Highliner Mod - 1.04b - PBW Observations & Patch [Archive]

General Woundwort

June 8th, 2003, 12:28 PM

OK, so fighters can't carry cargo. That scotches my original Colonizer Rider idea... but there are ways around this sort of thing... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

The changes made by Ed Kollis gave me the way out. Within your own planet type you can have two levels of colonizer - the big Highliner mount you start out with, and an "auto-colony" module that can fit on a Rider (this must be researched). The "auto-colony" represents raw materials and droids that set up the equipment and structures of the colony... just no population. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif That your Highliner must provide when it happens to be in the neighborhood.

SCENARIO - A highliner with lotza pop in cargo, and a bunch of Rider Auto-colonizers docked, shows up in a system. The Riders are launched and set up Auto-colonies in every compatible world-type in the system. The Highliner visits each one in turn and drops off the required Pop to get the colonies producing - then heads back to base.

If you're doing a "hostile environment" colony, however (rock to gas or ice, etc), you're stuck with massive Highliner colony components. This makes cross-planet type colonization much harder than in the basic game (as it probably should be).

So, whadyallthink?

CURRENT STATUS...

Data files - 70% completed (colony/fighter cargo mess resolved - components and facilities still in work, most other basic data files already completed or left unchanged)

AI/race files - 10% (some changes made in generic AI files, others will follow once data changes complete)

Image files - 100% (intro screens and substitute highliner/worldship pics complete)

Phoenix-D

June 8th, 2003, 08:52 PM

Fighers can't colinize, either. Even with the component they don't get the command for it.

General Woundwort

June 8th, 2003, 10:10 PM

Originally posted by Phoenix-D:
Fighers can't colinize, either. Even with the component they don't get the command for it.http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif

EDIT - OK, so the basic ideas I had about colonization are going right out the window. Right. Well, since Remote Miners work on Satellites, I assume that they could work on Fighters as well... I hope...? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif
EDIT - They do. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Since the hard-wired code is going to be this obstinate, I guess I have to fall back onto Plan A (for Auuugh!) - do a *Proportions*-type cargo requirement for pop and make the use of Highliners an absolute necessity for colonization. I didn't want to do this (since Proportions is already out there) but it seems the accursed game code leaves no alternative.

Besides, I've sunk too much effort into this thing to chuck it all now...

[ June 21, 2003, 02:48: Message edited by: General Woundwort ]

oleg

June 9th, 2003, 12:41 AM

Anyboby remember the most outrages mod idea ever -
Make SOLAR SYSTEM a starliner ! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif
Don't remember the author.

Basicaly, imagine you system connected to "starliner system" and then to the destination system. You "load" your ship into such system, it "travels" and you disembark into "real" system.
battles inside hull are forbiden - can be moded by nebula type ability. You can even plant a "bomb" there - blow up sun http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif (sun is called "navigator")

General Woundwort

June 9th, 2003, 01:17 AM

CURRENT STATUS...

Data files - 75% completed (colony modules & fighters now separated http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif - components and facilities almost completed)

AI/race files - 10% (some changes made in generic AI files, others will follow once data changes complete)

Image files - 100% (intro screens and substitute highliner/worldship pics complete)

Miscellaneous changes made in the data files...

SETTINGS: Population Mass raised to 50 ktons

VEHICLETYPES: Besides the new ships, bases, and fighter sizes, satellites have been given a defensive bonus. Restructuring the game's weapons meant there were more weapons usable against satellites, and hopefully this will balance things out.

General Woundwort

June 10th, 2003, 12:55 AM

Slowly I am making headway...

CURRENT STATUS...

Data files - 100% completed

AI/race files - 25% (changes made in generic AI files, specific races to follow)

Image files - 100% (intro screens and substitute highliner/worldship pics complete)

EDIT - Go upthread for the latest Version of the Readme

[ June 19, 2003, 23:14: Message edited by: General Woundwort ]

Lord Kodos

June 10th, 2003, 06:12 AM

Very interesting od Woundwort, looking forward to it!

And about systems being ships...that MIGHT have been me. For LR mods campaigns I have intentionsfor a ship so large you fly in it.

General Woundwort

June 11th, 2003, 03:17 AM

Question - I was intending to use Neo-Standard images for the Riders (makes much more sense scale-wise), but I could not figure out how to do this without messing up the displays for non Neo shipsets, which I had set as the alternates (some duplications and mixup of shipsizes would occur). I take it that a mod must have all Neo shipsets or all Standard?

[ June 11, 2003, 02:21: Message edited by: General Woundwort ]

Phoenix-D

June 11th, 2003, 03:35 AM

No, it doesn't if you have Gold. Use the neo-standard bitmap as the Primary one, and a standard SE4 bitmap as the secondary.

General Woundwort

June 12th, 2003, 05:19 PM

Originally posted by Phoenix-D:
No, it doesn't if you have Gold. Use the neo-standard bitmap as the Primary one, and a standard SE4 bitmap as the secondary.Thanks. Armed with that bit of info, I went back to the VehicleSize file and made it Neo-Standard compatible. And so...

CURRENT STATUS

Data files - 100% completed (made totally Neo-Standard compatible)

AI/race files - 30% (changes made in generic AI files; Abbidon, Amonkrie, Cryslonite & CueCappa completed)

Image files - 100% (intro screens and substitute highliner/worldship pics complete - two other highliner pics adapted from other graphics)

JLS

June 12th, 2003, 05:46 PM

Absolutely, Neo-Standard compatible, would be the way to go, General Woundwort.

Many of the Ship set Designers are doing an awesome job with the Neo-Standard sets.

Loser

June 13th, 2003, 04:37 PM

This sounds like a very creative and ambitious Mod. I look forward to seeing a playable Version of it.

Some interesting limitations, though, in addition to the Cargo and Colonizer ones you have already discovered.

Since Riders are Units they cannot be captured, and cannot use Stellar Manipluation components.

Though I cannot recall the specifics I think there were also certian kinds of Armor that didn't work right for Units, Phased Shields either.

Only Highliners will be able to use Ship Yards, though I think Units can make use of Repair Bays.

Riders will not get repaired. They're either fine or they're gone. For this reason you might want to make them cheaper then their conventional Ship counterparts.

Units do not gain experience, do they?

Also, as Units, I believe your Riders are not going to charge maintainance. Can this be modded?

Can Units cloak?

Can Units sweep Mines?

Can conventional Fighters launch Seekers?

Also some powerfull bonuses.

You can make weapons, huge weapons, that can only shoot Highliners.

Mobile remote mining without maintainance will be a great boon to the dynamics of a Finite game.

Whole fleets (which cannot exactly be fleeted) can be hidden on planets or in Space Stations. Or would you use Satilites as your Space Stations and leave the whole Base hull class out of the game?

One ECM, Sensor, or Relic will benifit a whole Rider stack. These would be Components with fleet-wide benifits on special E-War ships, I suppose. Perhaps you should increase their size so they take up the whole ship.

