Intel Comms Mimic Question

[Fyron]

Originally posted by PvK:
I'll throw out two arguments on the WP issue.
2) Late-game WP's can destroy ships even in a large fleet, which can be helpful, but more importantly, if they cripple the mobility of an enemy ship, they can stop or slow an entire fleet, saving other worlds from destruction and buying time for the defender's fleet to arrive, and/or making it possible for the fleet to intercept the attacking fleet.

Never seen that happen yet. Late game, my smaller fleets (read: 40+ ships, which is a small late game fleet, except on small maps) always steamroll over huge breathables filled with WPs. Of course, that is a rare occurence, as most people don't build WPs. I guess it could happen if you let too much peace occur before going to war, with huge build-up periods.

The problem with WPs is that they eat up a tremendous amount of time and resources to defend all your planets; resources and time that would be better spent on attack ships to take the fight to the enemy. Just a couple of them are meaningless; you must have big planets filled with them to even try to make a dent in the enemy. This is why I essentially quartered the costs of WPs in Adamant Mod. Might have gone too far in the opposite direction, but testing will show that (or the opposite).

[ October 14, 2003, 21:53: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

[PvK]

On point one, see what Loser said. In late-game, it's easy to sweep mines. A vastly cheaper 1-2 ships can glass a planet defended only by mines... unless it has a few Large WP's.

On point two, yes a 40+ ship fleet usually won't be stopped by a planet filled with WP's. But only a few WP's can stop a small group, or as spoon said, slow down a fleet of any size, if it does mobility damage. A single large WP with shield depleters and an ionic disperser has a good chance of stopping an entire fleet in its tracks, and allowing a defense fleet to catch it.

PvK

[Fyron]

Problem is, fast ships can normally just skip right past that range advantage WPs have to do tons of damage before the WPs get a chance to fight back, often destroying most, if not all, of the WPs before they can shoot.

40 ships is a small group as far as I am concerned. I think we are talking a totally different order of scale here.

In my experience, WPs have never been anything more than an annoyance in the mid and late games. Only in the early game have they been a real threat.

[ October 16, 2003, 01:58: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

[narf poit chez BOOM]

WPs have to do tons of damage before the WPs get a chance to fight back

read that again, Fyron.

[PvK]

No, I've seen attacks by large fleets of max-speed ships with tons of shields. Massive Mount WP weapons usually get enough of a range advantage that not enough ships can wipe out many platforms before at least some shots get off. Again, the goal is not to be able to defeat a huge armada with WPs. The idea is to force the enemy to use relatively large fleets, and then to delay and slow the attacking armada so it can be intercepted with less damage done to planets.

PvK

[Mephisto]

I consider WPs a major asset to win any war. I allows me to mass my ships in attacks on the enemy while my worlds are relatively save from small intruders. In fact WPs did tip the tide for me in one major war.
My enemy, the Guild, had a economic advantage. They already had annihilated three other players fleets (my allies) on the western front. All that stand between the ultimate victory of the Guild was my fleet in the east that prevented him to stage a offensive in the west. However as time went on his fleets grow larger while I could not keep up the pace, neither could I afford any more ships. I retreated from my defence position the month he gave the attack order and my fleet escaped narrowly. The Guild attacked three major worlds, all packed with 25 WPs. In these battles he lost 30 of his 210 ships and every battle took a whole month. Meanwhile the remains of my allies fleets arrived in my space, joined my fleet and surprised the Guild right after they attacked my third world. In this battle the Guild fleet (over 35% XP) was beaten for the first time ever. My WPs did not only destroy 30 ships, they bought me the time I needed to consolidate my forces.
Its interesting how this war can give you an answer to the question what happens without WPs, too. My victories fleet now crossed the first two Guild systems (that had WPs) and massacred every planet in the Guild backyard (undefended by WPs) in Groups of 5 ships with a minesweeper each. Riots broke out on the Guild planets and the galactic war that had Lasted for 6 years ended with a total defeat of the Guild only 12 month after the first shots of my WPs were fired.

Edit: 6 years, i.e. 60 turns, not 56 years war.

[ October 18, 2003, 16:26: Message edited by: Mephisto ]

[spoon]

Originally posted by Mephisto:
My enemy, the Guild, had a economic advantage. They already had annihilated three other players fleets (my allies) on the western front.

Maybe the reason the Guild was able to take on four other players simultaneously was because he didn't squander his time building WPs