Vengeance of the dead, what the hell

Gandalf Parker · #1 August 7th, 2007, 01:27 PM

Purely on an RPG thematic argument (translation: getting Kristoffer to bug Johan about this)...
it seems to me that if someone is attacked, and outlasts the combat, that should be considered to be a win. If you want a thematic result to the fact that the combat ran into overtime with attackers still on the field, then toss them into a general combat as if they were attacking the province.

lch · #2 August 7th, 2007, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Gandalf Parker said:
it seems to me that if someone is attacked, and outlasts the combat, that should be considered to be a win.

A draw you mean, I hope. Suggesting that both, assassin and victim, survive the combat. Regardless who would "likely" win.

Gandalf Parker · #3 August 7th, 2007, 03:45 PM

Quote:

lch said:

Quote:

Gandalf Parker said:
it seems to me that if someone is attacked, and outlasts the combat, that should be considered to be a win.

A draw you mean, I hope. Suggesting that both, assassin and victim, survive the combat. Regardless who would "likely" win.

A draw would be better. But the game might not support a draw. In some cases that would mean that the attackers would still be in the province (altho not with the vengeance of the undead thing in their dreams I guess). But in cases like that, I would feel that I have "won" the test or conflict if it ends without my death.

K · #4 August 7th, 2007, 04:21 PM

I think its very important that SCs can be killed this way. If they couldn't, then the best and only tactic in the game would be to eventually create SCs. Right now you often can't kill an SC even when you have brought your anti-SC tactics into the battle, since even reasonable protections can be brought by the SC player (like a few Fire or Astral or Death or Water mages for the W9F9 Shadow Vestal assault mentioned above).

sum1lost · #5 August 7th, 2007, 04:25 PM

Quote:

K said:
I think its very important that SCs can be killed this way. If they couldn't, then the best and only tactic in the game would be to eventually create SCs. Right now you often can't kill an SC even when you have brought your anti-SC tactics into the battle, since even reasonable protections can be brought by the SC player (like a few Fire or Astral or Death or Water mages for the W9F9 Shadow Vestal assault mentioned above).

As it is, SC's are extremely powerful. This keeps them from winning the game on their own, thankfully.

Tuidjy · #6 August 7th, 2007, 04:33 PM

I don't like draws. If an army attacks and cannot conquer, it should flee the
province. If an assassin cannot kill the target in a set time, he should be,
at the very least, made to attack the province during the battle phase. The
army camp was alerted, everyone encircled the commander's tent, let the assassin
try to take them all on. If he wins or manages to flee, more power to him.

Of course, in the nightmare case, i.e. special monsters, the attackers should
just go 'poof'.

thejeff · #7 August 7th, 2007, 05:02 PM

So the arguments are that first, Vengeance isn't really a big deal since it's easily avoidable with mr and a proper SC can kill them all anyway.
And second, that it's an essential counter without which SCs would be unstoppable?

(Ok, it's different people making the arguments, but it was strange to read.)

Tuidjy · #8 August 7th, 2007, 05:16 PM

It is always a big deal when any unit dies due to a bug. A defender dying because
of the time limit is a bug, or at least goes against precendent and common sense.

Once again, I believe that the number of vengeful souls should remain uncapped, and
that the spell should remain relatively low level. But I also think that the
target should survive the experience if he wakes up before shades get him.

lch · #9 August 7th, 2007, 05:23 PM

Quote:

thejeff said:
So the arguments are that first, Vengeance isn't really a big deal since it's easily avoidable with mr and a proper SC can kill them all anyway. And second, that it's an essential counter without which SCs would be unstoppable?

What it boils down to is that OPs thug was not as awesome and unstoppable as he had hoped it to be and it was brought down by a cunning move of his enemy. Being catched off guard by this surprise element of the game he felt wronged.

Aethyr · #10 August 8th, 2007, 08:10 AM

Quote:

Gandalf Parker said:
Purely on an RPG thematic argument (translation: getting Kristoffer to bug Johan about this)...
it seems to me that if someone is attacked, and outlasts the combat, that should be considered to be a win. If you want a thematic result to the fact that the combat ran into overtime with attackers still on the field, then toss them into a general combat as if they were attacking the province.