.com.unity Forums
  The Official e-Store of Shrapnel Games

This Month's Specials

Air Command 3.0- Save $15.00
BCT Commander- Save $8.00

   







Go Back   .com.unity Forums > Illwinter Game Design > Dominions 3: The Awakening

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old August 31st, 2012, 10:24 PM

krpeters krpeters is offline
Second Lieutenant
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 564
Thanks: 1
Thanked 10 Times in 7 Posts
krpeters is on a distinguished road
Default Patrolling and Unrest

Well this is interesting.

I invite you all to try this yourselves. Ramp up taxes, then put a patroller with a medium army (say, 30 troops) to catch the rebels. But one twist: give the army orders "guard commander" and watch what happens.

Mine become instantly pathetic. I think there's some sort of combat mechanic involved, which is why flyers and troops with rapid movement are more effective. I wouldn't be surprised if there's a hidden battle happening somewhere.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old September 1st, 2012, 06:57 AM

parone parone is offline
First Lieutenant
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: southern maine
Posts: 734
Thanks: 61
Thanked 12 Times in 8 Posts
parone is an unknown quantity at this point
Default Re: Patrolling and Unrest

pathetic how?
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old September 1st, 2012, 09:34 AM

John_Madlock John_Madlock is offline
Corporal
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 53
Thanks: 16
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
John_Madlock is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Patrolling and Unrest

I think you are wrong. I set guard commander order, even retreat, and I see no difference.
I even created 2 players game and I set for both 200% tax and patroling commands. I didn't see any battles resolving between turns.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old September 1st, 2012, 11:45 AM

krpeters krpeters is offline
Second Lieutenant
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 564
Thanks: 1
Thanked 10 Times in 7 Posts
krpeters is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Patrolling and Unrest

after further experimentation, I may be totally wrong. Just an odd coincidence possibly.

I'm just trying to figure out why sometimes 30 harpies are enough to slaughter 30 rebels and other times they can't kill 5.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old September 1st, 2012, 12:02 PM

momfreeek momfreeek is offline
Corporal
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 178
Thanks: 1
Thanked 47 Times in 8 Posts
momfreeek is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Patrolling and Unrest

I think its covered here:
http://dom3.servegame.com/wiki/User:...fect_unrest.3F

"Basically, every patroller will catch 0,5 brigand, but the graph is linear (with 30 patrollers you have the same chance to catch, say, 0, 10, 20 or 30 brigands). So, its much more random than if each patroller has 50% chance to succeed."

It also has the calculation to compare patrollers:

"Faster units are better patrollers: an unit with a tactical (battlefield) move of 20 (cavalry) count as 1,3 foot patroller. Flyers count as 2 patrollers. Some units, like the Forester (Man) have a bonus. