So how about extending the depth of the casting queue?

[HJ]

The option to enbale/disable spells from the casting selection screen would suffice. You would still have to choose whether to cast or attack after the fifth, but if you choose to cast at least there would be some control to avoid casting spells that are inappropriate/unwanted.

[Norfleet]

Originally posted by Esben Mose Hansen:
All this is in thread with my "Micromanagement is bad theme".

(If I had my way, you would not be able to build armies except at your capital. At all That would also make light infantry more useful.)

Maybe you just need to rethink your playing style. I've found that I can greatly reduce the level of micromanagement I suffer through a few simple adaptations to my playstyle, and avoiding certain micromanagement-intensive nations. This allows me to easily complete even the late-game, massive-map turns in less than an hour easily. Going faster helps, too!

[Soapyfrog]

Well we all know the root cause of the problem, and that is overly simplistic AI.

A Mage should be able to make some basic checks to his situation... if there are nothing but mages on one side of a battle, they should not be buffing themselves repeatedly into unconciousness while the enemy waltzes up and skewers them. Mages should know when they need to be casting attack spells rather than buffs. Lastly, the AI should be aware of fatigu state, and not try to cast spells that will knock itself out.

Assuming this is too difficult a problem to fix, then there are some simple patches that can be done to minimize the impact af the AI, and these have already been mentioned in this thread (and I am sure elsewhere):

1) extend the script... I am not talking about unlimited scripts, but just to 10, which ought to cover some of the longer battles in dom2.

2) "cast offensive" and "cast defensive" in addition to the "cast spells" option. This ought to do the trick for the most part, and would not rquire extending the script.

3) Change "cast spells" to alternate between offence and defence. Once the script runs out, the mage should alternate between attack spells and buffs instead of just picking one spell it likes and going crazy with it.

All these I think would be good solutions, and hopefully not too difficult to work in.

For sure the current situation of mages buffing themselves to unconsciousness and then getting slaughtered is not what the designers had in mind!

Originally posted by Demosthenes:
I'm not saying that I don't think expanding the spellcasting interface and level of user control is not a FANTASTIC idea. I'm just saying that as it stands, I find the current level of mage control consistent with the rest of the package.

I agree in principle; I'm all in favour of minimising micromanagement and quite happy to accept that playing at the Grand Strategic level means not having much control over tactics.

But your argument falls over if un-scripted mages are incapable of making rational spell-casting decisions. Note I say rational, not optimal. Reasonable but sub-optimal behaviour is fine, but completely stupid behaviour is just a cause for player frustration.

So if Illwinter seriously improved the spellcasting AI, that would be a fine solution. But that sounds like a lot of hard work, and a good result may not even be achievable. Or they can give players more control, so that there are less choices available to the spell-casting AI. Less work for the devs and less frustration for the players.

Mark

[Blitz]

I think a lot of this discussion could be eliminated with the inclusion of two new commands into the combat orders screen. Both would be under the "rest of the battle" window with the now confusing "cast spells".

1) Cast Only

Pretty simple. The Mage will only cast a single particular spell. If he has no valid targets, he waits for one. This might be Orb lightning or relief, whatever floats your boat. Probably most useful for nuking mages who often waste time summoning ghost wolves.

2) Cast Either

Simple concept again, right? Pick two spells. The mage will cast one or the other, depending on the situation. A Seithkona might take Nether Darts and Healing Light... death mages on drain life and raise skeletons. You get the idea.

It's a pretty simple concept, and it solves a lot of the headaches with the order system. Nothing will replace phase-by-phase control, but that's not really feasable in a pbem game really. I think this is a pretty quick fix and should probably be implemented at some point.

[Huzurdaddi]

2) Cast Only

Pretty simple. The Mage will only cast a single particular spell. If he has no valid targets, he waits for one. This might be Orb lightning or relief, whatever floats your boat. Probably most useful for nuking mages who often waste time summoning ghost wolves.

I would be more than happy with this one feature! It would be great.

Or how about just a "cycle" for the spell list, ie: once it is done, do it again from the start.

Both would be easy, would not be a big improvement for SC's and would help national casters out ( which is IMO a good thing ).

[Demosthenes]

Originally posted by Mark the Merciful:

But your argument falls over if un-scripted mages are incapable of making rational spell-casting decisions.

I was not making an argument but stating an opinion.

I am also of the opinion that most of time the spellcasting AI makes fairly reasonable decisions. Its just that the unreasonable ones are so silly that they stand out as a "vocal minority". I have also seen infantry, cavalry and archers make some ridiculous targetting decisions or routing in a won battle.

So I reiterate that the current level of mage control is scaled appropriately with the total level of tactical combat control in Dom2.

Could the AI be improved? Indubitably.
Would more control make combat more interesting? Perhaps.
Is the design of the Dom2 combat engine well proportioned and consistent? I think so.