All-in-all this sounds like it's going to be a great mod. Unique, challenging, a completely different game.

General Woundwort

June 13th, 2003, 05:18 PM

Originally posted by Loser:
This sounds like a very creative and ambitious Mod. I look forward to seeing a playable Version of it.

Some interesting limitations, though, in addition to the Cargo and Colonizer ones you have already discovered.

Since Riders are Units they cannot be captured, and cannot use Stellar Manipluation components.True, but given the "scale" of the Mod both of these make sense. One of my personal pet peeves with the SEIV basic tech tree is how *easy* it is to build and transport a component that has the power to create or destroy massive stellar phenomena (stars, nebuae, black holes, etc)! Well, in this Mod, you're gonna need even the larger Highliners before you can do that sort of nonsense.

As for boarding - well, I hope that units can carry the boarding party component (I'm working on the assuption they can), so they can be used for boarding attacks on Highliners. But who ever heard of boarding party attacks on boarding party pods? Again, it sort of fits the scale I had in mind.

Though I cannot recall the specifics I think there were also certian kinds of Armor that didn't work right for Units, Phased Shields either.Great. More good news. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif Well, I'll find out when I alpha-run it at home before release, if not before.

Only Highliners will be able to use Ship Yards, though I think Units can make use of Repair Bays.Again, this fits into the intended "scale" of the Mod, so no worries. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Riders will not get repaired. They're either fine or they're gone. For this reason you might want to make them cheaper then their conventional Ship counterparts.A good point, I'll see how my test runs go and tweak the costs if necessary.

Units do not gain experience, do they?I don't think so IIRC. I also think that fighters get their mother ship's bonuses, right? (Another reason to make Highliners expensive and valuable.)

Also, as Units, I believe your Riders are not going to charge maintainance. Can this be modded?I'm interested to see how this works. They probably can't be made to use maintenance, but I'll just make the Highliners' maintenance more expensive. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

Can Units cloak?
Can Units sweep Mines?
Can conventional Fighters launch Seekers?I think so. We're gonna find out.

You can make weapons, huge weapons, that can only shoot Highliners.Yeah, but you've still got to work within the "50% of space used for docking bays and/or cargo" rule. So you've gotta trade off somewhere. If I see one of your highliners coming at me at a snail's crawl, I'm gonna know you're packing something. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Mobile remote mining without maintainance will be a great boon to the dynamics of a Finite game.Again, one of my pet peeves I've been dying to set right. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif What's the point of having a remote mining ship that costs more to maintain than what it brings in?

Whole fleets (which cannot exactly be fleeted) can be hidden on planets or in Space Stations. Or would you use Satilites as your Space Stations and leave the whole Base hull class out of the game?No, Satellites and Bases remain. I gave Satellites a defensive bonus because the re-scaling made them targetable by more weapon types than in the basic game. As for whole fleets of Riders based on planets... Yes, planetary assault and defense are going to take on a whole new dimension in this Mod. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif

One ECM, Sensor, or Relic will benifit a whole Rider stack. These would be Components with fleet-wide benifits on special E-War ships, I suppose. Perhaps you should increase their size so they take up the whole ship.Don't get your hopes set too high. I reduced the stacking limit for Units to make this less nuclear. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

All-in-all this sounds like it's going to be a great mod. Unique, challenging, a completely different game.I hope so. I plan to finish the AI tweaks this weekend, and then do some test runs just to see that the basic parameters will work. If so, then I will go with the 1.01 release sometime next week. How the AI handles all this will probably be the biggest hurdle to deal with after that.

Loser

June 13th, 2003, 06:05 PM

Originally posted by General Woundwort:
As for boarding - well, I hope that units can carry the boarding party component (I'm working on the assuption they can), so they can be used for boarding attacks on Highliners. But who ever heard of boarding party attacks on boarding party pods? Again, it sort of fits the scale I had in mind.I don't believe Units can use the Boarding Party Component. And I don't know if the Allegiance Converter works on them, either.

Also, if I recall correctly, nothing will Ram a conventional Fighter in Strategic Combat. I could be wrong on that, but I'm pretty conventional Ships will not Ram conventional Fighters. I don't think conventional Fighters will Ram other conventional Fighters either.

In addition to seeing this mod in action, I look forward to hearing your report or what did, and did not, work for Units. A boundary-pushing mod like this is likely to pin down a whole lot of SE IV mod limitations. Even if these limitations have be discovered before, you'd have them all right here, in one place. Please let us know what you are unable to use on your over-sized Units.

General Woundwort

June 13th, 2003, 07:28 PM

Originally posted by Loser:
I don't believe Units can use the Boarding Party Component.I'm going to do some combat simulator tests right out of the starting gate to confirm this one way or the other.

And I don't know if the Allegiance Converter works on them, either.Another combat test to perform.

Also, if I recall correctly, nothing will Ram a conventional Fighter in Strategic Combat. I could be wrong on that, but I'm pretty conventional Ships will not Ram conventional Fighters. I don't think conventional Fighters will Ram other conventional Fighters either.That's probably true. And in the case of my mod, even more so - how the heck can a 5000kton Highliner ram a 100kton Rider that doesn't want to be rammed? You might as well try to ram my dad's fishing boat with the USS Wisconsin. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif Now, Suicide Riders ramming Highliners and Planets... well, I think (and hope) you're going to be seeing a *lot* of that. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif (BTW, no Drones in this Mod. Suicide Riders totally take over that niche.)

In addition to seeing this mod in action, I look forward to hearing your report or what did, and did not, work for Units. A boundary-pushing mod like this is likely to pin down a whole lot of SE IV mod limitations.Well, it's certainly been an education for me... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

Even if these limitations have be discovered before, you'd have them all right here, in one place. Please let us know what you are unable to use on your over-sized Units.Whatever the results are will get posted here on this thread.

cybersol

June 13th, 2003, 10:10 PM

I hope you wade your way through all the limitations because this mod is a great idea. I too really loved the whole idea of the massive jumpships hold a dozen or so dropships in the battletech universe.

It would be really cool if you could make a component that would need to be charged before you could use a warp point. If you gave it a 10 turn recharge rate, then you could really simulate the battletech jump ships. "Um, ok we are here, but the enemy has overwhelming force. We need to leave but we have to wait a year? Were are dead meat." Simulating the realistic dropship movement of constant acceleration followed by constant deceleration would be harder.

Fyron

June 13th, 2003, 10:20 PM

And I don't know if the Allegiance Converter works on them, either.
Allegience Subverters will work on units if you change the targeting type to be able to target units. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

I also think that fighters get their mother ship's bonuses, right? (Another reason to make Highliners expensive and valuable.)
They do not gain the carrier's bonuses.

Again, one of my pet peeves I've been dying to set right. What's the point of having a remote mining ship that costs more to maintain than what it brings in?
Not all planets and asteroids have things of value to mine.

