Number or "guns" on air units

[Bernard]

Apologies if this doesn't quite fit with TOE forum but I have a technical question.....

Does setting unguided rocket up on a COIN fighter-bomber on mobhack with 5 round and 2 "guns" (ie set ap ammo loadout to 5 for HE and 2 for AP) give double the firepower of if you just set 10 HE round as normal?
Sorry if this question sounds a bit cryptic, it's just that I like my COIN aircraft to be able to spread their iron bombs out over multiple passes, so putting all the FFARs into one weapon slot makes this easier...
It's just that I dont want to reduce the number of rockets fired with each pass(ie two slots of rockets x5 gets put down as one slot of rockets x10)

Will putting a 2 in the AP loadout slot solve my problem?

[Mobhack]

Bernard said:
Apologies if this doesn't quite fit with TOE forum but I have a technical question.....

Does setting unguided rocket up on a COIN fighter-bomber on mobhack with 5 round and 2 "guns" (ie set ap ammo loadout to 5 for HE and 2 for AP) give double the firepower of if you just set 10 HE round as normal?
Sorry if this question sounds a bit cryptic, it's just that I like my COIN aircraft to be able to spread their iron bombs out over multiple passes, so putting all the FFARs into one weapon slot makes this easier...
It's just that I dont want to reduce the number of rockets fired with each pass(ie two slots of rockets x5 gets put down as one slot of rockets x10)

Will putting a 2 in the AP loadout slot solve my problem?

Rockets are not "cannon or MG" type class 11 weapons, so they don't get the cannon multiplier.


Cheers
Andy

[Bernard]

Thanks for clarifying that. I have found a solution by creating an "8x2.75in FFAR" weapon to go in slot 2 using the multiple weapon HEK multipliers in MOBHack help.

Do class 11 weapon behave differently then according to their warhead size, as both FFAR and aircraft cannon are class 11 weapons?

[Mobhack]

Bernard said:
Thanks for clarifying that. I have found a solution by creating an "8x2.75in FFAR" weapon to go in slot 2 using the multiple weapon HEK multipliers in MOBHack help.

Do class 11 weapon behave differently then according to their warhead size, as both FFAR and aircraft cannon are class 11 weapons?

Yes - WH size affects many things in the game anyway. Sizes 1 and 2 are MG/rifles for other weapon classes as well.

Cheers
Andy

[Bernard]

Ok.... more abstract questions on air weapons...

If I want to model Korean War era AN-M1A4 cluster bomb
(effectivelly 6 small bomblets approx equivalent of 60mm mortar bombs)and need to work out HE kill of the weapon (using class 14 for aircraft cluster weapons)using 60mm mortar round (warhead 4, HE kill 7) as a base. Is it accurate to use the 2x and 3x HEK multiple weapon conversion factors in the mobhack help file cumulativelly(eg 6xHE kill of 7=7x1.5x1.75)? It's just that i've noticed that as you increase the number or weapons in a slot, the proportion by which the HE kill increase becomes less with each extra weapon. By doing a bit of maths I've calculated that the coversion factor for a 6xweapon in slot is HEKx1.96875. Is this more accurate than using the 2x and 3x factors together to model this weapon?
Thanks

[Mobhack]

Bernard said:
Ok.... more abstract questions on air weapons...

If I want to model Korean War era AN-M1A4 cluster bomb
(effectivelly 6 small bomblets approx equivalent of 60mm mortar bombs)and need to work out HE kill of the weapon (using class 14 for aircraft cluster weapons)using 60mm mortar round (warhead 4, HE kill 7) as a base. Is it accurate to use the 2x and 3x HEK multiple weapon conversion factors in the mobhack help file cumulativelly(eg 6xHE kill of 7=7x1.5x1.75)? It's just that i've noticed that as you increase the number or weapons in a slot, the proportion by which the HE kill increase becomes less with each extra weapon. By doing a bit of maths I've calculated that the coversion factor for a 6xweapon in slot is HEKx1.96875. Is this more accurate than using the 2x and 3x factors together to model this weapon?
Thanks

It's your OOB - so start with whatever basis you think is right, then experiment till you appear to have the desired results, and check with other similar weapons, and also see what the points calculator thinks.

Cheers
Andy

[Bernard]

Cheers for the previous advice. Here's my next dumb technical question...

I have been trying to create Incendiary FFARs, using 2x2.75cm FFAR from USMC OOB as a basis. If I use Napalm or infantry flame as a unit class, with Warhead size 3, they are devastating when HE kill is set to zero.

Is this a game bug, because with these unit classes they have always got <50% hit chance when fired from a helo with Fire control 4, even at 10 hexes range? They can sometimes kill a 12 man mortar squad with one shot.

I have checked out MOBHack help but cannot find any clue to the why this is.

Thanks as always for answering these dumb questions.

[Mobhack]

I seem to recall some original SSI code buried somewhere in there which adds some HE kill etc to boost flamethrowers, with a comment about saving them having to re-do the OOB data. (presumably FT were considered too wussy in SP1 or more ! ). There is also a similar bit which boosts accuracy for napalm (which may explain the accuracy of the long range flame weapons folk have made up - FT were meant originally to be range 0 napalm bombs or 2 hex VFT max).

So FT have a minimum built-in HEK even with you editing 0 in there, it appears

No flame weapon would have an HEK of 0, anyway, that I can think of.

I will have a look and see if flame weapons are getting the accuracy booster at > 2 hexes (and that would tone down some FAE weapons, like the 202 flash, which in real life was a rarely issued oddity

Done - simple if block based on range in 2 blocks - napalm special boosters only if range <1 (air dropped bombs basically), and vehicle/infantry FT boosters only if range <2, so the longer ranged flame/FAE rockets will have normal accuracy at longer ranges.

It still does not explain why your weapon gets an HEK when set to 0 - there is probably more code in there to boost flame weapon HEK to some minumum. But I'll leave that as flame weapons are meant to be these larger items that folk on the recieving end are rather unhappy about !

Cheers
Andy

[Alpha]

what about those russian flame rockets ( rpo or so ) ?

they seem to be very dangerous and give formations that
have these a huge advantage. are they really that deadly ?

i wonder how any normal infantry could fight against such
weapons..

[Bernard]

It's all a matter of class IMHO.... if we use weapons classes that are used to simulate the effectiveness of short range weapons such as flamethrowers which in reality can cook the inhabitants of a bunker then we can't really complain when using them for ranged weapons creates super weapons.

Maybe using a high HEK secondary infantry or team class weapon would be more realistic, as the high HEK would set fire to the hex. Only the blast graphics would be wrong...