics. (Be sure to look closely at the most common, and most ignored ones http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif )
X Divide racial armors into small pieces
X Copy in multi-level ECM and Combat Sensors
X Double strength of ECM components: Max modifier is now 112%
X fix minor image/sound bugs.
X disallow unit mounts on DU autocannons.
X recheck weapons for unit mounting and clean up availability list.
X Added boarding defense to command staff components (bridge & aux con).
X Change Allegiance Subverter into anti-boarding-defense Mental Shredder.
X Change Talisman into a vehicle mount.
X Add SpaceYard Expansion projects.
Y Convert to limited supplies mode.
- Add drones to Pirate races.
- Add seekers to fighters
X Repair small gravitic drive MP/kt settings.
X Change supply storage tech requirements to require resupply tech. Rename resupply tech to supply storage tech.
X Extend unit shield mounts to cover mini-shield generators.
X large drives!
X Scale up solar sails 10x, and add more levels.
- ruins & racial crossovers
X small racial armors.
X add more levels of shield regenerators (up to 2x rate at maxtech)
X Boost output of harmonic shielding to match regenerators.
X tweak mini-regenerators to match the full size regens.
X add more levels of solar collector tech.
Y Adjust prices & supply use of weapons.
X Adjust facility costs to reflect labour.
X Gun Nuts -200 kt to mount requirements.
X Redo mines & sweeping system
X Major training facilities are spaceborne.
X Training facilities only on maintenance-bearing bases. Cost scales as max% cubed or so. Max training fairly unlimited, but to double the training, you pay roughly 8x as much in maintenance.

[ January 21, 2003, 19:31: Message edited by: Suicide Junkie ]

[ZeroAdunn]

Cool, I guess we will wait for P&N on PBW gold then.

[Pax]

Originally posted by ZeroAdunn:
It is going to be straight P&N. P&N on PBW (I believe) is only for originall SEIV, not gold.<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">SJ has a new, Gold-compatible P&N-for-PBW coming out "soon" (see his post below).

[Suicide Junkie]

P&N v3.1 PBW (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/newuploads/1043201932.zip) is ready for the public!

Give it a whirl to explore the tech areas and racial techs and build rates and such.

Best to get any hidden bugs and questions/concerns out now http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[PvK]

What's the new mine/sweeping system like compared to the unmodded game?

PvK

[dumbluck]

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif
I don't have time for another game.
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

edit: But I applied to join anyway... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

[ January 25, 2003, 09:38: Message edited by: dumbluck ]

[Suicide Junkie]

Well, mines are weaker, and limited to 100 per sector.
The only way to clear mines is to grit your teeth and take the hits.

The point was to make mines always be somewhat useful, and also to try and get them spread out around the system.

I'll probably have to tweak the damage/cost settings based on player input.

[dumbluck]

Hmmm. SJ finished the gold PBW Version of P&N... the new gold patch was released today... and there are 3 or 4 people waiting to be accepted into the game...

This might be starting soon!

[dumbluck]

Is this game using the FQM, or the FQM Deluxe? CAN it use the FQM deluxe?

[Fyron]

It could only use FQM deluxe if another mod was made that combined P&N with FQM deluxe. Not that that would be hard to do, but it is what would be required to do. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[Suicide Junkie]

Well, I've uploaded 3.1c R3 to PBW, and left Geo a message that I did.

Thankfully I have high-speed access or all this uploading the exact same files with one-character differences would really get tedious http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[dumbluck]

Woo-Hoo! We're up to Revision 7 now! The problem is, the PBW site lists the mod used as r4. So, erm, which revision should I use to create my .emp file?

[Suicide Junkie]

Revision 6 increased the price of natural merchants, but other than that, the EMPs should be fine.

[ZeroAdunn]

SJ: If you make one more revision to P&N, well, I don't know what I will do, but lets just say it won't be pretty.