Don't get your hopes set too high. I reduced the stacking limit for Units to make this less nuclear. How exactly did you go about this? You can launch everything in cargo at once from a planet, so you can easily get 1000 fighter/drone stacks. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Can Units cloak?
Can Units sweep Mines?
Can conventional Fighters launch Seekers? Yes, but ISTR some issues with cloaking units, though I do not recall the specifics. Maybe. Yes.

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Loser:
I don't believe Units can use the Boarding Party Component.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'm going to do some combat simulator tests right out of the starting gate to confirm this one way or the other.
Units can not participate in any boarding activities, period. Only ships and bases can do so.

[ June 13, 2003, 21:27: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

General Woundwort

June 13th, 2003, 11:04 PM

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
Allegience Subverters will work on units if you change the targeting type to be able to target units. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif Already did that. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Not all planets and asteroids have things of value to mine.Granting that, I still found that mining even the richest asteroid fields with a remote-miner equipped Freighter was not worth the effort. Besides, I like the idea of cheap exploitation of resources. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

How exactly did you go about this? You can launch everything in cargo at once from a planet, so you can easily get 1000 fighter/drone stacks. Isn't that what the "Combat Fighter Group Amount" lines in the Settings and Strageiges files does?

Yes, but ISTR some issues with cloaking units, though I do not recall the specifics. Maybe. Yes.We finds out, yes we does, my preciousssss...

Units can not participate in any boarding activities, period. Only ships and bases can do so.http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif Well, I'm going to put in a really big post in the SEV request forum after this is done, I can tell you...

Phoenix-D

June 13th, 2003, 11:20 PM

Units can cloak. The problem, as of the Last time I tested it, is they STAY cloaked, and won't uncloak.

General Woundwort

June 13th, 2003, 11:39 PM

Weeeellll, shoot! Just going over the thread from front to back , here's everything that won't work in units...

Colony Components - This is a pain, but an increase in the components' size requirements and staying with Highliners fits in the Mod's general theme anyways, so no big deal.

Cargo - A major pain. No troop transport Riders, no Mine/Satellite/etc Layers, etc.; but given the logical [program-code wise] problems of a unit 'in cargo' carrying cargo, understandable.

Boarding Party Component - This sucks big time. And given the consistent idea of Boarding Pods in SciFi - the ones in B5 come to mind immediately - almost inconceivable. This goes to the SEV Request thread at once.

Well, as a great Air Force pilot has said, we haven't come this far to just drop this thing in the drink! So, the (albeit imperfect) interim solution I have in mind is this - a "workhorse" Highliner that has the docking bay requirement dropped to 25%. It will only come in the smallest size (1000ktons) and be intended for the sorts of things I wanted specialized Riders to do, but am barred from doing so by the program code.

So drop the percentages for the data files back a few points while I rework these latest glitches, and keep your fingers crossed...

EDIT - and now Phoenix comes with the bad news that cloaking is buggy too. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif
Well, in that case, I may just totally drop that tech line and simply beef up the ECM/ECCM limb of the tech tree.

[ June 14, 2003, 02:21: Message edited by: General Woundwort ]

General Woundwort

June 14th, 2003, 03:10 AM

(climbs back out of the datafile salt mines, wipes brow)

OK, here's how it stands.

Cargo, cloak, boarding parties, and colony tech have been ruled "right out" for units. So, here is what I have my Riders ("fighters") able to carry at this moment...

- Scanner Jammer (in armor)
- Medical Bays
- Mine Sweepers
- Remote Miners
- Armor, Shields, & Weapons of all sorts not Banned above
- ECM
- ECCM
- Ship Control
- Life Support
- Crew Quarters

The Last batch of changes, plus the results of some research I did in other threads re: AI design, has put me back a bit in my status report...

CURRENT STATUS

Data files - 99% completed (pending proofread)

AI/race files - 0% (basically starting from scratch)

Image files - 100% (This at least seems foolproof http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif )

Mod Readme - updated on a few points, most importantly with an acknowledgement of the aid and advice given on this thread. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

(wipes hands, trudges back into the saltmines)

EDIT - link to old Version of Mod Readme removed, go upthread for latest Version

[ June 21, 2003, 02:55: Message edited by: General Woundwort ]

General Woundwort

June 15th, 2003, 10:43 PM

The AI changes are coming along faster than anticipated, but there's still a ways to go...

CURRENT STATUS

Data files - 99% completed (pending proofread)

AI/race files - 15% (default AI in work - then conVersion of all 20 races http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif )

Image files - 100%

EDIT - Also, this marks my official promotion as Sergeant. I actually passed it this morning, but I still had to sew my third stripe on. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

[ June 15, 2003, 21:45: Message edited by: General Woundwort ]

Fyron

June 16th, 2003, 12:21 AM

Isn't that what the "Combat Fighter Group Amount" lines in the Settings and Strageiges files does? No. That has to do with how many get launched in a group in combat, not with how many can be in a stack. Also, it gets overridden by the strategy that ships are using, so it is a useless feature (except maybe for planets, but I think there are settings in the AI files so that AIs do not use the line from Settings.txt either...).

- Scanner Jammer (in armor) Scanner Jammers only work outside of combat, and I don't think you can even click on an individual enemy fighter on the strategic map when they are in a group.

- Auxiliary Control
Units do not take damage to components, it is all dead or all alive. So, things like Aux Control are meaningless. They can not lose their "bridge" unless the fighter is destroyed.

[ June 15, 2003, 23:27: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

General Woundwort

June 16th, 2003, 12:57 AM

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
["Combat Fighter Group Amount"] has to do with how many get launched in a group in combat, not with how many can be in a stack. Also, it gets overridden by the strategy that ships are using, so it is a useless feature (except maybe for planets, but I think there are settings in the AI files so that AIs do not use the line from Settings.txt either...).Well, combat is gonna be interesting then... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

Scanner Jammers only work outside of combat, and I don't think you can even click on an individual enemy fighter on the strategic map when they are in a group.

Auxiliary Control -Units do not take damage to components, it is all dead or all alive. So, things like Aux Control are meaningless. They can not lose their "bridge" unless the fighter is destroyed.More minor points, but it will allow me to trim some stuff from the Components file.

Thanks for the input. I know I'm plowing ground that has been plowed before, and I appreciate the insights from the more experienced.

General Woundwort

June 16th, 2003, 01:27 AM

[Surfs by NASY for an update.

Reads what happened to CPT Kwok. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

Comes back to forums and reads ST Mod thread. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Turns slightly pale. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

Digs up zipdiscs and starts backing up the Highliner files like there's no tomorrow...]

narf poit chez BOOM

June 16th, 2003, 09:57 AM

what?

General Woundwort

June 17th, 2003, 12:31 AM

The default AI changes are done - and I hope that they will make the single-player Version at least tolerable until more experienced players can give their input.

