WinSPMBT "house rules"

[Lankinen]

Do you guys use any house rules in your human vs human winspmbt games ?

Also, how large games you play regarding the point cost. (18 000pts is largest game i have played this far if i remember right.)

Rules i have been using have been:

-Ban all cluster and bomblet ammunition (too powerful)
-Ban rocket launcher artillery (too powerful)
-Limit size 0 units (too annoying, if there are too much)
-Limit infanfry to something like, 4-5 companies. (No need to limit in desert maps)
-Limit artillery (like 5-10% of total pts.)
-Get some pts limit that you _have to_ put on tanks / MBT's. (something like 30% of total pts or something. The game is named winspMBT after all.)
-If you have gunships / air strikes, you have to tell beforehand that you have them, not what you have or how many. (Frustrating to buy sam's when opponent does not have any targets for them.)

-You can only capture victory hexes with units that have guns and if infantry unit have lost over 50% of their men, you cannot capture hexes with it. Also, you cannot capture hexes with size 0 units.

How you put your victory hexes ?
in the middle of the map ?
what formation etc ?

[Roman]

I think there are no rules prefix. It arrives an agreement with the opponents.
Rules that I use frequently:
-Limit size 0 units (too annoying, if there are too much)
-Limit artillery (like 5-10% of total pts.)
Less common:
-Ban all cluster and bomblet ammunition (too powerful)
-Ban rocket launcher artillery (too powerful)
Never:
-Limit infanfry to something like, 4-5 companies. (No need to limit in desert maps)
-Get some pts limit that you _have to_ put on tanks / MBT's. (something like 30% of total pts or something. The game is named winspMBT after all.)
-If you have gunships / air strikes, you have to tell beforehand that you have them, not what you have or how many. (Frustrating to buy sam's when opponent does not have any targets for them.)
-You can only capture victory hexes with units that have guns and if infantry unit have lost over 50% of their men, you cannot capture hexes with it. Also, you cannot capture hexes with size 0 units.

[Wdll]

What's the point of warning your opponent you have air strikes? The whole idea is to limit what your opponent can buy and force him to spend money on SAM, money that he doesn't spend on tanks etc...

Anyway, yes, rules are mostly set between players.

[Roman]

In this respect:
-If you have gunships / air strikes, you have to tell beforehand that you have them, not what you have or how many. (Frustrating to buy sam's when opponent does not have any targets for them.)

Generally agree on the points of air.
Although it is more interesting to play with random air points. only know one person who likes to play well

[Lankinen]

It's kind of a gentlemen rule, that air sorties thing.

Gives you a good edge even before the game have started if u spend ur points on ground units other than air strikes and opponents is spending 5% of pts in sam's etc that do not have targets.

Gives more challenge if tables are "more even".

You use reloadable bomblets / clusters ?

(At least the reloadable ones are extra nasty.)

But, if both have the same options, tables are even, but still they are quite powerfull.

I have found it more fun to play without them, for that exact reason.

How about the hexes, how u set em up ?

(Yes, ofcourse both players have to agree for house rules.)

[Imp]

Originally Posted by Lankinen

It's kind of a gentlemen rule, that air sorties thing.

Gives you a good edge even before the game have started if u spend ur points on ground units other than air strikes and opponents is spending 5% of pts in sam's etc that do not have targets.

Gives more challenge if tables are "more even".

You use reloadable bomblets / clusters ?

(At least the reloadable ones are extra nasty.)

But, if both have the same options, tables are even, but still they are quite powerfull.

I have found it more fun to play without them, for that exact reason.

How about the hexes, how u set em up ?

(Yes, ofcourse both players have to agree for house rules.)

On air
Air set to XXX you buy AAA just like you would for doing a campaign or the formation would have, some times it has no targets sometimes its overwhelmed sometimes its about right.
Might agree something diffrent for a change if had lots of attack helo games for instance
Also no objection to taking on airbourne force though this must be stated before hand in which case I tend to buy normal AAA I would plus a few area sams that I normaly hardly bother with.
All his force including arty must be airborne except perhaps a couple of batteries of offboard arty & possibly a small scout or special forces element on the ground.
Do allow option of HQ starting setup adjacent to friendly map edge so he does not get shot down.

On "Gives more challenge if tables are "more even".
No gives one side more of a challenge one less of one better player should try to take the more difficult side.

On Cluster/ Rocket munitions
Yes use them & would not say more fun to play without but certainly much easier as do not need to use any tactics against it. In fact dont really need any tactics at all for late era MBTs vs arty so very simple. Need to go back to a WW2 or 1950 -60s game for your tanks to be worried about arty.
Just buy it sensibly can decide offmap only if dont like idea of reloads or restrict on map to say 3 or 6 units or more complex realistic things if prefer.
In fact can be a very intresting little sub game what do I use CM arty for the most counter battery fire vs his CMs taking out ATGMs & AAA only if I achieve these do I go for the tricky thing of hitting vehicles on the move
Banning cluster munitions gives tanks a hard time because AAA & ATGMs are not dealt with effectively so all you have done is changed the nature of the game.

On V hexes
Normally set up manually placing on suitable things like bridges crossroads hilltops not the middle of a field. Normally in groups of 3-5 up to 7 placed so reasonably balanced for both sides if meeting.
With roads tend to stick adjacent to rather than on so can use that road without giving away change of control &/or set most flags to control of players at start

[Lankinen]

V hexes on bridges, isn't this quite a problematic when you destroy the bridge with artillery ?

I think most of atgm units are vulnerable to field gun fire, they have 4 pen and often only MBT's have top armor over 4.

[iCaMpWiThAWP]

Originally Posted by Lankinen

V hexes on bridges, isn't this quite a problematic when you destroy the bridge with artillery ?

I think most of atgm units are vulnerable to field gun fire, they have 4 pen and often only MBT's have top armor over 4.

Bridges are usually hot-spots in any full-scale war, so it can be good to have v-hexes in bridges, and the hexes around them, if someone blows the bridge, both sides lose it and the v-hex in there,(sure it can be held before, and then would be stuck) but most points you get are from killing anyway...

[gila]

Originally Posted by Lankinen

V hexes on bridges, isn't this quite a problematic when you destroy the bridge with artillery ?

I think most of atgm units are vulnerable to field gun fire, they have 4 pen and often only MBT's have top armor over 4.

1)Bridges are choke points and should be given consideration when placing VH's.

2)Depending on the range of atgm's they dont have to move much and they are 0 size,better they find a good FoV and stay put and wait for hapless armour to come in range,then the fun starts

[Imp]

As said tend to place v hexes by roads not on them that includes bridges but you want to try taking bridges down with arty makes me happy. Whats your success rate I am all for it once in a while you may get lucky but normally using heavy stuff that hurts on hexes where my units arent so Im happy.

Not going to get into CM arty debate been done to death try doing searches you will see I am all for it. Talking about using CM vs foot ATGM not vehicle eliminate fast. Thats the difference with a modern battle things die much quicker & can move much faster as a whole its not a safe place to be. Once I am ready to launch an attack I want to kill & move on as fast as possible decisive strike not a firefight. Keep the initiative & you have won 95% of the time but ATGMs can act as spoilers & slow things down so crucial to take out fast.
Only if your tanks are heavily outclassed is CM handy vs other tanks otherwise strip the tanks support away with it & they are dead. A few mortar rounds to suppress the tank a bit is all you need on the arty front vs them.
That said the worry of having CM around means sometimes you dont use stuff as effectively as could without it as wont risk groups so the threat of CM makes killing them easier.