Tournament - Invulnerable Challenge [Archive]

Stone Mill

May 20th, 2003, 11:54 PM

Tournament Concept - Invulnerable Challenge

Please take a look at this... and let me know if it sounds interesting, or if there may be any barriers I may have overlooked in implementing it.

OVERVIEW
The Invulnerable challenge is open to any seasoned SEIV player looking for some abuse. Each player in the tournament will get one crack at winning a one-on-one match against a very tough AI opponent. The catch is that I will be playing the AI opponent for 100 turns or so, building up the toughest defense possible in their home system, before the game even starts. The tournament winner will be the player who captures or defeats the AI homeworld in the fewest amount of turns... if you live at all. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif
MAP
Will be the same for all players. Small quadrant. AI will have one warp point in their home system. (I'm contemplating disabling warp technology to force plaers to fight through the warp point. Not sure, though).
EMPIRE SETUP
All players will use the same empire file, to even the challenge, and facilitate game setup. At 100 turns, copies of the game files will be created for all tournament players so they have the exact same conditions at start. The player's 5000 point empire will be strong; a berserker race with +25 agressiveness/defensiveness, plus some special racial techs, to be determined. You'll need it.
PBW
The game file copies will be used to setup an individual game for each participant in the tourney.
COMPUTER / AI SETUP
You can bet I will be stringing together the toughest defensive I can think of using a 5000 point race. Suggestions are welcome via forum Messages. If you help with the defensive setup, you can't participate in the tourney.
STARTING TECH
High
COMPUTER BONUS
High
COMPUTER DIFFICULTY
High

What do you think? I'd like to try this in the summer.
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[ July 06, 2003, 05:02: Message edited by: Stone Mill ]

Ragnarok

May 21st, 2003, 12:09 AM

Hmm, I like this idea alot. It should prove to be very tough to take out an empire 100 turns more advanced then you are. You can count me in if you do it. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

narf poit chez BOOM

May 21st, 2003, 07:41 AM

by 100 i have all three colony techs and am working on the weapons and sheilds. and i'm hardly a micromanager. so since i don't have gold, that puts me in the suggestions? if it's gold, i got a few.

Fyron

May 21st, 2003, 08:23 AM

STARTING TECH
High
That's no fun.

narf poit chez BOOM

May 21st, 2003, 08:30 AM

missed that.

primitive

May 21st, 2003, 02:00 PM

Cool, I’m in.
So what’s the price ? A title and a belt (David Gervais http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif ) would be nice http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Stone Mill

May 21st, 2003, 05:31 PM

Originally Posted by Ragnarok
Hmm, I like this idea alot. It should prove to be very tough to take out an empire 100 turns more advanced then you are. You can count me in if you do it Cool, thanks�

Originally Posted by narf poit chez BOOM
so since i don't have gold, that puts me in the suggestions? if it's gold, i got a few It�s Gold. I�d be happy to hear your ideas on how to set up the defense.

Originally Posted by Imperator Fyron
STARTING TECH
High.

That's no fun The object for this game is to allow players all available tech to come up with their best invasion force as quickly as possible. Research is beyond the scope of this game. The AI will have max tech as well so I can set up what I believe to be an �impossible� defensive network.

Originally Posted by tecso
i am in. Race against the clock should be good.

I am guessing your going to place the game in stone at turn 100 and away we go... Cool. I think I can get what I want by turn 100. It�s going to be a b*tch to defeat. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Originally Posted by primitive
Cool, I�m in.
So what�s the price ? A title and a belt (David Gervais) would be nice That is an excellent proposal. I think I�ll ask David to develop an Icon for the winner�s signature.

rdouglass

May 21st, 2003, 07:19 PM

I'd be interested as long as I'm not competing against anyone that helped setup the AI's defense. That would definitely give those players an advantage. IMO anyone entering the tournament should have no knowledge whatsoever about the AI opponent except that they have a 100 turn head start...

</$.02>

Dralasite

May 21st, 2003, 09:53 PM

Just curious, is this going to be using custom AI files or a well known AI? I think custom could be a lot harder.

Also, make sure you can't trade star maps with the AI for its home planet http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

narf poit chez BOOM

May 21st, 2003, 10:02 PM

well, with one warppoint the obvious thing to do is dump mines, sats, bases, ships and the kitchen sink on the warppoint. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif we need some way to keep the players from reading the suggestions.

Stone Mill

May 22nd, 2003, 01:20 AM

narf poit chez BOOM,

you can simply use the "send private message" icon on the taskbar next to my name on one of my Posts. Neat feature in the forums.
I encourage anyone who can think of something nasty to do so...

Narrew

May 22nd, 2003, 01:25 AM

I am not a vet, but am interested anyway.

You said that everyone will have the same empire? who will design it?

tesco samoa

May 22nd, 2003, 01:33 AM

And I guess we will all be playing the same empire ????

For equal footing

tesco samoa

May 22nd, 2003, 01:49 AM

i am in. Race against the clock should be good.