CURRENT STATUS

Data files - 100% completed (but still mulling over how to tweak Torpedoes)

AI/race files - 20% (default AI done http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif - now comes converting all 20 stock races http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif )

Image files - 100%

General Woundwort

June 19th, 2003, 01:12 AM

All the beacons of our worlds are lit up in celebration! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif The data file changes are done, the AI's have been updated, and the game open has been run without any nasty error Messages cropping up! Now comes the acid test - a series of trial runs to Last at least through this weekend to test game play, AI adaptation, and search for any lurking bugs. Further progress reports will be posted as the Highliner Mod comes to life.

narf poit chez BOOM

June 19th, 2003, 08:20 AM

make torpedoes large, inacurate and powerfull.
my $0.02

Taz-in-Space

June 19th, 2003, 08:27 AM

Will there be an open Beta test? Can Taz play too?? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/confused.gif

Come-on... You don't want to see a grown Taz beg... I mean you really DON'T!!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Fyron

June 19th, 2003, 09:02 AM

There is method to my madness. If my hard drive fails, I will lost at most a few minor changes to Adamant. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

*begins dicing onions right next to Taz*

[ June 19, 2003, 08:03: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

General Woundwort

June 19th, 2003, 12:23 PM

Originally posted by Taz-in-Space:
Will there be an open Beta test? Can Taz play too?? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/confused.gif

Come-on... You don't want to see a grown Taz beg... I mean you really DON'T!!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif Calm down, Taz! Breathe, breathe! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Seriously, I just want to run it a few times at home to shake out any major bugs (and good thing too, I found and fixed several Last night) and test out how the changes affect gameplay. If all continues to go well, 1.01 will go public this weekend.

Originally posted by narf poit chez BOOM:
make torpedoes large, inacurate and powerfull.
my $0.02Sorry old chap, I went with longer range. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

EDIT - my usual misspellings corrected

[ June 19, 2003, 11:24: Message edited by: General Woundwort ]

General Woundwort

June 20th, 2003, 12:21 AM

Now I know how Doc Frahnkenshteen must have felt. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif I've opened up several games at high tech levels, just to check the datafiles (ship sizes, components, and facilities), and everyone reports for duty as scheduled. No nasty error Messages pop up at game load and between game turns. The Highliner Mod is ALIVE!!!.

I want to take one test game through a few more turns, to check on combat and reseach (just to be paranoid about releasing a buggy game). But I think we're just about ready to rumble!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif

EDIT - old Readme link deleted

[ June 22, 2003, 00:46: Message edited by: General Woundwort ]

tesco samoa

June 20th, 2003, 01:41 AM

i will help out on the beta pbw test just assign my name to the empire you wished to use as a test in the pbw game.

General Woundwort

June 20th, 2003, 10:53 AM

Open Question to the Forum Moderators...

This thing is getting pretty close to launch, and going over the files, it's probably going to be about 4-5 MB, zipped. My questions are:

1) Can the Shrapnel Games BB handle a file that big?

2) Does the BB want people posting files that big in the DL section?

3) Assuming 'no' to either 1) or 2), which of the various free webpage services you would recommend (I'm currently leaning towards Spaceports.com)

Thanks.

Fyron

June 20th, 2003, 10:57 AM

You can upload files up to 30 MBs in size. There are tons of files much larger than yours already uploaded. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

General Woundwort

June 20th, 2003, 12:26 PM

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
You can upload files up to 30 MBs in size. There are tons of files much larger than yours already uploaded. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif Thanks. With that in mind, barring any major setbacks, I plan to have the mod up and downloadable on mid-day Sunday, EST. Let's hope Taz can hold out that long. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

General Woundwort

June 21st, 2003, 02:23 AM

All continues to go well. I've made a few tweaks in the data files in response to game issues, but the rest, I think, can wait for player feedback.

The schedule remains on for a public release on Sunday afternoon/evening EST.

And a nickel's worth of free advice - watch your resource production very carefully. And be prepared to rethink your usual strategies of colonization and resupply. This is gonna be very interesting...

General Woundwort

June 22nd, 2003, 01:48 AM

Yeah, I said it wouldn't be out until tomorrow. But I'm going to be rather busy in RL tomorrow, and the zip-unzip tests went well, so what's the point in any further delay? None that I can see. Therefore...

===================================

HIGHLINER MOD VERSION 1.01

This mod makes major changes to the ship construction and colonization mechanics of the game. See the Readme below for the basic information on the background, requirements to run this mod, and more...

Mod Readme (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/newuploads/1056238342.txt)

If you have any suggestions, complaints, comments or kudos, please post them in the Highliner Mod thread in the SEIV Forums here.

======================================

Download Highliner Mod 1.01 now! (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/newuploads/1056239029.zip)

General Woundwort

June 22nd, 2003, 04:50 PM

Originally posted by Loser:
In addition to seeing this mod in action, I look forward to hearing your report or what did, and did not, work for Units. A boundary-pushing mod like this is likely to pin down a whole lot of SE IV mod limitations. Even if these limitations have be discovered before, you'd have them all right here, in one place. Please let us know what you are unable to use on your over-sized Units.The list, as of 1.01, stands thus...

WILL WORK IN UNITS
------------------
Weapons
Shields
Remote Miners
Mine Sweepers
Unit Control
Life Support
Crew Quarters
ECM/ECCM
Armor
Medical Bays
Point Defense

WILL NOT WORK IN UNITS
------------------
Cloaking
Cargo
Boarding Parties
Scanner Jammer
Colonization
Auxiliary Control

Taz-in-Space

June 23rd, 2003, 04:04 AM

Taz sees the Highliner Mod and grabs it!

New Toys! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif
NEW Toys! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif
NEW TOYS! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Taz hangs out a NO DISTURB sign... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

General Woundwort

June 23rd, 2003, 04:19 PM

Originally posted by Taz-in-Space:
Taz sees the Highliner Mod and grabs it!

New Toys! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif
NEW Toys! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif
NEW TOYS! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Taz hangs out a NO DISTURB sign... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif When you get done with it, PLEASE post your observations here. Whatever you find - bugs, strategies, suggestions, complaints, praises - post it so I can improve the Mod. Thanks.

Loser

June 23rd, 2003, 04:29 PM

Thank you, General.

Have you confirmed that the Point Defense, Medical Bays and Mine Sweepers actually function on Units?

What about Phased Shields, Solar Panels, Quantum Reactors, Regenerating Armor, single-weapon To-Hit bonus (ala WMG) and all forms of Special Damage (Engine, Shield, Armor, Master Computer, Weapon, Weapon rate delay, Allegiance Subverter, and Shield/Armor skipping)?

Were you able to try any of those? Does the Highliner Mod implement any of those special features?

[edit: I forgot that Units don't use experience. Didn't need to ask about Neural Networks.]

[ June 23, 2003, 15:33: Message edited by: Loser ]

General Woundwort

June 23rd, 2003, 05:14 PM

Originally posted by Loser:
Thank you, General.

Have you confirmed that the Point Defense, Medical Bays and Mine Sweepers actually function on Units?

What about Phased Shields, Solar Panels, Quantum Reactors, Regenerating Armor, single-weapon To-Hit bonus (ala WMG) and all forms of Special Damage (Engine, Shield, Armor, Master Computer, Weapon, Weapon rate delay, Allegiance Subverter, and Shield/Armor skipping)?

