Comparison of Knights

[Patrik]

I like the Vans as well, however, the low strength+spear combo (damage only 14!) is hurting them and without some bless effects I think there are several more priceworthy options.

My absolute favorite cavalry for the moment (although it can hardly be called a knight unit) is Pangeas Centaur Warrior (CW). These are the stats:

code:

---

 

hp           20

prot         11

mor          12

MR           13

str          13

att          10 

def          16

mov         3/29

gold/res   40/11

---

These stats are quite good in themselves, (except for prot and attack), however, what makes CWs shine are their wonderful 'add-ons'

1. Berserk +3. This is a Nature 8 blessing for free! Very nice increase to protection, attack and damage. Defense will decrease to 13, which however still is quite decent.
2. Recuperation. Due to the low prot the CWs will get hurt a lot, however they have a good chance of surviving thanks to the 20 hp. I see very few afflictions among my squads with 2 or 3 stars veterans.
3. Sneaky. Only Vanheim has better (but more expensive) sneaking troops
4. Forest survival. Most importantly, this makes it possible to take full advantage of the strategic move of 3.
5. Hoof damage = Strength. Normal cavalry have a somewhat useless Hoof attack with damage 10 (strength not added). Pangeans Hoof damage is 0 with strength added. For CWs that means 13 normal, then 16! when they go berserk.

Since I use CWs as the core of my Pangean armies, I can easily afford to take sloth 2, giving me points to spend elsewhere.

Buffs are an issue by itself, but IMO a Pan casting Summon Earth Power/Legions of Steel/Strength of Giants on a squad of CWs with Hold and Attack orders will create a truly awesome force, capable of taking on any standard troops. And then of course there is Mass Protection.

/Patrik

[Huzurdaddi]

I find Van's with a good bless effect ( water anyone? ) to be almost silly good. Sure they don't kill quickly due to their low damage attack, but they sure don't take any damage either ( their defence becomes silly ). Add in the glamour ability and you will have units with lots of experience stars in no time. And that only makes the defence go higher! Yokies.

Sadly I find bless effects pretty costly in general. You are pretty much giving up on a really effective SC when you go for a big bless effect ( like water 10 wooooot ).

[Firebreath]

Some good stuff. Just to add a little,

Most heavy cav are very good when used in their context.

E.g. the Van cav. when used with a water 10 blessing, and glamour combo.

Ulm cavalry (which comes sacred, but capital only in one of the themes), with an earth 10 blessing, becomes equally formidable, especially if combined with the protection spell ulm starts with, they get to a protection of about 33 I think. Of course, their low magic resistance is a big drawback, but just put some militia in front to draw the initial mag. flak.

The amazon cavalry is amazingly cheap, and generally has pretty good stats, and one of them is fearfull to boot. They only have spears, but they're tactictly flexible (unlike some of the other heavy cavs).

Other cavalry units that have not been mentioned are unit (leader) cavalry. Sacred and not. Unique units too. When equiped with good items, they can be pretty good supercombatants.

One final point: an important additional comparison point is the weapons that they come with. Lances + morningstar, of course, are a damn sight better than a simple spear. But then, all heavy cav. are good, just as long as you use them in the right situation.

I'm curious though, has anyone found a good use of the fire mage cavalry (it comes from a magic site, and is basically a heavy cav. leader with fire 2). Apart from fire shield (which is nice when fighting off hordes of low hp units with just one regenerating unit), I can't think of anything else to do with the magic. Any ideas?

[ April 21, 2004, 22:48: Message edited by: Firebreath ]

[E. Albright]

Well, Fire Lords do offer fairly high mundane leadership for a recruitable mage...

Since the subject of exotic units has now been breeched, where do y'all think Grey Knights fit into the grand scheme of knight quality?

[Graeme Dice]

Originally posted by Firebreath:
I'm curious though, has anyone found a good use of the fire mage cavalry

Put a life draining weapon on him and have him cast fire shield, phoenix pyre. That's always a useful combo, but it can be overcome by killing him quickly enough that he can't regain his fatigue.

[LintMan]

Originally posted by tinkthank:

In general, it seems to me as if the Van is just way too scary for its price and non-captial-availability. I would like to see Vans cost a bit more. I'd also like to see the Red Guard either cost a bit less or have some increased bonuses of some sort.

Some of the other Posts have pointed out some down sides for the Van, but I wanted to address this point. I don't think it's a great idea to push for nerfs and boosts on the basis of just comparing against a handful of other races' equivalent units. Dom2 (thankfully!) doesn't have unit-by-unit balance among the races. Some races have fantastic cavalry, some do not. Some have awesome missile units, and some do not. Same thing with mages, etc. Every race has some benefits and tradeoffs. IMHO, if you don't look at the bigger picture when comparing race's units, you risk either throwing the overall balance out of whack, or homogenizing all the races.

[DeathDaemon]

Machaka spiders?

I'm always scared of them, but not much else other than sorcerers and bane spiders (assassins).

code:

---

(1). Spider knight - web spit, fangs (16 dmg, web, death poison), spear, forest survival. Not bad 

(2). Black hunter - lance, fangs (18 dmg, web, death poison), spear, forest survival, sacred.  Scary.





	(1)	(2)

	----------------

HP	12	13	

PROT	18	22

MRL	11	14

MR	10	11

STR	11	11

ATK	11	12

DEF	13	10

MOVE	2/12	2/20

COST	55/25	125/38

---