I am guessing your going to place the game in stone at turn 100 and away we go...

Stone Mill

May 22nd, 2003, 03:06 AM

I will create a 5000 point race, with as many special techs as I can allow. I will diminish stats such as trade to beef up the more important ones.

That's right, everyone will use the same race empire to make it an even start. (I actually need to do this to fast forward 100 turns). Nevertheless, I will do my best to leave as many options open as possible for ship designs. You will have access to pretty much all tech areas to do with as you please.

Asmala

May 22nd, 2003, 11:14 AM

I'm in too. Nice to see how I get along with that tough AI. I have never played against computer except some testing.

BBegemott

May 23rd, 2003, 04:20 PM

Originally posted by Stone Mill:
you can simply use the "send private message" icon on the taskbar next to my name on one of my Posts. Neat feature in the forums.
I encourage anyone who can think of something nasty to do so...
I just did it. I hope it will be some help http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Cheeze

May 23rd, 2003, 07:16 PM

This oughta be fun. I'm sure I'll be one of those who either takes many, many more turns than most to win. Or more likely, I'll die in a brutal and swift execution.

Either way, it could be interesting for spectators!

tesco samoa

May 23rd, 2003, 08:49 PM

you know what would be cool.... The winner ( least amount of turns ) designs the next challenge http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Stone Mill

May 23rd, 2003, 10:17 PM

Originally posted by BBegemott:
<blockquote>quote:<hr /> Originally posted by Stone Mill:
you can simply use the "send private message" icon on the taskbar next to my name on one of my Posts. Neat feature in the forums.
I encourage anyone who can think of something nasty to do so...
I just did it. I hope it will be some help http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif <hr /></blockquote>BBegemott, your suggestions are great. I just wrote you back.

I feel sorry for you fools who are going to try this. This Tournament will just be plain abusive.

BBegemott

May 24th, 2003, 09:09 AM

Originally posted by Stone Mill:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />
Originally posted by BBegemott:

<blockquote>quote:<hr />
Originally posted by Stone Mill:
you can simply use the "send private message" icon on the taskbar next to my name on one of my Posts. Neat feature in the forums.
I encourage anyone who can think of something nasty to do so...
I just did it. I hope it will be some help
<hr /></blockquote>BBegemott, your suggestions are great. I just wrote you back.

I feel sorry for you fools who are going to try this. This Tournament will just be plain abusive.
<hr /></blockquote>Yeah, there will be no winners http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif sorry guys. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Nodachi

May 25th, 2003, 01:57 AM

I could use some abuse, count me in!

I like Tesco's idea of having the winner design the next challenge. Challenge league anyone?

Stone Mill

May 28th, 2003, 06:34 PM

Originally posted by Nodachi:
I could use some abuse, count me in!

I like Tesco's idea of having the winner design the next challenge. Challenge league anyone?This is a fine idea. By all means the winner will have the right to design the next one.

FYI: I've gotten some pretty harsh suggestions. I almost feel guilty about using some of this stuff. Almost . http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

But I'm not kidding. I'm going to try and playtest it first to ensure there is at least a sliver of hope for victory. As of right now, I would be very impressed with anyone who could beat this.

If you think you are one bad SEIV player... I dare you to take the challenge! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Status: concept still under development

narf poit chez BOOM

May 29th, 2003, 08:05 AM

and i'm glad to say, nodachi,
Short ranged nuclear artillery. Am I the only one who sees a problem here? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif
you aren't the only one. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

Nodachi

May 29th, 2003, 07:57 PM

Originally spewed forth by Stone Mill http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif
FYI: I've gotten some pretty harsh suggestions. I almost feel guilty about using some of this stuff. Almost . Good!! I see this as an excellent training tool for players, newbie and vet alike.

tesco samoa

May 29th, 2003, 09:51 PM

This is a fine idea. By all means the winner will have the right to design the next one.

FYI: I've gotten some pretty harsh suggestions. I almost feel guilty about using some of this stuff. Almost .

But I'm not kidding. I'm going to try and playtest it first to ensure there is at least a sliver of hope for victory. As of right now, I would be very impressed with anyone who could beat this.

If you think you are one bad SEIV player... I dare you to take the challenge!

Status: concept still under development Stone Mill Remember only you play like you http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

The rest of us will attack the problem from different angles.....

Perhaps you might be surprised at the tatics.

I suggest that the games be set up on PBW.

That way they can be kept track of... Or are you saying....

here is the game....

Go !

P.S.

Set a time line for when the challenge ends !

geoschmo

May 29th, 2003, 09:55 PM

If I understand the concept behind this, the only real reason to put it on PBW is to prevent players from going back a few turns every time something happens they don't like. If you think that will be a problem then PBW is the way to go.

Geoschmo

Stone Mill

May 29th, 2003, 10:36 PM

Geo,

I would very much like to set this up on PBW. I think that it would help tracking, administration, and help promote a level playing field.

If you see any barriers to what I propose, please let me know.

Also I am considering setting up a simple tournament web page just for fun when this kicks off.