Were you able to try any of those? Does the Highliner Mod implement any of those special features?Results so far are mixed.

I haven't had any mine combats yet, so the sweepers are still an unknown factor. Same thing with medical facilities & plagues.

Unit combat is much more "hidden" than ship combat (shields & damage are computed out-of-sight, as it were), so the effects of regenerating armor & shields, special weapons, etc, are difficult to ascertain.

For purposes of game scale and mechanics, I kept Quantum Reactors and Solar Panels as strictly Highliner/Ship components - so I don't know if they would work on units. I could experiment with them, but even if they did work I would not put them on units because I don't think it fits the parameters of space travel I had in mind for this mod.

Weapon Rate Delay and Allegence converters both work on units - that's confirmed.

More results to come as the test games proceed.

Loser

June 23rd, 2003, 06:33 PM

Since Units do not respond to damage, at all, until their entire structure has been destroyed any sort of X only Weapon would be almost completely ineffective against other Units.

I forgot to mention Plagues, Radiation, and Smart Weapons in the X only Weapon list. But since it's targeting something other than a Rider I think it would work. The same should be true for other X only Weapons: they could be used against Highliners, but not other Rider.

As I understand it, both Armor and Shields on a Unit just add to its total Hit Points (kilotons). The only difference is that you get an little animation when you hit Shields.

Perhaps regeneration would still work, though. It could be tested, as well. Design a Rider with enough regenerating Armor to 'soak' 5 kt of damage per round and a weapon that only does 1 kt of damage. Switch over to another empire and there design a Rider of roughly equal Hit Points with a weapon that does 5 kt of damage. Run a simulation between them and see who wins.

Another thought. While Shield-skipping weapons could still destroy all the Hit Points of a Unit, I don't think Armor-skipping weapons could. Since the Armor-skipping weapon does not hit Armor it will never destroy the whole Unit.

Weapon rate delay works when fired from a Unit at a Ship, I think, but does it work against other Units?

I seem to recall (perhaps from this very thread) that Allegiance Converters will work from a Unit against a Ship, but I don't think they work against other Units. There's your Boarding Party, but there is not way to Security Station against it. I think this would be an unbalancing element, since any Highliner could be easily lost to a stack of Boarding Riders (but it's your mod, of course).

I think I see what you mean about the Supply-related components. Since they're not traveling between systems, anyway, I don't suppose the Riders will have great need of endless Supplies. Or perhaps, for that very reason, they should have more limited Supplies, much like Fighters.

[ June 23, 2003, 21:44: Message edited by: Loser ]

General Woundwort

June 23rd, 2003, 09:43 PM

Originally posted by Loser:
Since Units do not respond to damage, at all, until their entire structure has been destroyed any sort of X only Weapon would be almost completely ineffective against other Units.
The same should be true for other X only Weapons: they could be used against Highliners, but not other Unit-Ships.This is true in the abstract. But the way I modded the weapons, most weapons can hit any target, so while they may be more effective against one or the other, they will work on all to some degree, and it's simply a matter of designing Riders that are optimized to specific tasks. Not that I didn't make some weapons effective only against one type of ship or the other - but you'll have to play the Mod to find out which... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

I forgot to mention Plagues, Radiation, and Smart Weapons in the X only Weapon list. But since it's targeting something other than a Unit-Ship I think it would work..Again, this hasn't yet occured in the test games, but I don't see any reason why anti-planet weapons won't work from Riders.

As I understand it, both Armor and Shields on a Unit just add to its total Hit Points (kilotons). The only difference is that you get an little animation when you hit Shields.
Perhaps regeneration would still work, though. It could be tested, as well. Design a Unit-Ship with enough regenerating Armor to 'soak' 5 kt of damage per round and a weapon that only does 1 kt of damage. Switch over to another empire and there design a Unit-Ship of roughly equal Hit Points with a weapon that does 5 kt of damage. Run a simulation between them and see who wins.I'm in the middle of just such a task right now.

Another thought. While Shield-skipping weapons could still destroy all the Hit Points of a Unit, I don't think Armor-skipping weapons could. Since the Armor-skipping weapon does not hit Armor it will never destroy the whole Unit..This is something to keen an eye on for later revisions, but I'm trying to stick with more basic questions at these early stages. Such as...

Weapon rate delay works when fired from a Unit at a Ship, I think, but does it work against other Units?Definitely. That's already been determined in my alpha tests.

I seem to recall (perhaps from this very thread) that Allegiance Converters will work from a Unit against a Ship, but I don't think they work against other Units. There's your Boarding Party, but there is not way to Security Station against it. I think this would be an unbalancing element, since any Highliner could be easily lost to a stack of Boarding Unit-Ships (but it's your mod, of course).This was something else I gave a pass on, using "mod scale" as my out. Allegence Converters can only be mounted on Highliners and Bases.

I think I see what you mean about the Supply-related components. Since they're not traveling between systems, anyway, I don't suppose the Unit-Ships will have great need of endless Supplies. Or perhaps, for that very reason, they should have more limited Supplies, much like Fighters.Again, the "intended scale" factor comes in. Highliners have the size and complexity to handle long-term space environments for their crew - Riders do not. Thus I envisioned Riders as short-range (and short-duration) ships, and jacked up the supply cost per turn.

My biggest fear (in actual playtesting by people) is that some joker would create googobs of Riders and park them in the orbit above his planets, thus sidestepping the cargo-on-planet limitations. That's another reason why I made the supply-cost-per-turn for Riders/"fighters" so high. They'll have to come down to resupply sometime, somewhere, or you lose them. This way, it's sooner rather than later, and it'll make it that much harder to pull off a stunt like this.

Loser

June 23rd, 2003, 10:42 PM

Thank you.

"Riders", yes.... I think I'll go back and correct my terminology in my Last post. "Unit-Ships"? I was really reaching there.

Mathias_Ice

June 23rd, 2003, 11:49 PM

I would very much like to try this mod, but my problem is this (and I searched the forums for an answer but to no avail): How do you combine Mods? I have tried before but had no luck. Maybe a step-by-step answer could be posted to the FAQ as combining mods seems to be a fairly common thing.

Thanks,
Mathias Ice

General Woundwort

June 24th, 2003, 12:25 AM

Originally posted by Mathias_Ice:
I would very much like to try this mod, but my problem is this (and I searched the forums for an answer but to no avail): How do you combine Mods? I have tried before but had no luck. Maybe a step-by-step answer could be posted to the FAQ as combining mods seems to be a fairly common thing.

Thanks,
Mathias IceI assume you're talking about the Image and Neo-standard Mods I reference, right?

If so, no problem. These "mods" are just large Groups of new images for components, facilities, ships, etc. My mod is entirely datafiles (the only images I include that overwrite existing ones are the intro screens; my extra ship images load into a separate folder). It shouldn't even matter what order you load them in. Just 1) load SEIV off the disc into a new folder; 2) update it to 1.84; then 3) load the Image modpacks, the Neo-Standard ship pack, and my Mod in whatever order. You should then be good to go.

