The Bogarus Problem

[DrPraetorious]

Mictlan is definitely the *best* of the LA bless rushers, but Midgard, Gath, Patala and T'ien Ch'i all have sacreds good enough to sustain a double-bless rush that will eat Bogarus alive, and they'd be fools not to use it if they're your neighbor. You might also espect a rush out of Ermor, Man or Utgard, since you-have-to-die.

Bogarus can have the Wyrm, Cyclops, Manticore, or any flavor of Dragon. An awake pretender from this list is fearsome in early expansion even without equipment - and, even without equipment, might tip the balance against Man, Utgard, Midgard or Patala. But against Mictlan, T'ien Ch'i, Ermor or Gath, barely a speed bump.

An *equipped* Cyclops is a horse of an entirely different color, also with spikes and machine guns, but that's not possible by turn 6.

[Chris_Byler]

DrPraetorious said:
Mictlan is definitely the *best* of the LA bless rushers, but Midgard, Gath, Patala and T'ien Ch'i all have sacreds good enough to sustain a double-bless rush that will eat Bogarus alive, and they'd be fools not to use it if they're your neighbor. You might also espect a rush out of Ermor, Man or Utgard, since you-have-to-die.

They won't know they're your neighbor until *after* they create their god. Committing your nation to a blessrush on the off chance you *might* be next to Bogarus seems like a weak move - unless you expect those nations to blessrush regardless of who their neighbors are? Even then, it's just the crapshoot of landing next to a rusher.

Taking an awake god as rush insurance is only sensible if (a) it will work and actually stop rushes, and (b) won't cost you so much that you'll lose even if you survive the opening. Based on this thread it looks like awake gods for Bogarus are questionable on *both* counts.

Of course map size, indy strength and other settings matter too.

[Renojustin]

Bogarus's military is at such a disadvantage that there's no question that 90% of the nations in the game can successfully overwhelm you early, even if they are not a 'rush' nation.

Your scales don't do you a whole lot of good when you're beat back into your capital by turn 10.

When the choice is between super scales and no counter to this, thereby commiting yourself to a short, violent death, or mediocre scales and an effective counter, if through anti-army or anti-indy capability - and there certainly ARE pretenders that are more than capable of either one - I know which one I would pick. And I would be right.

[sector24]

This thread has been very interesting so far. I'm surprised by the diversity of playstyles, and I had not considered recruiting the smiters for the first few turns to supplement the weak power of your starting army. Might be nice for frying some knights early on, but it does prevent you from getting to an early research goal like Thunderstrike spam or Construction 2.

Just out of curiosity, does anyone have a good Bogarus build that does not use an awake SC god? I'd like to try out these new ideas but I'm still skeptical that Bogarus can hold off a determined attacker without one.