Tesco- you have good points. Glad to see the fighting spirit. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Nodachi- Hmmm... this may be a learning experience for newbies... if newbies want a learning experience that makes them say "What the F?!?!" and scream incessantly while they run up and down the street banging their heads on random objects. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

Nodachi

May 30th, 2003, 06:01 AM

Stone Mill- That's my point. Getting your butt handed to you is one of the best ways to learn! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

tesco samoa

May 30th, 2003, 06:53 AM

you sure nod... you seem to buck the trend http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

Nodachi

May 30th, 2003, 08:02 AM

Gee, thanks Tesco. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

Actually, I have learned from getting my butt handed to me, How many games am I your ally instead of your opponent? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

tesco samoa

May 30th, 2003, 08:13 PM

Yes I have fond memories of declaring war on you in every game we were playing together in a span of one week

Nodachi

May 31st, 2003, 05:56 AM

Yeah, I remember one (Adamant 5, I think) where I was glad that you finally finished me off, I was running out of creative ways to tell the galaxy that your race was evil!

In truth there have been only a few games that have really taught me about how to play. The Koth games have taught me how to build my empire and expand (although I'm still working on that http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif ). I think the pace of the KOTH games is what helps, the turns come in so quickly that you don't have time to lose focus of what you're doing. I just wish more people would be willing to try different and unusual settings.

I play for fun, as a way to relax. I don't care if I win or not (not that I lose on purpose, beleive it or not http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif ), I just want to have a good time. Now if I can just get RL off my back for awhile I'd be good to go! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Nodachi

June 6th, 2003, 07:05 AM

Hey Stone, how's this coming along? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Stone Mill

June 6th, 2003, 04:07 PM

The concept is coming along pretty well. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif I think this will be fun.

I will try to come up with a good estimate of when I will roll this out.

I need to finish one more strategy article. Then I will get on the Invulnerable Challenge.

Also, I'm somewhat cursed by my own KOTH victories... As long as I win there is a fresh contender immediately trying to pull me off!

Stone Mill

June 9th, 2003, 02:17 PM

Update:

Intel will not be part of this challenge.

I don't think the AI handles it well enough; and in order to give the AI some defense, I need to load it up with some intel points. Because of this, there is a very large chance that the player will be bombarded unrecoverrably upon making contact.

I'm not sure that I could set it up in a fair manner... and I'm not sure it should end via Puppet Political Party.

This challenge will revolve around traditional forces. Hope this is ok. If you feel different, let me know. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

tesco samoa

June 9th, 2003, 05:12 PM

sounds good. no intel is fine by me.

Ragnarok

June 9th, 2003, 05:53 PM

Fine by me as well. I look forward to finally getting my arse handed to me on a silver platter by the AI. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Stone Mill

June 9th, 2003, 06:13 PM

HISTORY

Many years have passed since your people have left behind the terrible truth. As a powerful and extraordinarily advanced race, your people have mastered all known scientific and racial technologies. But the fruits of research were reaped only through the scourge of war. You now live in peace; a peace that has been so pleasant and long Lasting, the terrible history of vicious conflict is but a vague memory. Until now.

A monstrous race of pirates has razed your fringe colonies, killing every Last citizen. The raiders shocked your high leadership because of the relative ease they sliced through defenses. They are backed by technical apt and vicious prowess only known to one other race� yours. Panic spread throughout your worlds. Citizens demand that something be done� and questions surface about these attackers, who seem strangely familiar.

The high council has appointed you as the military commander to address this threat. During your briefing, you are privy to information that chills your bones. Your people originated on a distant paradise far away. After centuries of clan fighting and contests with other races in the quadrant, your peoples united under a single rule. Your homeworld paid the price, however, and was abandoned via a mass exodus that is described loosely in legends. The shock lies within the details revealed only to you now:

In the process of creating the perfect warrior and elevating scientific knowledge, your people commonly toyed with genetic tests, especially on prisoners from other clans. These horrific tests often resulted in great success, but eventually erupted to a tragedy that could no longer be controlled. The Invulnerable monstrosities created by your scientists turned on their masters and plagued society, slaughtered millions, and poisoned the planet. They could only be stopped by making a drastic choice� to leave home and annihilate anything left behind. Your people did not look back.

The very threat you left behind centuries ago has proved stronger than the final measure employed to stop them. Your currently peaceful race must once take up arms and destroy this danger once for all before it consumes all life as you know it. You must be strong enough to take� The Invulnerable Challenge!

Nodachi

June 9th, 2003, 06:38 PM

Too cool! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Great work Stone Mill!

Ragnarok

June 9th, 2003, 06:54 PM

I soiled my pants a couple times just readnig the History of the game. I don't want to know what I'll do when I actually play it. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

primitive

June 9th, 2003, 07:01 PM

The Nindra's stand in awe of the ghosts from their past who has come to haunt them. Too long they have lived in peace, growing soft and complacent with their achivements.
Only one man has been true to the old warrior code, only one man can lead them. Will the Irresistible force wielded by the man called Primitive be enough ?

