.com.unity Forums
  The Official e-Store of Shrapnel Games

This Month's Specials

BCT Commander- Save $6.00
World Supremacy- Save $10.00

   







Go Back   .com.unity Forums > Shrapnel Community > Space Empires: IV & V

View Poll Results: Do you prefer to know the formulas which determine what happens in a game, or do you prefer not to k
I strongly prefer to know the formulas. 20 40.82%
I somewhat prefer to know the formulas. 18 36.73%
I don't have a specific preference. 2 4.08%
I sort of prefer not to know the exact formulas. 6 12.24%
I strongly prefer not to know the exact formulas. 3 6.12%
Voters: 49. You may not vote on this poll

 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Prev Previous Post   Next Post Next
  #7  
Old December 18th, 2004, 03:03 AM
Suicide Junkie's Avatar
Suicide Junkie Suicide Junkie is offline
Shrapnel Fanatic
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Waterloo, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 11,451
Thanks: 1
Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
Suicide Junkie is on a distinguished road
Default Re: (OT) Do you prefer to know game formulas?

Quote:
deccan said:
I voted with the majority (and I voted in the one you made in the Dom2 board too), but I think the exception is if the ambiguity is part of the game design. I think that MOO3's original idea of Imperial Focus Points was quite cool, but it would have been a good rationale to prevent the player from knowing the exact details of some things unless he spent resources to know them.
As long as the game lets you know the details of the ambiguity.

Don't say "DUC: does about 50 damage", when you could say "DUC: does 40-55 damage" (with linear/gaussian/etc probability curve)

-----

Focus points...
So many ways for that to go wrong.

You need to have both competent AIs, and AIs that can take orders without going insane.
You need to let them remember a priority list of your orders, and have them ask for clarification when things conflict.
And perhaps most importantly they need to be able to justify their actions to the player, and then adjust their priorities and values based on what the player orders.

Perhaps the focus points really should be used in a different way...
let the player adjust the sliders and generic orders all he wants: "Tell the governor of Arcturus that my flagship had better be done this month, or he'll be drinking his beer from the bottom of the lava mine on Hades II"

Instead, use the points for bringing in ministers for a personal tribute/talking-to/torture session. IE: give your AI's priorities and values a direct tweak so they will do better next time

You also need to let the player remain in control of everything... If they player orders something specific, it must remain that way.
If the AI wants to change something that the player did, they need to ask/beg first. And SAY WHY. If the player says no, then the AI had better increase its percieved value of leaving the setting as is. Ask again only if it is really important, and redouble the threshold every time the user says no.

-----

The question of Why would make a huge difference:
Consider if you had personally ordered a training facility built in a chokepoint system to help boost the troops as they arrived.

"Governor Joe wants permission to scrap your training facility at Algaran I"
Heck, no! I built that for a reason, dummy!
...(Two Months Later)...
"Governor Joe REALLY wants permission to scrap your training facility at Algaran I"
What? You again!? Grr, now I've gotta go and look at everything to see what's got you so upset. 50 lashes for wasting my time!

-or-

"Governor Joe wants to scrap your training facility at Algaran I because a higher-level training facility is under construction (2 months) near the resupply depot on Algaran II (Y/N)".
Ah, excellent work. Have a cookie!

Note that this isn't going to be easy.
The AI has to pick out just the new and/or major influencing factors in its decision, and decide which of those to present to the player in a sentence or two.
And you can't just try to maximize the number of "yes" responses. The minion needs to mention the big negative influences too, or it will be seen as manipulative and untrustworthy. A fair and balanced summary of why in a sentence or two is very hard.
Allowing a small chart/graphic/icon-map might help.

Hmm, this seems to have wandered really far off-topic.
Reply With Quote
 

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:03 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©1999 - 2025, Shrapnel Games, Inc. - All Rights Reserved.