Finalizing Neostandard

[Fyron]

We should probably try to reach a consensus on the Neostandard for SE5 before too much more time passes. Would this be an acceptable set to most?

This would add 6 unique hulls to the stock set. Keep in mind that the stock game already has a lot of "neostandard" type models called for, but not in general use. They add about 15 extra possible models shipset authors can already add to their sets and see used in the stock game. This means that shipset authors essentially have a possible 21 extra models to make above the basic list for stock se5.

Warships

+ Corvette/Scout (sub-frigate sized ship, name up in the air)
+ Juggernaut (between dreadnought and baseship)
+ Worldship (generally spheroid, for the death stars et all)

Baseship is already called for by stock, but not used. A note about this would be good.

Carriers

Light and Heavy already called for by stock, so I don't think we really need any more.

Civilian Ships

+ Resource Ship (not positive on this one's general utility, but many seem to like it)

Small/Large freighters already called for by stock.

Bases

+ Battle Station (base to go between space station and starbase, as in all previous SE versions)

Units

+ Infantry (non-mechanized troop unit)

Small/Medium/Large unit versions of all units are already called for as primary models/layouts, though generally not used in stock shipsets, so we don't need to include those as part of the neostandard. A note about them would suffice.

[Atrocities]

Looks very good to me. Not that my opinion matters at all. But still looks good.

[narf poit chez BOOM]

Call the corvette/scout an escort. No need for a new name.

[Wade]

My semi-lurking opinion is to call the Corvette a Corvette.

I like this very organized, elegant yet simple Neostandard. It does not stray too far from stock.

[Randallw]

I like my collection of Starfire books so much I read them all every few months. I just finished the bug war pair and there were a few classes I am interested in seeing. From what I can figure the classes are as follows

Heavy Cruisers.

Super-Dreadnoughts. Bigger than a battleship but smaller than,

Monitor. These end up the biggest ships there are but I don't think they would be worldships.

other ships, such as escort carriers, are just another name for what I feel already exist.

of course this all may be irrelevant. I now remember mention that 100 Kt ships were huge, which is smaller than a SE frigate.

[AstralWanderer]

Imperator Fyron said:
+ Worldship (generally spheroid, for the death stars et all)

This would be a nice addition, particularly if its maximum size was limited only by the resources of the owning empire. Would it be possible to allow such a class access to some of the planetary facilities (e.g. Base Space Yards, Solar Generators, Planetary Gravitational Shields) or have new ship components replicating such features limited to this class only?

Imperator Fyron said:
Light and Heavy already called for by stock, so I don't think we really need any more.

Adding a carrier large enough to include multiple space yards (so it can build its own fighters) might be useful. Heavy Carriers don't seem to have enough space to allow for this without severe compromises elsewhere (unless their maximum TL is greatly increased). This role could be handled by an expanded Baseship though.

Imperator Fyron said:
Small/Large freighters already called for by stock.

Again, a larger freighter capable of building its own drones, mines, troops may be worthwhile.

Imperator Fyron said:
+ Battle Station (base to go between space station and starbase, as in all previous SE versions)

There is a bit of a gap between the SS and SB but this could be closed up by increasing the maximum tonnage per TL and max TL. This would allow for the Battle Station to be a supersized SB instead. The reason for this is to allow for larger bases to compensate for their lack of mobility (both a tactical and strategic weakness) and to provide something to fill the gap between the SB and the Worldship above.

There is a certain "large ship fetish" in my suggestions above, but it seems strange that a game allowing the construction of Ringworlds (Larry Niven's weighing in at 2.1 x 10^27 kg) and Dyson Spheres has such comparatively low limits on ship tonnage.

[Tim_Ward]

If I had my way, destroyer, battleship, corvette et al would be design types and hull sizes would be called something else.

But for what it's worth, I endorse corvette over escort.

[Santiago]

Corvette ftw

[Fyron]

AstralWanderer:
This is all about relative scale, not about stock hull sizes. Nothing stops a mod from making heavy carriers bigger so they can mount multiple space yards (or adding a "small" SY designed for such unit building roles). We don't necessarily need to force modders to make a (probably non-distinctive) 4th carrier size for that.

The problem with adding "massive" versions of a basic hull type is that with SE4 shipsets, it almost always ended up as just a larger picture of the same thing, maybe with very minor detail modifications. When there are already 3 model types for it, a 4th doesn't necessarily add much variety, but it adds more work for modelers. Worldships are distinctive. Scout/corvette adds a possibility for a small, less combat-oriented military hull design. Juggernaut is certainly less distinctive than the other proposals, but many people seemed to want a large warship hull possibility. Unlike a "massive carrier," it probably has more possibility for uniqueness.

IMO, the name "battlestation" has to go between space station and starbase for purposes of continuity (all previous SE games had them in that order). Again, its just a matter of scale. Make your mod have the battlestations at the stock starbase size, and have starbases be even bigger. Nothing forces a modder to use stock hull sizes for anything; he just needs to maintain the relative size ordering for sensible play.

[AdmiralMartin]

Uh, Battlecruiser?