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  #1  
Old March 16th, 2018, 05:43 PM

Dion Dion is offline
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Default Timed Objectives

Thinking about using Timed Objectives in my games, but before I make that commitment, I need to know what kind of effects they usually invoke. Please respond. All commits would be helpful.
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  #2  
Old March 16th, 2018, 07:08 PM
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Default Re: Timed Objectives

Timed Objectives start to give the defender accrued Victory Points after a certain point in the game (dependant on battle type - Turn 3 for meet, 1/4 time limit in advance and 1/3 in assault). Therefore the only "effect they invoke" is to put a "hurry up" on the attacker.

With the TO turned up to full a defender able to hang on to an objective for most of the game may get more VP than the attacker does at endgame for occupying the objective.
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  #3  
Old March 16th, 2018, 10:02 PM
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Default Re: Timed Objectives

Games with Timed Objectives need some careful thought concerning the defending forces.

If the amount of, and cost of, defensive forces is too high it becomes impossible for the attacker to ever gain more points then the defender.

And as mentioned it tends to pressure the attacker to "Banzai" rather then perform any sort of tactical maneuvers.
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Old March 16th, 2018, 11:40 PM
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Default Re: Timed Objectives

I often play with it set at 6-15 depending on force size, as said makes you hurry things up a bit.
Actually use in meeting engagements now to as penalises you if try playing it more like a delay.
Larger values have merrit on occasion if want to force speed to abstract things like opponent has reinforcments inbound or your off map flank is collapsing.
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Old March 18th, 2018, 12:39 PM
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Post Re: Timed Objectives

I am not so certain the effect of force size on timed objectives (TO). Rather, it is important to set the TO value in relation to the objective.

One problem, is that TOs are set singular. Once set they apply to all VP hex. So, if you set a bridge as the objective and give it a TO value of 3, all VPs held by the defender will accrue to the defender even if you capture the bridge.

TO requires a more precise design of the scenario with regard to mission and objectives. You must account for force size, but it is not the only determinant. If you have a single VP hex, say to capture bridge, then the TO is easy to manage.

So, a designer has to estimate how long the attacker requires to capture a VP. Therefore, if you say, the attacker must capture six VPs, make sure that those six VP are the overwhelming majority of VPs. Say you have 9 VPs, then make it those six within reasonable possibility by game turns per scenario type: meeting engagement, advance, assault.

Additionally, VP value does not matter in TO calculations, only the value of the TO and the mission type. A hack you may explore, is too set the Turn size higher than you would otherwise without TO.

I have a scenario you could look at: USMC Alpha Co 1/6 Marjeh 09/2009. You can DL, Scn595_Alpha_1-6_Marjeh.zip as well.


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Old March 19th, 2018, 01:37 AM
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Default Re: Timed Objectives

Wow that sounds complicated.

Just like vanilla victory hex values force size plays a part. Cheap force and VHex set to max cost does not work.
Expensive force especially MBT modern equipment makes taking VHexes worthwhile again.
Some cases if playing for points why risk a MBT for a VHex worth half its value.

The mission type determines when you start getting points for controling them so look at your VHex placement and what you want to achieve to set the level.

Simply put the side that benefits is the side that controls over half the victory hexes during the period that points are recieved for them.

If the defender starts with all 21 under there control the attacker wants to take control of some before points are recieved for them.
Lets say they get 7 defender has 14 so is recieving more.
Later in the game its reversed 14-7, if the attacker took them quick enough they are now getting more points than the defender.
So if defender held them while active for 10 turns and the attacker for 15 they actually benefited the attacker.

Therefore use to force the pace slightly, extra speed gives extra points hopefully enough to offset any extra losses from the hurry up. I like it as tends to make you keep pressing forward, pausing to gather more info now costs you.
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Old March 19th, 2018, 11:53 AM
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Post Re: Timed Objectives

Quote:
Originally Posted by Imp View Post
Wow that sounds complicated.

Simply put the side that benefits is the side that controls over half the victory hexesIf the defender starts with all 21 under there control the attacker wants to take control of some before points are recieved for them.
I am not certain the attacker ever receives TO points, only the defender.


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Old March 19th, 2018, 01:56 PM
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Default Re: Timed Objectives

The owner of a timed V hex gets the timed score - but the defender gets double if he is still holding it in the later game (>).666 * scenario nax turn). At least that is my reading of the code what I wrote back in 2013.

Also - remember that timed hexes do not apply for users of the free demo, so any scenario (including user campaigns) which use the feature are not applicable to those who are simply evaluating the game with the free download. Any scenario or user camp using timed objectives therefore should state in the intro that it's not for free game users.
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Old March 19th, 2018, 02:09 PM
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Post Re: Timed Objectives

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Originally Posted by Mobhack View Post
Also - remember that timed hexes do not apply for users of the free demo, so any scenario (including user campaigns) which use the feature are not applicable to those who are simply evaluating the game with the free download. Any scenario or user camp using timed objectives therefore should state in the intro that it's not for free game users.
Great reminder. I should include that as well on the forum intro. Also, I recall NLOS weapon class 27 requires a CD version not the free download as well.


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Old March 20th, 2018, 01:03 AM
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Post Re: Timed Objectives

From the Game Guide regarding Timed Objectives:

"The attacker does not get any timed hex score credit. He removes any potential future score from the defender by taking the victory hex as early as he can. Scenarios can be built with timed
objectives, this includes those built into user campaigns but these will only be of use for full CD game owners. The last turn and accumulated scores for timed victory hexes are reported at the
end turn phase once they have started to be credited for the battle type. The total is also now reported on the end game score sheet."


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