.com.unity Forums
  The Official e-Store of Shrapnel Games

This Month's Specials

Air Assault Task Force- Save $8.00
Bronze- Save $10.00

   







Go Back   .com.unity Forums > Shrapnel Community > Space Empires: IV & V

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old September 10th, 2004, 05:56 PM

Yef Yef is offline
Corporal
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 155
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Yef is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Making Carriers and Fighters more usefull.

Well, what I did with the modified Version of Proportions that I'm using, was to give the fighters' engines a combat movement of 6, separated from their strategy movement, so if they would move 10 strategy, which would be 5 tactical, they would get 6 more movement points in combat for a total of 11.
It looks awesome in combat, with the defending fighters launching out of a planet to intercept an incoming fleet, but it have a little side effect: since the fighters only fire before movement or after movement, when the target is halfway their total movement points, the fighters tend to move back and forth between two combat squares until they use up all the movement points, and only then fire their weapons.
It's kind of annoying, but you can think of it as dogfighting.

I liked the idea of adding to their hull defense bonus, so I will add some more of it, so the regular ships' guns can't hit them at all, while adding to the fighters weapons hit bonus, so they can still be effective against other fighters.

I also twiked the Fighter Attack strategy, so that fighters would engage other fighters first, achieving air superiority, and only then attacking the enemy capital ships, and leaving planets for Last.

-I reduced the small rockets and small torpedo components to 3 kt, so that every fighter can carry 2 guns (damage between 2 and 4) and 1 missile/torpedo component (damage between 30 and 60).
- The life support component got eliminated, since I thought it was irrevelant for a short range fighter (I don't use fighters strategically because the AI doesn't) To make it sound better, I added to the description of the Fighter cockpit that it "contains advanced targetting systems and limited life support equipment".
- Addittional hit and defense bonus to the afterburners, since their combat movements doesn't add up to the engines combat movement.
- Fighter hull price lowered to 1 mineral per kt to allow for mass production.


I also twiked the carriers a bit:
- The fighter bay component to 20 kt, so you can carry 100 fighters in the Light Carrier, and still have room for 3 shield generators and 3 PDCs.
- Fighter bays can now carry the 4 fighters it can launch, without need for cargo components.
- The Light Carrier to 820 kts, to add 1 more crew and one more life support components, since I thought a wing of 100 fighters should use quite a number of tech and maintenance personal.

And that's about it.
I liked several of the ideas in this thread, so I will probably add some of them.

One problem I have though, its that I haven't quite managed to make the AI to mass-produce the fighters.
Last weeek I put in the build file to "build at least 100", but I don't know yet if it's working. The other entries says "Build per planet", I think, but I don't know how that works exactly (20 means 2 per planet?)
Help here please.
__________________
-----------------------------
-----------------------------
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old September 10th, 2004, 08:09 PM
Aiken's Avatar

Aiken Aiken is offline
Major
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Taganrog, Russia
Posts: 1,087
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Aiken is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Making Carriers and Fighters more usefull.

Quote:
Yef said:
Last weeek I put in the build file to "build at least 100", but I don't know yet if it's working. The other entries says "Build per planet", I think, but I don't know how that works exactly (20 means 2 per planet?)
Help here please.
If AI has 10 planets under control and Planet Per Item := 50 used in construction file then it will build 2 ship/unit. With 20 planets it will build 4 ship/unit. In short: ships_to_build = total_planets/(PPI/10).

Imo, Planet Per Item entry is not very comfortable for mass unit construction, because even with 100 planets and PPI := 1 AI can build 1000 units max, which is quite small amount for such a developed empire. Gradually increasing amounts in Must Have At Least entries is better for this purpose.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old September 11th, 2004, 12:03 AM

Patroklos Patroklos is offline
Corporal
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 68
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Patroklos is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Making Carriers and Fighters more usefull.

I am not really sure what you guys are talking about, I find fighters to be an unbalancing element in the game. Even in the latter stages they can more than deal with conventional vessels. The problem is you have to micromanage your economy to build, transport, and load fighters to your carriers as they are destroyed. Most players just don't excersise the control to keep it rolling.

Conventional ships are build and forget.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old September 11th, 2004, 12:25 AM
Fyron's Avatar

Fyron Fyron is offline
Shrapnel Fanatic
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Southern CA, USA
Posts: 18,394
Thanks: 0
Thanked 12 Times in 10 Posts
Fyron is an unknown quantity at this point
Default Re: Making Carriers and Fighters more usefull.