[Fyron]

Originally posted by Suicide Junkie:
Revision 6 increased the price of natural merchants, but other than that, the EMPs should be fine.<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Actually, that would invalidate all empire files.

[Suicide Junkie]

You sure? I thought it only invalidated if the number of traits changed. So, if costs or the order of things changed it would confuse things a bit but not totally choke.

In any case, you might as well use R7 when creating your EMP, since the game should be updated to it soon.

You should be able to edit an older EMP file to make sure it still works.

[ March 29, 2003, 19:58: Message edited by: Suicide Junkie ]

[Ed Kolis]

It should only invalidate your .emp file if you actually PICKED natural merchants, right? Otherwise, hey, they're in the same order, the ones you actually picked didn't change?

[Ed Kolis]

Hey everybody! Take a look on PBW! The game finally got upgraded to R7!

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Let's get those .emp files in so we can get started!

[Fyron]

Originally posted by Suicide Junkie:
You sure? I thought it only invalidated if the number of traits changed. So, if costs or the order of things changed it would confuse things a bit but not totally choke.

In any case, you might as well use R7 when creating your EMP, since the game should be updated to it soon.

You should be able to edit an older EMP file to make sure it still works.<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">It would be safest to just load up your .emp in R7, check it out, and resave it. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[Taera]

wondering, when the game starts? been stalled forever now.

[Ed Kolis]

2 Posts down from yours http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

We've just been waiting on Geo to upgrade the game to P&N blahblah R7, which he just did a few days ago! Hooray! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

[ZeroAdunn]

Yah, sorry for being away, life has been hectic lately. Get those emp files uploaded so we can begin! (Oh yah, I geuss I need to do that too http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif )

[dumbluck]

My emp is uploaded. Oh, yea, and I'm back. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Edit: Sigh. See what you get when you don't test the revision before uploading your emp file? I think I found a bug in revision 7. I'm gonna double check by re-downloading the zipped file...

2nd edit: It turns out that I had the wrong install, because a fresh install of the mod is bug free. So, now I'm off to UN-upload my emp file... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

[ April 26, 2003, 22:22: Message edited by: dumbluck ]

[jimbob]

It turns out that I had the wrong install, because a fresh install of the mod is bug free. So, now I'm off to UN-upload my emp file... <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Well, that's good news in a way, atleast we won't have to all go and redesign our races! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

So what's the deadline here? The game's been stalled for a long time (though understandably considering the revisions/optimization), and I'm really wanting to start! Unfortunately I'm thinking of pulling out of the P&N pre-gold game because it's been stalled for well over a month now http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

[dumbluck]

You aren't the only one, Jimbob. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif My baby's dieing!!! WAAAAAAAAAA!!!!

*sniff* And it was developing into a cool game, too, even if an early war did drag me far from the top of the leader board...

[ZeroAdunn]

I posted a new news item, get those empire files uploaded if you want to play!

[Taera]

now once and for all, WHAT VERSION OF P&N IS IT??? lol

[Fyron]

My baby's dieing!!! WAAAAAAAAAA!!!! <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">It started dying a long time ago...

[Taera]

bah fyron, have sympathy

[Fyron]

Umm... what are you talking about Taera? You are not in that game, so you are not really qualified to voice an opinion on it...

[Suicide Junkie]

"now once and for all, WHAT VERSION OF P&N IS IT??? lol"

3.1 PBW R7

[Taera]

fyron, read it again. cant i joke? if i dont add a lol or a smilie it cant be perceived as humour?

thanks SJ.

[Fyron]

Smileys are the internet equivalent of tonal inflection. There is nothing in your post indicating that you were joking instead of being serious.

[jimbob]

Dumbluck:

Sorry, I should have been more sensitive to your plight. Losing one's creation is never an easy thing http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif I had no idea that it was ailing at the begining though... guess I've just not played enough PBW to see the early symptoms of "resign-itis" and "turn-submission arythmia." A truely fatal disease if not treated rapidly from the looks of things http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Are you in on the new goldified P&N?? If not, jump in quick, I'm pretty sure there's room for a few more players. And if the non-gold P&N does get going again, I'll be in.

