Slick's list of UI SE:5 Improvements

Slick · #1 January 9th, 2007, 05:46 PM

se5a: If any planet, with no facilities, can build a satellite with the latest sensor tech and launch it and suddenly get the benefit of the sensor tech, it totally makes sense that they would already be using this tech from the planet surface. Why would you disagree strongly? It is just a burden on the player to keep building better sats and launching them to get the same effect.

Kana · #2 January 9th, 2007, 06:09 PM

I say if you want a planet to have a good sensor array, then it should build the appropriate facility to give you that sensor advantage...

President_Elect_Shang · #3 January 9th, 2007, 06:21 PM

Actually I think it can be done. What is the exact effect you want. Depending on what you are looking for this could be tied into a facility and hidden so the player never sees it. I recall we talked about this once before but what you had described has slipped my mind.

Suicide Junkie · #4 January 9th, 2007, 06:53 PM

Quote:

Planets should automatically always have the latest sensor range and level technology available to the empire.

I'm with SE5a on this one.

What we SHOULD have, is a ColonyAbilities.txt or something, which lets us list exactly what abilities we want a "naked" colony to have.
Build rates, repair abilities, even storage amount modifiers. The ability to build units should be optional... maybe you want to require a military base before troops can be trained there. Maybe you want the ability to build ships to appear for free on planets with over 100m people (SE3 style)
Sensors, stealth and even planetary shields...
%Population% should be available to use, as well as GetEmpireTechLevel.

Slick · #5 January 9th, 2007, 07:06 PM

Kana: that's my point, you don't need any facilities to do this, the empire already has the technology as proven by the ability to build satellites with the tech.

SJ: Why? I can see no logical reason a planet wouldn't use a technology from the surface. We know that the sensors penetrate atmospheres due to seeing other empires' colonies from space. We certainly wouldn't want to give this ability to only atmosphere=none.

To me, this is just an example of a cumbersome aspect of the game. It takes almost no construction time to build a satellite with the latest tech plus another turn to launch it so these are not issues. In SE:V, with the ability to reorganize construction queues, you won't lose construction if you immediately build one of these and put it at the top of the queue, so that's not the problem either. What it does cost the player is having to do this on each planet that he desires this capability. At least his front line planets, more likely more than that. Think of all those mouse clicks - not very fun.

Suicide Junkie · #6 January 9th, 2007, 07:14 PM

Why do you want exactly the ship tech sensors?
This really isn't a UI issue, but a game physics/mod thing.

In GGmod, I give homeworlds a 20-range Legacy Sensor Network facility.
Ships get range 2, colonies get range 3. Sensor components are 50kt for ships, and sensor facilities are a decent size. They are all expensive enough to not use everywhere and are worth defending.

I for one do not want them *Hardcoded* to be max tech for free.
An option, yes. Hardcode, hell no.

Slick · #7 January 9th, 2007, 07:34 PM

Why do you want exactly the ship tech sensors?

I've said it already, but I can see no reason a planet wouldn't use the technology it already has. I never said anything about being hard coded. There must be a way to give the ability to the planets in one of the data files, or there should be.

I agree that this is not really a UI issue, but it is cumbersome to do. I'm also not talking about your GGmod; mod rules are governed by the author. It is just that in a real game, people are going to do this at the cost of many mouseclicks each time sensor tech increases, and that just isn't fun. I think it should be an option at game startup.

Now if your reason for disagreeing is that you think it should cost more, then that's not a UI issue either and I would have no problem with this if Aaron decided to make sensors big and expensive so as to take multiple turns to construct, and costly to maintain. But as it stands, a sensor sat can be built in 1 turn on a small satellite with the latest range (basic) and level (tachyon), so it appears his intent was not to make them big or expensive. Again, balancing the cost of components is a separate issue, but with current costs, this is just cumbersome, so I lumped it in with other cumbersome UI issues.

I hope everyone feels free to express their own opinions to MM directly.

President_Elect_Shang · #8 January 9th, 2007, 10:24 PM

If I have you right you want a planet to have the same tech site level as the corresponding component? Assuming the abilities work in the Facilities.txt file it can be done. Not to the planet which wouldn't make sense but to the facilities on the planet. Give the facilities; all of them because the ability won't stack, the Sight Level and Sight Range ability. Isn't that what you want? Use the GETL to adjust the ability level up.

se5a · #9 January 10th, 2007, 02:14 AM

yup ok Slick, just be damned carefull when requesting stuff like this from aaron, he tends to do stuff just like that *snaps fingers* without thinking it all the way through on how it could affect mods.

like SJ said, a ColonyAbilities.txt would be the coolest way to do it.

as a gameplay thing, you shouldn't need to have sensor range from every planet, I prefer it the way it is, blockade a warp point, if something gets through then sweep the system till you find it.
and I mean seriosly, hubble was put in space for a reason, but I degress, this topic was about UI improvements.