Which Nations Are Best for Turtling?

[Calahan]

Originally Posted by Foodstamp

I disagree with this a little. I think the population killing goes a long way to helping turtle. The argument can be made that bags of wine and cauldrons of broth take care of that but not every nation gets access to those out of the box, and often not right away. Also, it is very easy for LA Ermor to get into the water, taking advantage of the suggested water turtling.

I guess a lot depends on how you define turtling. To me, a turtling nation isn't just one that nobody fancies attacking, and hence are more likely to be left alone to turtle. Such as EA Abysia, MA C'tis, LA Ermor. The act of turtling, or a turtling nation, is one that can get stronger if left along quietly to research/fort/forge/summon etc. At least that's my definition of turtling.

To me you should only really turtle if it is of benefit to your nation, and you shouldn't turtle just because you want to turtle. The game can change too rapidly for that, and anyone caught sticking rigidly to one plan or idea very often misses out on good opportunities. Quite often though turtling is a very valid and entirely correct option, especially if you are waiting for a lucrative opening or if two neighbours are engaged in a mutually destructive war, allowing you to go in and clean them both up once you've turtled enough.

I never said LA Ermor couldn't turtle, but I just don't see any way LA Ermor gets stronger by sitting at home doing nothing but researching at a terrible rate, watching their income disappearing to zero, and leaving their undead hordes waiting around for battle. IMO if LA Ermor turtles, then they get weaker compared to all other nations in the game. So while you can turtle with LA Ermor, it just seems a totally illogical thing to do for me.

But good luck to any LA Ermor turtles who might be out there

[InfStorm]

I find I have a lot of success turtling with MA Ulm. Their PD had good armor and once it's 25+ has enough to blunt most attacks on it's own. Combine that with a strong Drain domain to blunt magic attacks and with your Black Plate offensive forces, the can be quite difficult to pierce.

[Illuminated One]

Originally Posted by vfb

LA R'lyeh, MA C'tis spring to mind.

Edit: Hey, Japan has ninjas! Not Finland.

Why should LA R'lyeh be the best turtling nation?
Arguably you are the nation with the best defense in LA, but every turn you don't expand, you get poorer. Yes, you can research but sooner or later other nation will outdo just by having more gold.

[vfb]

Originally Posted by Illuminated One

Why should LA R'lyeh be the best turtling nation?
Arguably you are the nation with the best defense in LA, but every turn you don't expand, you get poorer. Yes, you can research but sooner or later other nation will outdo just by having more gold.

You can take turmoil/luck scales to get cash to buy mages. You get freespawn and you've got the void gate.

Anyone who invades provinces with your dominion goes insane (some special UW units of Jomon are resistant, I'm not sure about UW LA Mictlan units.)

You are UW in a world without other true UW nations.

You have awesome defense with enslavement BF spells and Illithids to paralyze SCs. You have reason to turtle while researching up to Master Enslave.

[Amorphous]

Originally Posted by vfb

Anyone who invades provinces with your dominion goes insane (some special UW units of Jomon are resistant, I'm not sure about UW LA Mictlan units.)

You are UW in a world without other true UW nations.

You have awesome defense with enslavement BF spells and Illithids to paralyze SCs. You have reason to turtle while researching up to Master Enslave.

Dear Cthulhu of R'lyeh

Atlantis just want to inform You that we share Your analysis completely. In the late age of Dominions You are absolutely the only under-water power. For ourselves we have almost no amphibian units at all and absolutely no interest in returning under the waves. We bear You no ill will for kicking us out of the water - let bygones be bygones we say. Even if we did, we have no possibility to enter the seas and nothing to do once there. It is not like we can build under-water castles and recruit insanity-resistant troops or mages with diversifying magic paths. Your capital in particular is of no interest to us. We would not know what to do with an astral income if it fell on our heads from a star.

Atlantis also wishes to take the opportunity to deny any knowledge of the mysterious incident with the exploding dreamers and slaughtered illithids in the Sea of Strife. Rumours about an army of Arssartuts with halberds are just that - insidious rumours. It is obviously a fabrication by evil nations that cannot abide Atlantis' peaceful disposition. Our Arssartuts are just an elite company of gardeners - you need to be elite to garden in our permafrost - using peaceful tools such as rakes and shovels. No self-respecting Arssartut would ever even touch a halberd.

We are confident that Your turtling is going to be very fruitful and gain You victory and ascendacy.

On a rather unrelated note, Atlantis would beg of you the favour to report the marvels of turtling to Ermor. For some strange reason they will not speak with us any more. There is, again, an ugly rumour going around about tireless Arssartuts destroying an undead army in the Mountains of Unrequited Love. As above this is obviously a fabrication. Arssartuts are gardeners and never touch halberds. Especially not halberds that make SCs and thugs weaker than kittens.
Atlantis is a peaceful nation and even if we were not, we have almost no priests, death or water mages, so we cannot do anything against undead and have no use for the death gem income from the Ermor capital. We propose that Ermor look at Arcoscephale instead. Our intelligence support the theory that the offending halberd-wielding army were just some of that prankster Daidalos' contraptions in costume.

Atlantis as a nation would be most thankful if You could take it in Your heart to explain and stress our complete innocence to Ermor.

Yours sincerely and thankfully
Dagon

[Foodstamp]

Originally Posted by Calahan

I guess a lot depends on how you define turtling. To me, a turtling nation isn't just one that nobody fancies attacking, and hence are more likely to be left alone to turtle. Such as EA Abysia, MA C'tis, LA Ermor. The act of turtling, or a turtling nation, is one that can get stronger if left along quietly to research/fort/forge/summon etc. At least that's my definition of turtling.

To me you should only really turtle if it is of benefit to your nation, and you shouldn't turtle just because you want to turtle. The game can change too rapidly for that, and anyone caught sticking rigidly to one plan or idea very often misses out on good opportunities. Quite often though turtling is a very valid and entirely correct option, especially if you are waiting for a lucrative opening or if two neighbours are engaged in a mutually destructive war, allowing you to go in and clean them both up once you've turtled enough.

I never said LA Ermor couldn't turtle, but I just don't see any way LA Ermor gets stronger by sitting at home doing nothing but researching at a terrible rate, watching their income disappearing to zero, and leaving their undead hordes waiting around for battle. IMO if LA Ermor turtles, then they get weaker compared to all other nations in the game. So while you can turtle with LA Ermor, it just seems a totally illogical thing to do for me.

But good luck to any LA Ermor turtles who might be out there

By AlgaeNymph's definition, I think Ermor would do well.