DeadMeat:

Did you ever recieve those P&N files I sent you? I realize that RL has been hectic, but my emails just disappeared into the "aether" and I've been wondering.

cheers all,
jimbob

[Suicide Junkie]

I was just reading the game forum, and saw a few things to add: Construction rates have been changed - no longer can you build at 2/3 the rate of a homeworld on your dinky little outPosts! You'll need to ferry population to your colonies if you want to increase their construction rate into four digits! In addition, spaceyards and resupply depots cost more, so you can't afford to build them everywhere you want to.<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">In addition, the resource production rates are highest for backwater colonies with moderate populations.
Too few people, and you don't have enough workers to get the work done.
Too many people, and the planet gets paved over http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif
The peak production happens close to 500M people and reaches up to 225%. Beyond that, the production bonus slowly declines, until it reaches 100% at about 2 billion people.

Spaceyards start at 10% of normal rate. For every 25M people you add, you get +1% rate. That means a regular little facility like a mineral miner takes 8 months on a brand-new colony unless you ship more people in.
When you have 100M people, that's 14%
When you have 1,000M people, that's 50%
When you have 64,000M people on a sphereworld, thats 2570% (!)

You'll immediately need to gather lots of radioactives, as they are much more important in P&N than in regular SE4 - for one thing, engines use a LOT of them! Supplies are also in short supply, at least if you use matter-based attacks such as depleted uranium cannons or missiles - a single Heavy Bombardment Missile shot can cost 300 supplies! (that's a 3 with two zeros!)<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">You start with Legacy Infrastructure, so you shouldn't have to worry about the rads right away. When colonizing, do keep rads in mind, because they will be important.

There are no resupply depots in this mod, so the only way to get more supplies is to use solar panels, or build new ships http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif
I highly reccommend building a base with "solar reactors" and lots of supply storage tanks. If you have the base and a ship in the same fleet, they will share supplies.
The ship will get filled up and can then go on its merry way, while the base refills using the solar panel.
Binary and Trinary systems will be especially useful as resupply areas. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Note that bases have limited supplies! You will need to send resupply ships, or have solar panels on them. You can also lay siege to them http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif
Watch out for the Pirates' Civilian ships though - they're completely undetectable, no matter what level scanners you have, and they pay only 20% of normal maintenance! Fortunately for a Normal player, they only come in sizes up to 250 kT, but unfortunately that's big enough for a Pirate to put one of his specialized 100kT mini spaceyards on!<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Cloaking is also heavily modified in this game:
Small shipsizes defeat gravitic sensors.
Master computers (Military) defeat Psychic sensors.
Stealth armor defeats passive sensors
Scattering armor defeats active sensors.
Tachyon diffUsers defeat temporal sensors.

Cloaking devices are available, but the top level sensors defeat the top level cloaking device, and they do not provide any gravitic cloaking.

Frigates can be made completely undetectable, just like the pirate civilian ships, but most of their mass will be devoted to the various cloaking devices, and you will have almost nothing left for payload.

PS:
Some basic designs you will probably need:
- Solar Power Plant
Base with 1 solar reactor, plus as many supply storage components as will fit.
Used as a resupply depot by fleeting with ships.

- Scoutship
Escort with about 10 ion engines, and supply tanks in the remaining space.
This will go about 10 speed, so you can really explore quickly. Use cheap mounts to save cash, since it dosen't stand a chance in combat anyways.

- Heavy Warship
Enough engines for about 5 speed, the rest divided up amongst weapons and shields/armor. This will be your heavy hitter. As tech improves, you can afford to get more speed.
Use premium mounted armor to boost hitpoints. Armored engines are also a good idea.

