SCs other than the vq

[Tris]

(conveniantly ignoring the post-deletion debate)

Everyone seems to have conveniantly ignored my "give us counter strategies" post. The summary of what I said:

A balanced strategy should, if anticipated have accessable and effective counters. I should not be able to tell you "I'm going to choose paper" and have a chance of winning (presumably you will choose scissors).

So can the more experienced players provide worked examples of viable counters to a) The typical VQ SC and to b) the castle/temple/VQ strategy, given that you guess someone is using that strategy from (say) turn 2.

You know exactly what is coming. You should be able to destroy your opponent for being so predictable....

Do you know how much time it would take to detail each and every strategy for each? There is one big, VQ counter thread for all the nuances of killing a VQ in and out of their domain, look there. Though you might want to discriminate the "Normal VQ" the "Equipped VQ" the "EQ with 6 Wishes pumped into it". Dominion fighting should be fairly simplistic with the suggestions that were presented. And for the castling, that is depending on the nation/use you use. If you have access to stealth troops or heavy high moving troops you don't have to worry about it as much, if you are playing Ulm on the other hand, you will have to worry about it.

Also you have to factor in "How many people playing the game" and "What map" and "If they have sea provinces" and "If they react in any given way."

[Tris]

This was meant to be "If you anticipated their use of this tactic from turn 2". So presumably when you spot it they are using a VQ, if you delay it will be an EQ, and further down the line an EQ with wishes.

I've read that thread and it seemed to mainly suggest ways to beat a VQ in battle, at least some of which seemed to me to be more expensive than the cost to your opponent of his VQ being beaten in battle.

I was after the "This strategy is balanced:if you anticipate it early you can do X" answer.

Thanks for the reply anyway, and I'll go read over that thread again, in case I've missed a valid answer to my query.

Cheers.

[Norfleet]

Originally posted by Tris:
I've read that thread and it seemed to mainly suggest ways to beat a VQ in battle, at least some of which seemed to me to be more expensive than the cost to your opponent of his VQ being beaten in battle.

As a general rule, it'll always be slightly more expensive on a purely explicit level to guarantee success in an offensive operation against a defending force: However, if you're using resources that are reusable, this doesn't matter: You only have to replace the resources consumed. Also, the value of taking ground and holding ground, I.E., actually making progress against your opponent, cannot be quite so easily defined. Since driving off the opposing VQ defender and actually taking a castle represents progress that is not so easily undone, particularly since your opponent will now have to use a new tactic, given that you have decisively countered his old one.

How difficult this will be depends on how well prepared he was to switch gears. Obviously, if he has a secondary strategy that he can switch to, you'll have to counter that, too: However, this will no longer be the VQ....unless he's very stupid, and will keep hamhandedly trying the same, now ineffective, strategy.

[ May 06, 2004, 14:10: Message edited by: Norfleet ]

[archaeolept]

Originally posted by Gandalf Parker:
Its not that unusual for Posts to be deleted if they take the mood too far in the wrong direction. Actually what I did was delete my post which probably was basly worded. Also the post before it which started the off discussion, and the one following it which was nothing but flames.
Alot of things could be done. Editing, removing a post, removing a thread. But the thread has alot of good info in it if it can stay friendly.

[italics added]

hmm, I was going to stay away from this thread, but given that I was subsequently attacked...

No, it wasn't nothing but flames. Likely you found the tone disagreeable, perhaps in much the same manner as I had found your tone previously disagreeable.

but to delete the evidence and then, after the fact, slander my post w/out anyone having the ability to judge for themselves...

ehh, ok, now I'm definitely out of this thread, which is now just a heap of burning wreckage anyways.

[ May 06, 2004, 18:12: Message edited by: archaeolept ]

[Gandalf Parker]

[quote]Originally posted by archaeolept:

Originally posted by Gandalf Parker:
[qb] Its not that unusual for Posts to be deleted if they take the mood too far in the wrong direction. Actually what I did was delete my post which probably was basly worded. Also the post before it which started the off discussion, and the one following it which was nothing but flames.
Alot of things could be done. Editing, removing a post, removing a thread. But the thread has alot of good info in it if it can stay friendly. italics added]

hmm, I was going to stay away from this thread, but given that I was subsequently attacked...

No, it wasn't nothing but flames. Likely you found the tone disagreeable, perhaps in much the same manner as I had found your tone previously disagreeable.

You mean like this post? Full of information and worthy discussion on the topic of the thread and the board?

but to delete the evidence and then, after the fact, slander my post w/out anyone having the ability to judge for themselves...

Youre right.

ehh, ok, now I'm definitely out of this thread, which is now just a heap of burning wreckage anyways.

Back on topic? Discussing "SCs other than the vq"? Sorry about that.

[ May 06, 2004, 18:57: Message edited by: Gandalf Parker ]

[Wikd Thots]

Originally posted by Pirateiam:
What astonishes me is that there are not more flame wars and arguments since we are just a bunch of Megalomaniac God Pretendars.

There are... well there was.. go back and see.. oh wait you cant, theyre not there. Well you can see some of the people who used to spend alot of time here flaming newbies who asked questions, or telling shrapnel that there games.. telling the devs that there game was all.. Nope, come to think of it those people arent around now.

They can always get another ISP account and come back with a different IP but that doesnt do much good unless they play much nicer. Or stay mostly real quiet until someone makes a post like why arent there more flamewars

[ May 06, 2004, 19:29: Message edited by: Wikd Thots ]