Nice work Stone.
What sort of race should we prepare ?

Stone Mill

June 9th, 2003, 07:45 PM

Thanks guys. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Originally posted by primitive:
The Nindra's stand in awe of the ghosts from their past who has come to haunt them. Too long they have lived in peace, growing soft and complacent with their achivements.
Only one man has been true to the old warrior code, only one man can lead them. Will the Irresistible force wielded by the man called Primitive be enough ?

Nice work Stone.
What sort of race should we prepare ?Primitive, unfortunately, to forward the game 100 turns and build up the AI empire, I need to use the same player empire for all players in the tournament.

I will post the details of the player file shortly. I will say that it has all racial techs. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[ June 09, 2003, 18:50: Message edited by: Stone Mill ]

Stone Mill

June 27th, 2003, 10:44 PM

Got a Web page up now: Invunerable Challenge (http://www.millerhq.com/inv.htm)

Making good progress... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

rextorres

June 27th, 2003, 11:09 PM

I'm up for a little abuse!!

Ragnarok

June 27th, 2003, 11:14 PM

Looks nice Stone Mill! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif I am getting goosey pimples* just thinking about playing this AI you are putting together. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

*) Movie referance. Can anyone name it?

Stone Mill

June 30th, 2003, 03:42 AM

Rags- thanks! I'm sure I heard the movie reference... but can't seem to place it. I'm stumped. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/confused.gif

Rextorres, glad to have you aboard. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Also added Joachim as a contender. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

I'd love to give an ETA on this, I am near running a test session on PBW to ensure everything works out. Hopefully we'll have kickoff within 2 weeks... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Cheeze

June 30th, 2003, 05:46 AM

Just when I thought I would start cutting DOWN on the number of SEIV games I was playing..oh well! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

With all the doom and fear, the terrorized populace hears some music start playing:

When it comes crashing down, and it hurts inside,
ya' gotta take a stand, it don't help to hide,
Well, you hurt my friends, and you hurt my pride,
I gotta be a man; I can't let it slide,
I am a real American, Fight for the rights of every man,
I am a real American, fight for what's right, fight for your life!

A familiar figure clad in red and yellow appears to answer the challenge!! "Well let me tell you something brother!! Whatcha gonna do, when the most powerful force in the universe runs wild on you?" [insert series of muscular poses and holding a hand up to the ear here]

Ragnarok

June 30th, 2003, 06:16 AM

Originally posted by Stone Mill:
Rags- thanks! I'm sure I heard the movie reference... but can't seem to place it. I'm stumped. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/confused.gif
Answer: Rat Race. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Baron Grazic

June 30th, 2003, 07:09 AM

Thank history won me over Stonemill.
Tell the AI to come on over and stomp me...

Stone Mill

July 1st, 2003, 02:30 PM

Got ya aboard, Baron http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif .

Cheeze, you are a mental patient. But that just may be enough to win this thing... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

But remember...
To Be THE MAN ...
Ya got to BEAT THE MAN...

WHOOOOOOOOOO!
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif

Stone Mill

July 1st, 2003, 02:35 PM

OK... I need some advice. I picked out the ship set for the bad guys. That was easy. Space sharks was a perfect fit. Props to Trooper.

Any preferences for the ship set for the (your)player file?
Any suggestions welcome... I do have to pick one.

(Remember, I have made the player race. It is a 5000 point race with all racial techs, evenly matched against the AI race.)

Cheeze

July 1st, 2003, 05:20 PM

I do have a liking for the United Flora Empire, but I think for the challenge I feel like choosing old school. I like the overall look of the CueCappa, the smooth lines of the UkraTal and the general fuzziness on the Drushocka.

Stoney, just remember that I'm a limousine-riding, learjet-flying, rolex-wearing, wheeling-dealing sonofagun! WHOOOO!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Stone Mill

July 1st, 2003, 05:33 PM

Thanks, Cheeze.

Funny you mention the Flora. However, I don't think they quite fit the scenario.

And I do like the "old School" shipsets...

But I was hoping this could be an opportunity for one of our in-house shipset artists to get some free advertising. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

To be honest with you, I was looking at the Babylon 5 shipset and thinking that they could resemble a break-away race from the Space Sharks.

primitive

July 1st, 2003, 06:15 PM

Whatever you choose, pick a race that have a baseship image. Got a feeling I will need quite a few of those http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

This is going to be fun http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

BBegemott

July 1st, 2003, 07:13 PM

Players contributing to the design may play the challenge for fun, but they are excluded from officially winning the tournament. I'd like to have some fun gazing at that monster http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif plz sign me in.

P.S. Stone Mill, how many turns did it take you to destroy the homeworld? (if it is not a secret... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif )

Stone Mill

July 1st, 2003, 08:00 PM

BBegemott- I'll sign you up (as a contributor). http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif

I'm doing a concept test with a prototype right now, to make sure I have all the PBW stuff done correctly. I want to make sure players have an easy time and that it works as I believe.