Combining my mod with other mods with major data changes (Proportions, AIC, etc.) is not possible - but that goes for trying to combine any mods of this type. You'd have to go through the data files for *both* mods and reconcile the differences, tweak the AIs to handle them, ad infinitum ad nauseam - and then you'd have a third (and entirely different) mod (not to mention questions about infringement of intellectual property). http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

EDIT - Clarified loading instructions

[ June 24, 2003, 01:42: Message edited by: General Woundwort ]

cybersol

June 24th, 2003, 01:04 AM

Originally posted by Loser:
Another thought. While Shield-skipping weapons could still destroy all the Hit Points of a Unit, I don't think Armor-skipping weapons could. Since the Armor-skipping weapon does not hit Armor it will never destroy the whole Unit.
Armor skipping weapons go back and hit armor once everything else is gone on ships. Don't know about units though.

[ June 24, 2003, 00:15: Message edited by: cybersol ]

Fyron

June 24th, 2003, 01:40 AM

Units do not have an "armor" layer. Armor components on a unit simply add to the HP total, nothing more. Armor skipping weapons do not skip armor on a unit, as there is no "armor" to skip. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

General Woundwort

June 24th, 2003, 02:27 AM

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
Units do not have an "armor" layer. Armor components on a unit simply add to the HP total, nothing more. Armor skipping weapons do not skip armor on a unit, as there is no "armor" to skip. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif So regenerating armor on a unit would essentially be "regenerating HPs", at least for the HPs contributed by the armor - assuming that it even works in units (which is a dangerous assumption in SEIV as I've found...) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

Loser

June 24th, 2003, 02:45 AM

How'd that test come out?

General Woundwort

June 24th, 2003, 03:07 AM

Originally posted by Loser:
How'd that test come out?I'm still going through the simulator to find out how/if shield regenerators and special armors work. It's not as easy to track as you might think (even with only 2 Riders designed just for that particular combat scenario).

On the brighter side, one thing I have found out that works in units are planetary bombardment weapons. One Omega Rider (500ktons) armed with 10 Plasma Bomb Vs depopulated a homeworld in one salvo. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

Mathias_Ice

June 24th, 2003, 06:26 AM

Originally posted by General Woundwort:
I assume you're talking about the Image and Neo-standard Mods I reference, right?Okay I'll give that a shot, I didn't know you had to install a second SEIV install, I was hoping I could just copy two (or more) of the type of mods you are referring to into one folder and pick that mod from the Mod Picker program. I tried my method with TDM and FQM and it didn't work. So, not to sound like an idiot, but you are saying I need to make a second full install of SEIV, correct?

[ June 24, 2003, 05:32: Message edited by: Mathias_Ice ]

narf poit chez BOOM

June 24th, 2003, 06:31 AM

i think some-one could do a cat-in-a-hat with the armor-skipping rounds and non-armor hps, but i've got a slight headache and i'm tired.

*hah! your tired! try eighteen*

*annoying eighteen-wheeler*

does anybody know what you call a pickup-truck with eighteen pigs in the back?

[ June 24, 2003, 07:02: Message edited by: narf poit chez BOOM ]

Fyron

June 24th, 2003, 07:47 AM

Mathias Ice, the Neo-standard does not require you to install anything special. All that that means is that if you use a ship set that has extra images in it, they will be used in-game in the Highliner mod.

For the Image Mod, you can (and should) install it into the default Pictures folder.

You do not need to have a second install of SE4.

Fyron

June 24th, 2003, 10:06 AM

I'm still going through the simulator to find out how/if shield regenerators and special armors work. I am 90% certain that none of them work on units.

General Woundwort

June 24th, 2003, 11:22 AM

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
You do not need to have a second install of SE4.Yes, this is true. I was thinking of the way I run SEIV in my computer (I have separate installs for PBW, Highliner, and the game I play and tweak for my own use). I have a 30 GB harddrive and am only using 5 so far, so space is not an issue for me - and I don't have to worry about that "shifting mods" nonsense. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

General Woundwort

June 24th, 2003, 11:25 AM

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
I am 90% certain that none of them work on units.You're probably right. I'll more than likely trim them from the Unit tech tree completely next iteration. But wait... don't some of the racial tech traits have special unit armor?

General Woundwort

June 24th, 2003, 11:27 AM

Originally posted by narf poit chez BOOM:
i think some-one could do a cat-in-a-hat with the armor-skipping rounds and non-armor hps, but i've got a slight headache and i'm tired.

*hah! your tired! try eighteen*

*annoying eighteen-wheeler*

does anybody know what you call a pickup-truck with eighteen pigs in the back?DONKEY - So, are there any mice up there?

SHREK - Well, there's Narf, The Small... and Annoying. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

Fyron

June 24th, 2003, 07:13 PM

Originally posted by General Woundwort:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
I am 90% certain that none of them work on units.You're probably right. I'll more than likely trim them from the Unit tech tree completely next iteration. But wait... don't some of the racial tech traits have special unit armor?<hr /></blockquote>None of them do. The only special armor for fighters/troops is Small Emissive Armor, but I do not think it actually has the emissive ability, or that it works. It just has more hp/kT than standard armor.

General Woundwort

June 25th, 2003, 01:45 AM

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
None of them do. The only special armor for fighters/troops is Small Emissive Armor, but I do not think it actually has the emissive ability, or that it works. It just has more hp/kT than standard armor.It *does* have the emissive ability listed in its component entry. If it doesn't work, it should have been "patched" out of existence...

Well, now I know what to do for 1.02 then. (Trudges off grumbling to the datafile saltmines...)

[ June 25, 2003, 00:46: Message edited by: General Woundwort ]

General Woundwort

June 25th, 2003, 02:50 AM

Well, once the grunt work of the mod is done, it's heartwarming to see how quickly fixes and patches can be done. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

I've removed (grumble, grumble) units' special shields and armor from 1.02. I've also done some other fixes, some to the AI files, and some just for cosmetic purposes.

Now, I have a question for you veteran modders out there. My next project is running a large batch of large games (8-10 AI's each) to see which of my AIs have adapted to the new environment the best. I will use this data to tweak the other AIs. My question for you vets is, should I wait until I get my AIs whipped into shape and then do a major re-release, or just do incremental releases as changes come in (like 1.02 as it stands now)?

[ June 25, 2003, 01:51: Message edited by: General Woundwort ]

General Woundwort

June 25th, 2003, 10:58 AM

umpbay

Originally posted by General Woundwort:
Now, I have a question for you veteran modders out there. My next project is running a large batch of large games (8-10 AI's each) to see which of my AIs have adapted to the new environment the best. I will use this data to tweak the other AIs. My question for you vets is, should I wait until I get my AIs whipped into shape and then do a major re-release, or just do incremental releases as changes come in (like 1.02 as it stands now)?

