communion (?)

[Amhazair]

Slaves casting spells happened to me too, in the first game I actually used communions. At the time it didn't strike me as weird, and when I learned more about communions I assumed it had to do with the turn order, as Baalz describes it here, though I'm not quite sure that that was the cause. (I am certain they were actually slaves though)

[Frostmourne27]

I don't usually use communions - I think they're usually more trouble then they're worth - but the few times I have, I'm pretty sure that I've seen slaves acting on their own. In Dom2 at least, I _know_ it happened - I had a bunch of quickened slaves charge the enemy. As far as slaves getting fatigue, they get a proportion equal to 1/# of members of communion, but of the totaly they woud've got if they cast the spell themselves. E.g. Earth wind is cat by an E10 cyclops with a matrix and two slaves with earth 3. the slaves get 1/3 of the base fatigue for bw (40 IIRC) And the cyclops gets 1/3 of the hugely reduced amount an E10 mage gets when casting Blade wind. If the communicants have no/not enough magic (to cast the spell) I assume the progression is reversed. Would make Master Enslave a scary prospect for the communicant, if its possible to get more than 200 fatigue from a communion masters spell. Fatigue from spell mages cast is capped at 200. Is that true for other members of a communion casting spells too? IDK, but I sort of think its also capped.

As to being a slave AND a master, astral mages with bad/unusual research and no scripts sometimes cast both, which might indicate it working, but they also sometimes use communions in the arena, so they might just be being stupid.

[Kristoffer O]

Seems strange. If slaves cast any spell whatsoever after having become slaves it is a bug.

The point is that they lend their power to their master and let him use them as magical batteries.

[Frostmourne27]

Kristoffer O said:
Seems strange. If slaves cast any spell whatsoever after having become slaves it is a bug.

The point is that they lend their power to their master and let him use them as magical batteries.

thanks for clarifying how it's supposed to work. Any such clarification forthcoming on the master and slave issue? That is, can a mage be both at once?

[thejeff]

I think there is known weirdness with quickened communion slaves. Could that be where this impression comes from?

And I've definitely seen indy blood mages without slaves cast both Sabbath Master and Slave. Don't know what the results were since they didn't have any other spells to cast.

[Kristoffer O]

I'm not sure, but I suspect he is (or should be) rendered useless when he becomes a slave, as slaves are not supposed to cast anything.

[lch]

No, slaves can act on their own. The only thing is that if any one communion (sabbath etc.) master casts a spell in a combat turn, then they have to perform the "cast spell" action aswell, lending their support to the communion master, and can't act themself. But if all communion masters are somehow occupied, engaging in melee combat or already left the battlefield for example, then the slaves act as normal mages in a battle.

Take care that, as has been noted before, the actual fatigue that a unit gets is determined by the magic paths and levels he has as if he'd cast the spell himself (and then divide by number of slaves+master), while the communion master takes considerably less fatigue because he might be magically more powerful than the slaves. This is extra bad if the slaves don't have the actual levels required to cast the spell.

[Baalz]

Well, perhaps it's a bug, but it's easy to reproduce. The way I first noticed it I was playing EA Ermor and my slaves happened to come in order before the master. One master (Augur Elder) and four slaves (Augurs), so it was pretty noticeable when (after the master cast phoenix power) 5 fireballs were being launched each turn. After I noticed it it's pretty easy to make happen on purpose, and it definitely is caused by the slaves coming in order before the master (the ones that come after any master casts something don't do anything). I'm guessing perhaps the logic is supposed to be that the slaves are free to act if the master doesn't cast anything that turn?

Note, I haven't actually confirmed it with any other types of mages, I assumed it works the same.

[Frostmourne27]

That's cetainly interesting... What exactly determines the order of units in battle? Is it random? Based on unit numbers?

[Saulot]

Army placement grid determines order of units. Top to bottom.