I have not yet set up the official map. I imagine that will go quickly after my test. I do plan to give it a quick run-through. I'm not even sure just yet how it will go...
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

[ July 01, 2003, 19:02: Message edited by: Stone Mill ]

spoon

July 1st, 2003, 08:33 PM

Originally posted by BBegemott:
<blockquote>quote:<hr /> Players contributing to the design may play the challenge for fun, but they are excluded from officially winning the tournament. I'd like to have some fun gazing at that monster http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif plz sign me in.
<hr /></blockquote>Ditto for me. Sounds like fun.

Stone Mill

July 2nd, 2003, 01:56 AM

Very good! Thanks, spoon. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Updated the page. I think I have everyone of late.

TerranC

July 2nd, 2003, 02:12 AM

I'll probably regret this: Sign me up.

Cheeze

July 2nd, 2003, 04:19 PM

Wow! I'm up on the challenge page twice!! That could mean I'm good!

More likely, it means I will be getting pummeled twice as badly!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif

Stone Mill

July 2nd, 2003, 04:25 PM

TerranC- welcome... (heh heh heh another victim) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Cheeze, perhaps I should add your name a few more times !!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Word in the quadrant is that your military commander is a cross-eyed buffoon who can't find his way to the ring... never mind defeat the Invulnerable enemy!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[ July 02, 2003, 15:25: Message edited by: Stone Mill ]

Cheeze

July 3rd, 2003, 05:58 AM

Stone, don't try to get everyone to rise and salute while you sing the Mercator national anthem. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

It would be great to see a cool new shipset. I enjoy discovering what the ships look like as I build them. I just hope the light cruisers, battleships and baseships look even better than the frigates and destroyers....I'd hate to lose just to satisfy my esthetic sense, such as it is. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

Stone Mill

July 3rd, 2003, 04:08 PM

Update!!!

The Invulnerable Challenge will begin this (July 4th) weekend!!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif

So do push-ups and sit-ups and jog for 3 miles a day... or whatever warm-up exercises you need to do.

Shipsets: Your Challenger shipet will be Narn. The enemy will use Space Sharks. Two of our Favorites. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

I will set each of you up with a game on PBW. I'm hoping we can set a target end-date by say... October 2003?

Ragnarok

July 3rd, 2003, 06:21 PM

Originally posted by Stone Mill:

I will set each of you up with a game on PBW. I'm hoping we can set a target end-date by say... October 2003?October?! I plan on getting beat faster then that! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif Heck, I could probably have my game done in less then a week if all goes well. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Stone Mill

July 3rd, 2003, 07:34 PM

I'm hoping it goes much quicker as well... But things do come up... we'll see how it goes!

Stone Mill

July 6th, 2003, 05:47 AM

The Invulnerable Challenge (http://www.millerhq.com/inv.htm) is ready. Note the following:

-- The AI has been played to turn 57 to my satisfaction. The AI bonus was not used. The AI (high) bonus will go into effect when your match starts.

-- You have a 10 homeworld start to get things rolling. This means something very horrific waiting for you at the other end of the equation. Do not be surprised; the AI home system has been "hooked up."

-- You do not have advanced knowledge of the map. Finding the AI home system is part of the fun. Of course, the AI will have colonized much along the way by the time you find it. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif You will know it when you are there. Pray you at least get to take a peek inside, so you can die with honor. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

--The game in it's current state is not "unwinnable." This means that the game has not been devised to be unfinishable or completely unreasonable. Just very, very, very hard. Of course, the AI may choose to do something quite weird... In this rare event where the game is not perceived as fair, I'll have a look and we'll work something out.

-- Of course, If (when http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif )the AI trounces you legitimately and you've had enough, just say "uncle."

Good luck, victims. May the Force mave mercy on your soul. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

[ July 06, 2003, 05:22: Message edited by: Stone Mill ]

Joachim

July 6th, 2003, 10:22 AM

Hooray! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif
I hope you have kept notes of what and how you did the defence for discussion post comp?

Is there anything we need to do or will it appear on PBW? (forgive the Newb question).

Stone Mill

July 7th, 2003, 01:59 AM

Originally posted by Joachim:
Hooray! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif
I hope you have kept notes of what and how you did the defence for discussion post comp?

Is there anything we need to do or will it appear on PBW? (forgive the Newb question).Absoloutely!! I can't wait for the debrief. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif Most of the discussion will involve profanity, I expect. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

I am setting them up on PBW. You should see your game shortly. This morning, however, PBW doesn't seem to let me set up the games. I'm checking with Geo...

Stone Mill

July 7th, 2003, 02:36 AM

My apologies for this... but PBW can't be used for this tournament. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Instead, please get your zipped .gam files from the web page.

I'm very sorry, as it was my goal to ease the administration of these games. Now it looks like players will have to run the games on your local machines. Hope this isn't too big of a hassle. If it is, I understand.

The deal with PBW is that only one original .gam file can exist in the processing directory. And copying/remaming the files would not work, as the game would not recognize anything but the original.