Fyron

June 25th, 2003, 07:51 PM

That is a matter of style, really. There is no right or wrong way to go about it.

General Woundwort

June 28th, 2003, 01:34 AM

HIGHLINER MOD VERSION 1.02

This mod makes major changes to the ship construction and colonization mechanics of the game. See the Readme below for the basic information on the background, requirements to run this mod, and more...

Readme 1.02 (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/newuploads/1056756693.txt)

Mod release 1.02 History:
- TechArea file - Stellar Harnessing reduced from 6 to 3 levels (no components exist for levels 4-6)
- Fixed bug in Research datafiles in Neutral Empires (Tech Area Min % Organics Extraction - entry missing)
- Components file: special weapons and armor for units removed; some weapon techs renamed for consistency; and some inconsistenciesin Roman Numeral/Family Groups for some Rider Weapons and Facilities resolved

If you have any suggestions, complaints, comments or kudos, please post them in the Highliner Mod thread in the SEIV Forums here.

Download Highliner Mod 1.02 now! (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/newuploads/1056756494.zip)

======================================

Note that this also marks the debut of Efrafa Sector, the homepage for the Highliner Mod and more...

http://galileo.spaceports.com/~woundwrt/index.html

General Woundwort

June 29th, 2003, 04:56 AM

Sorry, one Last patch (1.03) to update the Mod. This is just three datafiles that were changed, and the updated readme.

Highliner Mod Patch 1.03 (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/newuploads/1056929300.zip)

[ June 30, 2003, 00:29: Message edited by: General Woundwort ]

TerranC

July 2nd, 2003, 12:43 AM

Edit: Request: Could you make a different Version of the mod for people who doesn't want to overwrite the original Se4?

[ July 01, 2003, 23:45: Message edited by: TerranC ]

General Woundwort

July 2nd, 2003, 12:52 AM

Originally posted by TerranC:
Edit: Request: Could you make a different Version of the mod for people who doesn't want to overwrite the original Se4?You mean a mod Version for pre-Gold?

(gulp) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/blush.gif

I, uh, hadn't thought of that. Lately, I've been focused on whipping the current Version into shape for a PBW run. I'll have to go back and do a dry run with pre-Gold files to see if there's anything that would mess up the mod.

TerranC

July 2nd, 2003, 01:15 AM

Originally posted by General Woundwort:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by TerranC:
Edit: Request: Could you make a different Version of the mod for people who doesn't want to overwrite the original Se4?You mean a mod Version for pre-Gold?

(gulp) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/blush.gif

I, uh, hadn't thought of that. Lately, I've been focused on whipping the current Version into shape for a PBW run. I'll have to go back and do a dry run with pre-Gold files to see if there's anything that would mess up the mod.<hr /></blockquote>Umm, No, that's not what I meant.
I meant, is it possible for you to create a zip file with everything in it so that people could play the Highliner Mod without having to overwrite their se4 gold files.

General Woundwort

July 2nd, 2003, 01:26 AM

Originally posted by TerranC:
Umm, No, that's not what I meant.
I meant, is it possible for you to create a zip file with everything in it so that people could play the Highliner Mod without having to overwrite their se4 gold files.Ahhh, that's what you meant.

Well, that's easy. Create a folder called "Highliner_Mod" within your main SEIV directory. Unzip my Mod files into it (and add the Image Mod and Neostandard pics to those folders as well). Then go to the "Path" textfile in your main folder and change the line...

Using Mod Directory := None

to read...

Using Mod Directory := Highliner_Mod

That should do the trick.

TerranC

July 2nd, 2003, 01:45 AM

Alright. Thanks.

General Woundwort

July 2nd, 2003, 11:50 PM

1.04 is out - and this will be the Last iteration for awhile (until some external playtests come in). Check out Efrafa Sector (link in my sig) for the download. Also, check the new thread (WANTED - Guinea Pigs) for an important announcement.

[ July 02, 2003, 22:56: Message edited by: General Woundwort ]

Fyron

July 2nd, 2003, 11:57 PM

I believe he wanted you to make the zip file extract to the Highliner Mod folder by default. It should not be overwriting the SE4 files by default. This is common courtesy, and is how most mods are released.

and add the Image Mod and Neostandard pics to those folders as well Actually, these are those mods that you want to install in the default SE4 folders, not in any mod folders. The whole point of these is to be a standard used by many mods. Installing them in particular mod folders is a waste of HD space and requires needless duplication. They do not replace any default images, just add new ones.

[ July 02, 2003, 23:06: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

General Woundwort

July 3rd, 2003, 12:25 AM

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
I believe he wanted you to make the zip file extract to the Highliner Mod folder by default. It should not be overwriting the SE4 files by default. This is common courtesy, and is how most mods are released.EDIT - I finally got what you guys were getting at. OK. Zip up the files already contained in a "mod" folder. Mea culpa.

EDIT - OK, the zipfile and website are updated and in-line with the standard.

[ July 02, 2003, 23:47: Message edited by: General Woundwort ]

Fyron

July 3rd, 2003, 01:03 AM

There is a lot of junk (and I mean a lot) in the HTML of your web site. What did you use to make it?

Jack Simth

July 3rd, 2003, 01:13 AM

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
There is a lot of junk (and I mean a lot) in the HTML of your web site. What did you use to make it?Considering some of the stuff in the code, he used Microsoft Word:
From source of http://galileo.spaceports.com/~woundwrt/index.html
<blockquote>code:<hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;"><meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 9"></pre><hr /></blockquote>It's one of the easier ways to make a web page quickly if you don't want to learn HTML, but it has some rather severe drawbacks.

General Woundwort

July 3rd, 2003, 02:35 AM

Ugh. The way things are going tonight, maybe I should sign everything over to a third party and go back to Atari 2600... http://www.click-smilies.de/sammlung/traurig/sad-smiley-067.gif

Fyron

July 3rd, 2003, 03:51 AM

Don't do that! I could clean up the html for ya in a jiffy if you want. Email the html (and only html) files to me all zipped up if you want me to.

General Woundwort

July 6th, 2003, 02:07 AM

For those who are interested, the PBW game for Highliner is up and ready for sign-ins. Go to the PBW website and look up "Highliner Mod Shakedown" for the details.

This game will use Version 1.04, available at Efrafa Sector (see link in my sig).

Urendi Maleldil

July 10th, 2003, 02:16 AM

How do you intend to get the AI to launch Riders in the system map?

Right now I don't think the AI does anything with fighters strategically.

General Woundwort

July 10th, 2003, 02:50 AM

Originally posted by Urendi Maleldil:
How do you intend to get the AI to launch Riders in the system map?

Right now I don't think the AI does anything with fighters strategically.Improving the AI is my next big step (Step 1 was getting the thing to work in principle). I've been tweaking the AI files at home as I go along, improving the AI's expansion, economy, and combat. I will note this down too and see what I can do about it.

Does anyone else out there (say, those who have worked with TDM) know how this (fighters in strategic combat) is done? Would Ultimate Strategies Mod handle this sort of thing?