Add 4 PDC cannons to each larger warship. Fighters fall in droves...
__________________
It's not whether you win or lose that counts: it's how much pain you inflict along the way.
--- SpaceEmpires.net --- RSS --- SEnet ModWorks --- SEIV Modding 101 Tutorial
--- Join us in the #SpaceEmpires IRC channel on the Freenode IRC network.
--- Due to restrictively low sig limits, you must visit this link to view the rest of my signature.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old September 11th, 2004, 02:01 AM

Patroklos Patroklos is offline
Corporal
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 68
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Patroklos is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Making Carriers and Fighters more usefull.

Which of course the AI does almost universally, and I can still own them everytime. Sure I lose alot of fighters, but they don't take up maintenence, so there is really no upper limit to me swarming any size fleet.

And that isn't to say conventional warships are worthless, and I use them in conjuction. However, I can always win with fighters.

But you have to be willing to manage the constuction queues of a hundred planets, manage a transport fleet to get them to the battle fleet, and keep that system safe. I am anal enough to do so, most aren't.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old September 11th, 2004, 02:07 AM
Fyron's Avatar

Fyron Fyron is offline
Shrapnel Fanatic
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Southern CA, USA
Posts: 18,394
Thanks: 0
Thanked 12 Times in 10 Posts
Fyron is an unknown quantity at this point
Default Re: Making Carriers and Fighters more usefull.

I could beat the stock AIs with DUCs and Destroyers... the AI is not all that great. Try human opponents. http://www.pbw.cc
__________________
It's not whether you win or lose that counts: it's how much pain you inflict along the way.
--- SpaceEmpires.net --- RSS --- SEnet ModWorks --- SEIV Modding 101 Tutorial
--- Join us in the #SpaceEmpires IRC channel on the Freenode IRC network.
--- Due to restrictively low sig limits, you must visit this link to view the rest of my signature.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old September 11th, 2004, 11:03 AM

Patroklos Patroklos is offline
Corporal
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 68
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Patroklos is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Making Carriers and Fighters more usefull.

Now that is something that I definetly don't have the patience for...

The bane of all such games is the time MP consumes.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old September 14th, 2004, 12:36 AM
Grandpa Kim's Avatar

Grandpa Kim Grandpa Kim is offline
Captain
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Calgary, Canada
Posts: 858
Thanks: 2
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Grandpa Kim is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Making Carriers and Fighters more usefull.

Quote:
Imperator Fyron said:
Add 4 PDC cannons to each larger warship. Fighters fall in droves...
Patroclus was much to gentlemanly. I say "Balls!"

It's all a matter of how you use them and how many.
__________________
Those who can, do.
Those who can't, teach.
Those who can't teach, slag.

http://se4-gaming.net/
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old September 14th, 2004, 05:25 PM
Fyron's Avatar

Fyron Fyron is offline
Shrapnel Fanatic
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Southern CA, USA
Posts: 18,394
Thanks: 0
Thanked 12 Times in 10 Posts
Fyron is an unknown quantity at this point
Default Re: Making Carriers and Fighters more usefull.

Quote:
Grandpa Kim said:
It's all a matter of how you use them and how many.
Of course. The point was that they are not the most powerful thing in the game...
__________________
It's not whether you win or lose that counts: it's how much pain you inflict along the way.
--- SpaceEmpires.net --- RSS --- SEnet ModWorks --- SEIV Modding 101 Tutorial
--- Join us in the #SpaceEmpires IRC channel on the Freenode IRC network.
--- Due to restrictively low sig limits, you must visit this link to view the rest of my signature.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old September 13th, 2004, 10:44 AM

Yef Yef is offline
Corporal
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 155
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Yef is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Making Carriers and Fighters more usefull.

Quote:
aiken said:
If AI has 10 planets under control and Planet Per Item := 50 used in construction file then it will build 2 ship/unit. With 20 planets it will build 4 ship/unit. In short: ships_to_build = total_planets/(PPI/10).

Imo, Planet Per Item entry is not very comfortable for mass unit construction, because even with 100 planets and PPI := 1 AI can build 1000 units max, which is quite small amount for such a developed empire. Gradually increasing amounts in Must Have At Least entries is better for this purpose.
How that the "Must have at least" works?
Is it a total number for the empire or an amount per planet?
Example:
I want the AI to mass produce fighters, so I entered:
Planets per Item: 1
Must have at least: 100

Will the AI build 100 fighters per planet?
__________________
-----------------------------
-----------------------------
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:34 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©1999 - 2025, Shrapnel Games, Inc. - All Rights Reserved.