So please email me with any questions or assistance. Good luck out there... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Joachim

July 7th, 2003, 05:42 AM

Cool, So I have downloaded the game and race pics and started it off. Exactly how do I process it on my machine? Do I do my turn then reload as host and execute then do turn reload etc? Is there anything I need to know?

Do I need a specific AI race for the AI to be? How do I make sure it is the right one?

Sorry for the Q's.

Baron Grazic

July 7th, 2003, 05:56 AM

A couple of good questions, Joachim.
I'll wait for the answers before I download the turn.
I'll be able to do the turns a lot quicker off-line anyway, plus my Wife will like me playing the turns on the couch next to her with the laptop, instead of the study... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Baron Grazic

July 7th, 2003, 07:26 AM

No-one else seems to be around at the moment.
So I think these are the instructions.
You must have TDM 3.30 installed, which will give you the AI races and shipsets.
You sign in as player 1, and do your turn.
Then you sign in as the host and Process the turn.
Then sign back in as your self and continue the game.

I'm sorry the score is available, it doesn't give me much hope of surviving. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

Stone Mill

July 7th, 2003, 02:27 PM

Originally posted by Baron Grazic:
No-one else seems to be around at the moment.
So I think these are the instructions.
You must have TDM 3.30 installed, which will give you the AI races and shipsets.
You sign in as player 1, and do your turn.
Then you sign in as the host and Process the turn.
Then sign back in as your self and continue the game.

I'm sorry the score is available, it doesn't give me much hope of surviving. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif Thanks Baron... that is correct! Only one clarification... the Space Sharks can be downloaded separately at State of the Art Spaceyards (http://diesel2035.free.fr/index.htm)
(If you don't download the shipset, the game will assign a random one from your system).

Yes, I left the score on as a little intimidation factor. Again... my disclaimer... this game is not fair! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[ July 07, 2003, 13:27: Message edited by: Stone Mill ]

Joachim

July 7th, 2003, 02:32 PM

Oh my .... The score is rather frightening http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

Ok, I do my turn, then load game and log on as host, execute turn, put new turns into new folder in save game directory labelled Inv_2 etc then load game and repeat...

is this correct (it seems to be working) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/confused.gif
is there an easier way?

geoschmo

July 7th, 2003, 02:53 PM

Stone Mill, did you get my email? If you set this up as Simultaneous Hotseat it will be a lot easier on the players to play. They won't have to mess with the host process.

Geoschmo

Stone Mill

July 7th, 2003, 04:58 PM

Yes Geo... thanks. Had we predicted that PBW could not be used, I would have definitely set it up that way.

I can still set it up as you mention, but of course, I would have to re-do the challenge. That would take me a bit longer... the quickest I could do it would be end of next weekend.

Let me know what you guys think:
--If you don't like having to log in as host to generate the turn, and if you can wait, I will set up the challenge as hot seat.
--If you are ok with playing it as-is, let me know.

TerranC

July 7th, 2003, 05:28 PM

I think it'll be much easier and faster as a Hotseat game IMHO.

Ragnarok

July 7th, 2003, 05:31 PM

Originally posted by TerranC:
I think it'll be much easier and faster as a Hotseat game IMHO.I think it would be alot faster and easier too. But if it stays as is I will still play and get beat. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Cheeze

July 7th, 2003, 05:35 PM

I think I am less than one year into this game. I've started setting things up in the home system as I would like, and I've started branching out and exploring. I am far TOO relaxed right now...the beatings are about to start. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

My ships have seen the Shark behemoths wandering around the galaxy. Any ONE of those ships would be quite a handful for whatever ragtag defenses I could throw together.

[ July 07, 2003, 17:37: Message edited by: Cheeze ]

Stone Mill

July 7th, 2003, 06:37 PM

Any other opinions? As of right now, I'm leaning toward making it hotseat.

Cheeze, please hold off... I don't want you to get too far into it just yet if we decide to do a re-start.

I really feel guilty anyway. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif You are going to have to play this thing out a large number of turns to even have a chance of building a force substantial enough.... I'm wondering if I made it too tough (as is). http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/confused.gif If I re-do it, I will have a chance to tweak it a little too. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Asmala

July 7th, 2003, 07:33 PM

I think it's not a big problem though the game isn't hot seat. Just make two shortcuts on your desktop, one launches the turn and one process it. You can even make a keyboard shortcuts so the turn processing is extremely easy http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif

BBegemott

July 7th, 2003, 09:09 PM

Stone Mill writes:
That would take me a bit longer... the quickest I could do it would be end of next weekend.
Wait one more week? Nope. I'll better live with this little discomfort than wait that long. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Asmala writes:
Just make two shortcuts on your desktop, one launches the turn and one process it. You can even make a keyboard shortcuts so the turn processing is extremely easy
Could you explain this in more detail, please?

Baron Grazic

July 8th, 2003, 01:16 AM

I'm only 7 turns into the game, have setup my Home System, and have just started to explore.
I'll stop and wait for the hotseat game.