[ July 10, 2003, 01:51: Message edited by: General Woundwort ]

General Woundwort

August 5th, 2003, 03:03 AM

I've redone the zipfile (see my website linked in my sig) so that it should - FINALLY - run properly. I mean it! I swear! http://www.click-smilie.de/sammlung/sprachlos/speechless-smiley-025.gif

My apologies to anyone who was inconvenienced or annoyed as I worked this out. I hope this hasn't put you off from trying this Mod - I like the concept, and would really like folks to play it and offer suggestions for improvements.

TerranC

August 5th, 2003, 06:20 AM

A naming error with the Imagemod will cause the main picture for the Value Improvement Plant not show up properly, and give you an error.

To Fyron, Sj, and others: Facilities pics 242-249 has a 0 attached to the pic numbers, causing errors. Please correct this error.

And it would be much appreciated if you would include the RaceGeneric picture folder, rather than having players copy and paste it in.

Edit: Other than those, Superb work. I'm going to start myself a game. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[ August 05, 2003, 05:23: Message edited by: TerranC ]

General Woundwort

August 5th, 2003, 12:34 PM

Originally posted by TerranC:
And it would be much appreciated if you would include the RaceGeneric picture folder, rather than having players copy and paste it in.I didn't do that because I was/am not too happy with the quality of those things (my own modified Highliner pics), and just wanted to include them to inspire others who actually have artistic talent to work up something. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

General Woundwort

August 27th, 2003, 11:14 PM

Player feedback is starting to come in (and there was much rejoicing (yeaaaah, yeaaaaah)), and I wanted to address the issues up front. So...

From Tesco Samoa...
The Archon (Workhorse) requires only 25% fighter bays compared to the Archon's 50%, so why use the Archon?

I guess it's more of a tactical thing (how many Riders do you want to launch per turn?), that may not make that much difference. I'll bear it in mind for any future re-work.

Perhaps you could use some of the other NeoStandard images for the different highliner hulls... having them all Worldships could get confusing. Maybe the colonizers could be ColonyShipHuge and the transports could Barge (since there's no TransportHuge for some odd reason)... not sure about the Workhorses since I don't know what exactly they represent...

Good point. My biggest concern is that not all NeoStandard sets have all of the ship types. I was just trying to keep the mod as widely usable as possible. But I will bear this in mind.

Kinda odd that the starting bases are smaller than the starting highliners... surely if you can make a 1000kT starship then you can make at least a 1000kT base?

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif Yeah, that does sound kinda dumb, doesn't it? That's up on the Priority Fix list.

"Colonizer - Compatible" is misspelled http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

#2 on the Priority Fix list. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

It wouldn't be considered cheating to put a compatible colony module on a Colonizer - Hostile in order to get extra space for cargo bays, supply storage, defenses, etc. would it?

I only call it "Colonizer - Hostile" because that's the minimum shipsize needed to carry a hostile environment (non-starting world type) colony module. If you want to put a compatible colonizer module in it, go ahead, but it may or may not fit the "50% colony space" minimum http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Was "Smaller Weapons" tech left in intentionally, to make riders more useful? Or is it a mistake? I do see that Small DUC was moved to that area so somehow I think it was intentional http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

It's basically left in solely for Troop weapons. At a later date I will probably consolidate it totally with the Troop Weapons tech (or I may keep it individuated for an "Infantry" troop type I'm playing with in my notes - we'll see...)

You really don't need to duplicate all the colonizer default design types - a given planet type is either compatible or it isn't!

I'm assuming this is in the "Default Design Type" list, right? That's mostly for human use. The AI's only know "compatible" or "hostile".

How about a "Highliner Explorer", "Highliner Scout", or "Highliner Reconnaissance" design type?

My different types are based entirely on Cargo Bay//Rider Bay//Everything Else ratios. What you do with that "Everything else" is up to you. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Uh, what is the point of highliner supply storage components? Engines are not much more expensive, are smaller, have more hitpoints, and store almost as much supply... and since there's no limit on the number of engines on a ship, that kind of makes supply storage useless... how about reducing it to 15kT or something?

I was thinking of that. I've also been toying with a total rework of the supply system (making Life Support the main supply generating component, with storage components jacked up exponentially and engines giving just movement). That I'll have to decide based on in-house experiments before I do anything with the released Mod.

Oh great... 6 turns till my first colony ship gets built... so much for doing anything in this game for a while http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif (Can't even build a spaceyard base to accelerate future construction!)

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif Welcome to the Evil Icky Twin of Proportions Mod... from Ekolis...
Storage is a little low for the scope of the beginning of the game. Perhaps 3x the size of intitial cargo ??

This was deliberate. Again, welcome to the evil twin of the Proportions Mod (ran out of space for smilies...). Interstellar travel starts low and slow, and builds up over time (and greater tech...)

The VPP can hit satellites and drones? But they don't have crew! Too bad it's impossible to make Master Computer ships immune to this weapon. Could give it the Mental Flailer damage type, but that's kinda pointless since the Mental Flailer is also in the Psychic tree...

I'm stuck with the limitations of the hard code. In order to get mental weapons to affect Riders (i.e. Fighters), they have to affect other "units" as well.

Maintenance Aptitude is still too cheap like in stock SE4 (I took +6)

I may do a real rework of maintenance in future iterations of this mod - depending on how well you do in this one...

tesco samoa

August 28th, 2003, 01:31 AM

bizarre... that is not my quote and what i wrote is not here at all... and i know i posted it ...

well i will dig it out of pbw

1. Like how you have 1000 kt down pact on designs. Very well thought out.

2. Storage is a little low for the scope of the beginning of the game. Perhaps 3x the size of intitial cargo ??

hmmm i wonder where my post went from here eariler

tesco samoa

August 28th, 2003, 01:34 AM

slow eh... due to the scale of economics research will be slowed down

Was that an intention ???

Yea slow... but in proportions you at least have some storage and a strong home world... here you do not.

P.S.

why not a 900 KT space yard ??

General Woundwort

August 28th, 2003, 02:05 AM

Originally posted by tesco samoa:
slow eh... due to the scale of economics research will be slowed down
Was that an intention ???It's why I set the research cost to "low" for the game. My basic intention for Highliner to make the game dependent on large interstellar ships. That, of course, leads to the cascade effects mentioned (slower colonization, tech research, etc) - not to mention the changes to combat...

Yea slow... but in proportions you at least have some storage and a strong home world... here you do not.But here you still have (once you get there) the opportunity to build worlds up at the usual SEIV rate, and don't have to be shackled to your homeworld so closely once that occurs. Just imagine a Highliner/Proportions combo mod... that would take about as long to play as actual interstellar travel would in RL... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

why not a 900 KT space yard ??I'll look into it.

P.S. I may have mixed up portions of your reply and Ed's in my first post. My apologies for the confusion.

[ August 28, 2003, 01:06: Message edited by: General Woundwort ]