armor vs defense stat for SC

Taqwus · #1 July 13th, 2007, 02:57 PM

Mandragoras, say. Fear the sleep vines.

Lazy_Perfectionist · #2 July 13th, 2007, 03:06 PM

Actually, skelly spam is all you need. If you're facing a very early supercombatant with no area attack, just keep them fighting until they run away, or fall unconscious. If you've got single d necros, you can just animate one at a time with several, or spend 5 on the world map. Just be prepared to counter any supporting priests.

Rytek · #3 July 13th, 2007, 03:27 PM

I dunno, it all goes back to that label thing. To me, an SC can by definiton deal with skelly spam.

Lazy_Perfectionist · #4 July 13th, 2007, 04:14 PM

Not if they're the father of frost- then you need to wait until you've climbed the spell tree. I was talking about my experiences with an awake Father of Frost.

Early on, an unequipped Father of Frost (with the right spells), is a super that can take on armies of anything but the undead, with their cold immunity and zero encumberance.

Later, skelly spam counters exist, but I'm talking early game supers. What supers can take out an army of, say, 100 undead within the first year?

I do make it a priority to get reinvig asap, and then fatigue is unworrying, and there's other upgrades I may do.

Tuidjy · #5 July 13th, 2007, 05:33 PM

Hmm. Most of my pretenders can take out a 100 strong undead army by turn 12.
Firebrands do wonders. In the one MP game I am at turn 12ish, my pretender has
a firebrand/charcoal shield, reinvigoration 8, regeneration, and casts Air shield,
Quicken self, Stoneskin, Mirror image and Mistform. There is not much that
can faze him except for casters. (Magic resistance is below 21 only because he
tends to fight outside of his domain... of course)

By turn 20ish, he will be invulnerable to ANY amount of ANY troops. Of course, by
then he will be sitting in a lab, because nothing can save a SC from a custom
tailored death squad.

MaxWilson · #6 July 13th, 2007, 05:48 PM

An E9N9 Hierophant Centaur has zero encumbrance after reinvig is accounted for. I expect he'd be able to take out 100 undead with some minor equipment.

-Max

Lazy_Perfectionist · #7 July 14th, 2007, 12:52 AM

Who's Umor?

Anyways, LA Atlantis doesn't have any access to firemagic, or firebrands. Though access to Frost Brand is guaranteed and shadow brands common enough.

I do get easy access in my build or any nature shaman to +2 reinvig, which is enough to equalize encumbrance.

I ruled out the Frost Brand because of cold resistance on undead, and I just sort of figured that the Shadow Brand wouldn't be any good against undead. But looking at "Leeching Darkness", I see no reason it wouldn't do a number on Undead. Does shadow brand do a number on undead?

How is dual weapons or multiple attack weapons like Wave Breaker factor into the fatigue equation. I know that quickness seems to double fatigue rate, practically speaking, but do the two things I mentioned cost you fatigue once, or twice? And does reinvig take place at the end of the entire combat round, every action, or whatever?

Thanks. Now, about minor equipment, MaxWilson, are you talking construction 2 or less? I don't see how you could take out 100 at one a round before you had to auto-retreat/die, unless I'm overlooking some way to increase your kill rate.

Rytek · #8 July 14th, 2007, 01:02 AM

My Abysian Prince of darkness with nature 2, earth 4, death 4, blood 3, equipped with 2 firebrands, fireplate, dragon helm, lucky amulet and firestone will take out 100 undead. especially next turn when he gets personal regen. although i wish i had went nature 4, earth 2 instead. so that way i could forge shrouds to keep my old mages alive thru regen.

Rytek · #9 July 15th, 2007, 03:02 PM

Looks like My SC has to worry about horror markings, not troops. Anyone have any experience on how many horror markings it takes to start getting the nasty ones? My SC just got horror marked 3 or 4 times last battle. Do horrors inflict more horror marks with astral claws even if they miss? Looks like I need to pump up magic resistance as well just in case I go against one with blood vengence. sigh. My poor pretender!

Taqwus · #10 July 16th, 2007, 03:58 PM

I believe somebody once set up a test case involving an SC running into astral mages spamming horror mark, and it took quite a while for the Eater of Gods to show up. Assuming that nobody's accelerating the process by sending/calling Horrors, and you're not using an item which does.

As for Astral Claw, IIRC it requires a hit to horror mark. But yes, MR is good -- and vital if Umor shows up with the 'save-or-die' attacks, or Kurgi with Blood Vengeance +7.