Weird start year - 2405.7 Do you want to start the game at 2405.0 or another round number?

[ July 08, 2003, 00:18: Message edited by: Baron Grazic ]

primitive

July 8th, 2003, 10:02 AM

Wow,

Stone, I’ll play the challenge any way you make it. I’m saving it until a rainy day anyway, so I can play this in one continuous streak.

Stone Mill

July 8th, 2003, 05:08 PM

Folks,

After considering the Posts...

I'm going to ask you all to try and play as is. It seems most of you are more anxious to get going, and I don't want to keep you waiting. Please try it out and see how it goes... so...

The Invulnerable Challenge has Officially Begun!!!

For those of you who find the extra step too annoying, my apologies. I can't really commit to a timeframe to re-doing the challenge via hotseat. My wife is expecting our first child this weekend... any day now... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/confused.gif and if that happens... well... you know, I'll be busy. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

So if there are any questions unanswered (I think most of you have the gist of how to process a simultaneous game), please ask again.

Turn 57 is an odd number. Just think of "Heinz 57." If I played out 3 more turns to get it to 60, you'd really be in trouble!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Asmala- I do not know exactly how to set up the shortcuts- could you elaborate a bit on the steps? I know using the Matrix Mod Launcher helps...

[ July 08, 2003, 16:10: Message edited by: Stone Mill ]

Stone Mill

July 8th, 2003, 06:21 PM

The point of this game is pretty much suicide.

I really will be surprised if anyone can take out the AI home system. Go big or stay home. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif
The reason I put this together is that as I was playing, I thought... "Wouldn't that be a darn tough defense... hmmm... " I've always wanted to set it up to see how difficult it proves. Well, now it is in your hands.

One thing I promise is that even if you have to throw in the towel, you may learn some interesting things, or get some new ideas about defense...

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Asmala

July 8th, 2003, 09:12 PM

Here is the code of my batch files. Notice that when you run the Run turn.bat it informs that it's ready. However the turn is still processing at the backround (you can see it using for example ctr-alt-del)

The Invulnerable Challenge.bat:
<blockquote>code:<hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">"C:\Games\Space Empires IV Gold\se4.exe" "C:\Games\Space Empires IV Gold\TDM-ModPack\Savegame\inv.gam" "password" "1" "TDM-ModPack"</pre><hr /></blockquote>Run turn.bat:
<blockquote>code:<hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">"C:\Games\Space Empires IV Gold\se4.exe" "C:\Games\Space Empires IV Gold\TDM-ModPack\Savegame\inv.gam" "maximum" "0" "TDM-ModPack"</pre><hr /></blockquote>

Stone Mill

July 8th, 2003, 10:49 PM

Asmala, thank you!! I'm sure that will help. I'll try them out tonight.

Stone Mill

July 9th, 2003, 08:48 PM

I would love to hear some updates on the Challenger's progression.

Since I can't check in on your progression...

Can you all post in this thread or shoot me an email that you have begun, and maybe how far you've progressed?

What do you think about starting another thread called "Invulnerable Challenge - Spoilers" where players can post their progress, summaries, and debriefs? Participants can post their wrap-ups there, and this way, other players refrain from reading other participants' spoiler Posts (unless they really want to).

Since this game is run on the honor system, and, really, it's all about having fun, I don't think that would be a problem. I think many of us would find that very enjoyable...

Erax

July 10th, 2003, 04:04 AM

Hi all. Considering that the Olympics are coming up, I decided to pick up this Challenge as a training tool. I don't expect to win, I just want to learn something along the way.

I started playing yesterday and am currently on turn 82. It's supposed to be hard and I've made a lot of mistakes, so the Sharks will probably have me for lunch. I'll see how long I can Last, then play a second time (and a third, fourth...).

I'm all for a spoilers thread, I'm curious to learn about other players' strategies and how well (or in my case, how badly) we are doing.

Stone Mill

July 10th, 2003, 04:13 AM

Welcome, and have fun, Erax!

Remember, you should not have that much trouble "surviving," but I can't really say how the AI will perform. Turn 85 is pretty far along...
The goal is to take down it's home system. Therein lies the rub...

Erax

July 10th, 2003, 04:23 AM

Their home system ? I'd be happy if I could contain them. Right now they have access to some of my systems while my ships are all in the wrong places to do much against their colonies.

Stone Mill

July 10th, 2003, 04:17 PM

Originally posted by BBegemott:
Turn 2416.2

I have removed Sharks from all the systems except their home. A turn before I collected a fleet of ~250 dreads and baseships and warped in... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif More than half of my ships were destroyed in the first volley http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif However the defenders also suffered greately- half of their bases were sent into oblivion.
I really doubt if they will be able to resist the second attack wave http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Stone Mill- would you like me to send you the combat turn?Nice!!! Please send it to me! I want to see how it plays out, however. I'm curious to see how some of the other elements do.

I'm going to fire up the "spoilers" thread for game debriefs... so players who don't want tips don't read how you went about it (unless they want to).

