On Fighters

[WhiteHojo]

One hit/one kill - my god, if you hate being swarmed by 200+ fighters now imagine if that 1/1 ratio were in effect. small planets and small fleets would have NO chance vs. 1 carrier. To me it would be a little unbalancing but that is the beauty of SE4, if you don't like it, change it... in that spirit I wouldn't mind seeing Tampa's ratio option in the game (just be able to let me change it - I hate fighters.)

Mephisto gave me an idea - his 2 shields on large fighters.... add shield piercing PDs to the components. Maybe make the 1st be available when you get PD lvl 3 & the corresponding tech lvl for phased energy weapons? Don't know how hard that would be to Mod but it might be interesting (at least for multiplayer, cause I have'nt seen a AI fighter w/2 shields yet.)

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Character is best defined as that which you do when you believe nobody is watching.

[This message has been edited by WhiteHojo (edited 25 January 2001).]

[Baron Munchausen]

This is the same problem that came up on the SE IV Center forum BBs long ago, before the game was released. It's the old problem of which "style" of warfare is or should be better: carrier or capital ship? If you make fighters as powerful as they are today then a single fighter could carry a weapon that will destroy a ship with one hit. If you then get a carrier with 100+ fighters it's going to be invincible against almost any fleet without fighters to counter it. So, of course, people who prefer capital ships will complain that fighters are too powerful. If you try to balance fighters by giving PDC cannons a good chance to hit them and not giving them weapons that can destroy a ship with a single hit then fighter-oriented people complain that fighters are too wimpy. You can't win! I have to admit that I cannot think of a way to make it exciting and interesting for BOTH sides myself. Either you're a carrier partisan, and think fighters ought to take out even capital ships with ease, or you're a capital ship partisan and you think fighters should be swept away by powerful ships. <shrug>...

[This message has been edited by Baron Munchausen (edited 25 January 2001).]

[WhiteHojo]

Baron, you have captured the essence of the debate in nutshell. I, obviously, am a Captital Ship kinda guy. Fighters to me should be relgated to shuttle duties between BattleCruisers and larger Ships of the Line.

In this spirit, I have a little question I need answered by the Mighty Modders out there. I have a new component (text of the 1st level component to be included later) which will aid me in the destruction of the Godless Hordes of Cowardly Fighters I seem to be incountering w/the new Sergetti and EA races. I haven't really seen a large need for this new component but why should that stop us. Anyway, my question is this: Is there anything or specifically any other file I should modify to allow my new toy to be available in game? The new component is a Shield Piercing Point-Defense Cannon (affectionately known as an SPPD) and requires 2 tech areas to build - PD weapons & Energy Stream Weapons. Do I have to modify any of the research or vehicle construction files to allow this new SPPD to be used by me or the AI?

So far I have just tweaked w/existing components and files and have not made any new component(my dreamed of MiniMineSweeper never panned out) so I am unfamiliar w/the proceedure.

And as always, any help would be appreciated.

Name := Shield Piercing Point - Defense Cannons I
Description := Small mobile Multi-Phasic energy beams on turrets which can penetrate normal shields and are used to target and destroy incoming fighters and seekers.
Pic Num := 66
Tonnage Space Taken := 20
Tonnage Structure := 20
Cost Minerals := 100
Cost Organics := 0
Cost Radioactives := 0
Vehicle Type := Ship\Base\Sat\WeapPlat
Supply Amount Used := 0
Restrictions := None
General Group := Weapons
Family := 2005
Roman Numeral := 1
Custom Group := 0
Number of Tech Req := 2
Tech Area Req 1 := Point-Defense Weapons
Tech Level Req 1 := 1
Tech Area Req 2 := Energy Stream Weapons
Tech Level Req 2 := 1
Number of Abilities := 1
Ability 1 Type := Point-Defense
Ability 1 Descr :=
Ability 1 Val 1 := 0
Ability 1 Val 2 := 0
Weapon Type := Point-Defense
Weapon Target := Ftr\Sat\Seekers
Weapon Damage At Rng := 25 25 25 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Weapon Damage Type := Skips Normal Shields
Weapon Reload Rate := 1
Weapon Display Type := Torp
Weapon Display := 21
Weapon Modifier := 50
Weapon Sound := pointdef.wav
Weapon Family := 6




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Character is best defined as that which you do when you believe nobody is watching.

[Tampa_Gamer]

You shouldn't have to modify the tech files. (However, I am at work and my brain is a little fried from reading documents all day). You will have to modify the design and research files of the AI if you want them to use it. Now that I think about it, another way to get the AI to use them without heavily modifying their files would be to make these PDC levels 6-10 and then you would only have to change the AI research files to max-out at PDW TL10 instead of TL5. Hmmm....

[This message has been edited by Tampa_Gamer (edited 25 January 2001).]

[dmm]

A great use for cruddy small fighters: use swarms of them to suck up enemy PD fire, so your wave of seekers (or large fighters) coming behind them can waltz right in and destroy the enemy's capital ships. Especially satisfying to take out dedicated PD ships this way, early in a battle.

[Sinapus]

Phased-energy PD?

Fine, I'll start on that small phased-shield components for fighters in the shield tech area.

Hmm... throwing all those small fighters in to distract enemy fire sounds like building chaff ships in Stars! (Or the Wild Weasel planes the US Air Force uses to thwart SAM sites.)

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--
"What do -you- want?" "I'd like to live -just- long enough
to be there when they cut off your head and stick it on a
pike as a warning to the next ten generations that some favors
come with too high a price. I would look up into your lifeless
eyes and wave like this..." *waggle* "...can you and your
associates arrange that for me, Mr. Morden?"

[This message has been edited by Sinapus (edited 26 January 2001).]

[Aegis]

I like the idea of changing most weapons to inflict one hit. Then the ability to 'stream' damage (stolen from MOO), so that multiple casualties can be inflicted with a single weapon firing, could be attached to some of the presently more useless weapons (meson bLasters spring to to mind).

As to the question which should be more powerful, a fleet of fighters or a cap ship... well my personal take is they should be balanced. A fully loaded light carrier should be equivalent to a warship, a heavy carrier to a dreadnought. With Heavy fighters that should be upped a little in the carriers favour. A baseship should always be stronger than a carrier filled with ships, provided they're at the same tech level. And the Death Star I'm tinkering on can take on a fleet of either. (No, it's not vulnerable to a single fighter torpedo. I'm not the Emperor. I don't make mistakes like that, after all, I've read the 'How to be an Evil-Overlord').

-Aegis