- Interceptor Warship
Enough engines for about 7 or 8 speed, the rest divided up amongst weapons and shields/armor. This will be your fast-response ship. Use in fleets, since they will be weaker than the heavy hitters missiles are probably a good idea, so you can stay away from the heavy hitter's guns. As tech improves, you can afford to get more speed or more guns. Use premium mounted armor to boost hitpoints. Armored engines are also a good idea.

- Minesweeper
Basic components, and as low a speed as is practical. You don't want to spend lots of rads on a ship that will die rapidly.
Load up on armor, and look for the best Cost per hitpoint ratio. Standard Armor III is probably your best bet, unmounted.

[Fyron]

The highest production bonus actually occurs at 661-764 population (221% bonus).

[Ed Kolis]

I did notice the lack of resupply depots when the game actually started... Surprised me, I almost thought the "solar reactors" were supposed to be Nomad tech but turns out they're essential! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Too bad you can't actually transfer supplies between ships like in Stars!... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

And too bad you can't set the population production bonuses to depend on the planet size... sure, 8000M might be "all paved over" for a regular planet, but what about a SPHEREWORLD http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

[Suicide Junkie]

It has come to my attention that there is a missing portrait for an image in the mod.

comp_286.bmp (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/newuploads/1053742248.bmp)
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/newuploads/1053742248.bmp

It is one of the original SE4 images, and so I never checked to see if it had a portrait; and it turns out it dosen't! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

So you can blame one of the SE4 artwork guys for this one http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Just download the above file, and add it to your images\components folder.

[ May 24, 2003, 07:20: Message edited by: Suicide Junkie ]

[dumbluck]

See that PBW game thread.

[mottlee]

Originally posted by Suicide Junkie:
It has come to my attention that there is a missing portrait for an image in the mod.

comp_286.bmp (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/newuploads/1053742248.bmp)
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/newuploads/1053742248.bmp

It is one of the original SE4 images, and so I never checked to see if it had a portrait; and it turns out it dosen't! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

So you can blame one of the SE4 artwork guys for this one http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Just download the above file, and add it to your images\components folder.<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">ME! ME! I'm the one in the Blue!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

[Ed Kolis]

So, what's up? Where's Zero been all this time?

[dumbluck]

I wish I knew.

Did you see my post in the game forum?

[ June 22, 2003, 23:35: Message edited by: dumbluck ]

[dumbluck]

Players: please check the game forum to see if we can get this game moving...

[Suicide Junkie]

P&N PBW r8.zip (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/newuploads/1057623448.zip)
A roman numeral typo in the name of training facilities, and a couple of bits in the organic seeker weapons targetting options.

[jimbob]

Sorry, I thought I was checking the forums, but had no new info there. I'll check it tomorrow... I'm ready to play!!

[jimbob]

[originally posted in another forum, reposted here, complete with large quantities of embarasment... but I'm still ticked off!]

Hey hey!

What happened to turn 18? I must have missed it, but it's really screwed up my game. I'm pretty steamed about it, because the AI (which I'm absolutely certain I turned off) wiped out my production [i]again[i] (I mean I was 1 frickin' turn away from completing very critical projects, using emergency build, and the damn computer told the ships to pack up and head for home!!!! Now, 8 turns later it all happens again!?!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif !??!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif !!?!?!? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif !? I'm pretty prepared to quit, cause basically I've played three "successful" turns out of 19 at this point).

I'm really ticked off, and I'm asking if other players would be willing to take back turn 19 and let me complete turn 18. See my message in PBW for more ranting, raving, general foaming at the mouth, choice words and threats of suicide.

jimbob

[ July 16, 2003, 17:29: Message edited by: jimbob ]

[jimbob]

bump...

hey gents, who's in charge now anyway? I've never administered a PBW before, but if nobody wants the job, I'd be willing to learn/take over the admin responsibilities.

And sorry about the rant, I had a bad day http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

cheers all y'all

[Ed Kolis]

(bump)

So, anyone know what's been up with this game for the past two months? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif