The Vine Ogre

[The_Tauren13]

Boron said:
Fiends of Darkness or Devils are much stronger then Vineogres and are about as cheap also .
Especially the soul contract generated Devil is extremely cheap and does require less magetime also then vine ogres .

Sure, but thats comparing them to the best unit in the game for its cost (a devil), but I cant say I know much about fiends.

Boron said:
So i wonder too where that consensus that vine ogres are overpowered comes from

From the simple fact that most people I play against get them, and I get them every game I play.

[BigDaddy]

I think more expensive vine ogres would negetively impact nature nations in the early game. A vine ogre isn't really worth 2 gems. Its probably not worth 1. It IS worth .2 gems though, but thats more like a lvl 7 spell, too.

[Alneyan]

Usually you do not get one Vine Ogre per casting, but two: the Ivy Crown replica gives you one more Vine Ogre per summoning, and you should have one of those items per Vine Ogre summoner if you are serious about it. Vine Ogres seem cheap enough at 0.5 gem the unit, if you have enough mages to summon quite a few of them.

Vine Ogres are especially appealing because Nature does not really shine for the unique summonings, unlike Air for the Air Queens, so you are more likely to spend your Nature gems early on rather than those air gems (if you are trying to snatch an Air Queen). That, and Corpse Constructs (the closest equivalent to Vine Ogres in spirit) require harder to get magic, while not really being on par with the Vine Ogres, and that's only if you find enough Air-1/Death-1 cheap mages... or even *one* source of cheap Air 1/Death 1 mages, Return of the Raptors excluded.

[BigDaddy]

Alneyan said:
Usually you do not get one Vine Ogre per casting, but two: the Ivy Crown replica gives you one more Vine Ogre per summoning, and you should have one of those items per Vine Ogre summoner if you are serious about it. Vine Ogres seem cheap enough at 0.5 gem the unit, if you have enough mages to summon quite a few of them.

I should have been more clear. IF they cost 2 gems per casting then they would still cost 1 gem for nature summoning during the early game.

So, maybe an Ivy King should cost 30 gems. I think they'd still be worth it.

[Saber Cherry]

Alneyan said:That, and Corpse Constructs (the closest equivalent to Vine Ogres in spirit) require harder to get magic, while not really being on par with the Vine Ogres, and that's only if you find enough Air-1/Death-1 cheap mages... or even *one* source of cheap Air 1/Death 1 mages, Return of the Raptors excluded.

Also, corpse constructs require undead leadership, are easily banished, and (essentially) require Earth magic for the lighting rods. They are so so so vastly inferior it is amazing. I'd rather summon (temporary) lesser air elementals with air gems than corpse constructs.

[BigDaddy]

Does anyone really think the VO's for 1 or .5 gems are too strong?

Maybe we should be negotiating the price of Ivy Kings instead of Vine Ogres.

[Boron]

The_Tauren13 said:
From the simple fact that most people I play against get them, and I get them every game I play.

Hm i almost always ignore them and invest my nature gems in fever fetishes or GoH instead .
In lategame also in lots of Ivy Kings or Haunted Forest .