All, please note that BBegemott helped me set up the defense- he can't "oficially win" the tourney is still wide open... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[ July 10, 2003, 15:29: Message edited by: Stone Mill ]

Erax

July 10th, 2003, 07:18 PM

He did provide a nice benchmark : I'll try to bottle the sharks in their home system by 2416.2. Will I make it ?

BBegemott

July 11th, 2003, 01:10 AM

Turn 2416.2

I have removed Sharks from all the systems except their home. A turn before I collected a fleet of ~250 dreads and baseships and warped in... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif More than half of my ships were destroyed in the first volley http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif However the defenders also suffered greately- half of their bases were sent into oblivion.
I really doubt if they will be able to resist the second attack wave http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Stone Mill- would you like me to send you the combat turn?

Baron Grazic

July 14th, 2003, 08:20 AM

About 15 turns into the Game and my Light Cruiser has made First Contact with a SpaceShark's Baseship http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

Asmala

July 15th, 2003, 10:18 PM

I started today and I'm now at turn 2407.2. Not much happened yet. I have explored two thirds of the map (not very player-friendly with all those nebulas http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif ) and a while ago I met the Space Sharks.

Ragnarok

July 15th, 2003, 10:29 PM

I will probably be starting tomorrow on my game. I grealy look forward to it from all the comments made so far. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

cybersol

July 18th, 2003, 04:02 AM

I am back from vacation, is it too late to join the invulnerable challenge? I've always been a glutton for punishment.

Baron Grazic

July 18th, 2003, 04:58 AM

I don't see why not, it's not on PBW.
The link to the web site is in StoneMills sig, where you can download the turn file.

Baron Grazic

July 18th, 2003, 07:14 AM

Question StoneMill?
I can see a Warp point from "Phad" leading to "Asellus Tertius" but where is the warp point leading back?
Was this intentional to have a one-way Warp Point?

Update:- Star Date 2408.3
Just captured my first SpaceSharks planet. They hadn't launched their Satellites from Cargo.
The SpaceSharks have pleasingly allowed me to colonise 2/3rds of the Galaxy. Now to box them in...

Edit :- Their also seems to be a one-way Warp Point from "Gamma Triangulil" to "Hercules"

[ July 18, 2003, 06:16: Message edited by: Baron Grazic ]

Stone Mill

July 18th, 2003, 06:12 PM

Originally posted by Baron Grazic:
Question StoneMill?
I can see a Warp point from "Phad" leading to "Asellus Tertius" but where is the warp point leading back?
Was this intentional to have a one-way Warp Point?

Update:- Star Date 2408.3
Just captured my first SpaceSharks planet. They hadn't launched their Satellites from Cargo.
The SpaceSharks have pleasingly allowed me to colonise 2/3rds of the Galaxy. Now to box them in...

Edit :- Their also seems to be a one-way Warp Point from "Gamma Triangulil" to "Hercules"Yep... Just a little havoc I threw into the map. I also didn't want the AI to bust out and slaughter you without giving you a chance. BTW, please post stuff like this in "Spoilers." http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif Enjoy, fellas!

Stone Mill

July 18th, 2003, 06:14 PM

Originally posted by cybersol:
I am back from vacation, is it too late to join the invulnerable challenge? I've always been a glutton for punishment.Please do...
Baron Advises correctly (thanks)! Have fun and ask any questions... the basics are on the web page (link in my sig).

primitive

July 18th, 2003, 06:51 PM

Stone:

Any pebbles yet http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

geoschmo

July 18th, 2003, 06:52 PM

Stone Mill, I have begun. Nothing to report yet, I just started. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Stone Mill

July 18th, 2003, 08:17 PM

Originally posted by primitive:
Stone:

Any pebbles yet http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif LOL!!!

You must have some serious intuition my friend... "Pebbles" (from the Flintstones) is quite accurate!
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif
Details to follow!

Stone Mill

July 19th, 2003, 01:36 AM

Now that my little girl Sophie (Pebbles) has finally settled in at home... I had a few minutes to update the Tourney page. I think I have everyone's info so far. Please keep me advised of your updates...
Stop the Sharks before it's too late...

Narrew

July 19th, 2003, 02:27 AM

Well I am at 2412.1 and just made a sphere world, with another right behind it. I have the Sharks backed up. But as I am still new I have no idea if my stratgy will work or not, we shall see... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

cybersol

July 22nd, 2003, 11:34 PM

Just wanted to announce that I have started the challenge today. Still no contact with the Sharks, though.

Stone Mill

July 25th, 2003, 03:40 PM

Just wanted to let you know, the tourney page has been updated again...

Please let me know your start date if I don't have it covered.

No "official" winners as of yet but BBegemott has successfully dismantled the defense. SO there is hope.

In the spoilers thread, lots of curses and setbacks!!! Surprisingly strong aggressiveness by the SpaceSharks in some games. Also, many players putting together the puzzle...

It's not too late to give it a try. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[ July 25, 2003, 14:55: Message edited by: Stone Mill ]