Supercombattant pretenders....what about...

[Particle]

KO has replied in the AI's thread yesterday:

"I got an idea regarding AI dependancy on LI when I was away. Vacations are 'foyson' for the mind.


Regarding fort construction. I'm not sure how the AI works, but where would you build a fortress? Consider fort type, nation, geography, income, resources etc.

What is the most important matter? How should they be weighted? How much shall current wars affect the spending of time and money. What army should build the fortress?

I wouldn't mind a numerical evaluation of this such as:
Castle cost / 2 < Income + res + gem income x 25 + neighbors x 5
Add a couple of other conditions.

Just to make you think. Eventually it might result in something good."


The devs ARE wishing to upgrade the AI., and we MUST HELP TO THEM WITH IDEAS AND REPORTS. Stop TROLLING HERE Nagot Gick Fel!

[ November 03, 2003, 12:10: Message edited by: Particle ]

[johan osterman]

Originally posted by Mortifer:

This means that the hella lot of Posts / suggestions about 'how to improve the strategic AI' were totally pointless?

The AI thread isnt pointless, if nothing else it has moved form: the AI sucks, it must be improved, to a list of specific complaints. The list is actually helpfull and much less irritating than the orginal the AI sucks Posts. Without promising anything making the AI favourably wieght sacred or armored troops when recruiting might be a candidate for an improvement, for example.

[Sammual]

Originally posted by johan osterman:
Without promising anything making the AI favourably wieght sacred or armored troops when recruiting might be a candidate for an improvement, for example.

Woot!

Sammual

[Aristoteles]

Originally posted by johan osterman:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mortifer:

This means that the hella lot of Posts / suggestions about 'how to improve the strategic AI' were totally pointless?

The AI thread isnt pointless, if nothing else it has moved form: the AI sucks, it must be improved, to a list of specific complaints. The list is actually helpfull and much less irritating than the orginal the AI sucks Posts. Without promising anything making the AI favourably wieght sacred or armored troops when recruiting might be a candidate for an improvement, for example.

---

johan many of us are trying to help to you guys, I have made that list after 15 games with the demo. All of those were played for 40 turns, and I've posted my experience.

Hopefully the AI scripter can make improvements in those things on the list. We don't need any promises, we won't demand anything..at least me.
I love this game, and I want to help to you to make it even lot better, via a lot better strategic AI.

better strategic AI -> better, more enjoyable SP -> happier players & fans.

I think this is all clear.

[DominionsFan]

Yup, trollish Posts are gone (the ai sucks etc.), and very good suggestions can be found now in the AI thread.
Just check them out and try to solve the problems with it.

[Nagot Gick Fel]

Originally posted by Mortifer:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Nagot Gick Fel:
JO already said JK felt rather reluctant to do further work on the AI, and you keep on pestering him to answer to your AI worries.

Where did you read about this? I am kinda shocked by this statement.

---

Actually that was KO, not JO, and he wrote:

I think the major problem with diplo AI is that I don't know anything about AI coding and JK is bored by it (he made the AI so he should know).

That was in the "What did I missed from Dom I.? -> DIPLOMACY!" thread, page #5.

Also what is your point at all? I don't understad you. We all know that you are a multiplayer, and no one cares about this. No one was whining about that.

Simple: there are still many bugs and balance issues in the game that need to be solved, these affect both SP and MP play, and should be solved first. Improving the AI will certainly require more much time than the bug/balance fixes and will mainly benefit to the SP players. How is it so difficult to understand?

You are constantly flaming the people, who trying to make suggestions about the strategic AI.

I apologize to anyone who got the impression I flamed him, as that wasn't my intent. BTW, I spent 30 minutes to locate the post by KO that I quoted above, so please return the favor and point the threads where I did flame these persons. I doubt you'll find any, bar this one, to support your "constantly" claim. Also note the order of events in this very thread that led to the present discussion:

Someone: it's so easy to abuse the AI with an SC pretender in SP, fix this asap.

Me: it's not that important, there are workarounds to this:
(1) if you don't want to abuse the AI, just don't abuse the AI - IOW, don't field a SC pretender.
(2) edit the map files to improve the AI starting position.
(Note: no flames)

Someone: Improving the AI is VERY important. Nagot you're selfish. Angry smileys.
(Note: no argument. First flame)

Me: but there are workarounds! Try them out.
(Note: still no flames from me)

Someone: Nagot you're wrong. AI is very important regardless of your suggestion. You're living in the past.
(Note: More flames)

Me: replying (with arguments) in the same sarcastic tone (past -> future), so flame for flame. But note I wrote "I truly hope IW will prove me wrong".

So, who's to blame for the flames?

I think that at least 60% of the players would be lot happier with a better strategical AI.

I sure would. I'd love to see a really good AI. But again, I think there are higher priorities. I explained the why and the how.

I haven't seen a constructive post from you about the strategical AI,

You're kidding, right? I explained how to script the map files to provide easy workarounds to a deficient AI, and these workarounds are available NOW! The AI doesn't equip his pretender? Script. He doesn't build havy troops? Script. He always pick a crappy dominion? Script. He doesn't build fortresses? Script. Has anyone ever given a more constructive contribution that that? Than something that works NOW, as opposed to an improved AI that we may probably not see in a foreseeable future? I doubt it.

[DominionsFan]

Hey Nagot, can't you stop plz?
IMHO improving the strategic AI. should be the #1. on the priority list. It is very important, and no I won't and can't script.
Scripts wont raise the quality of the AI.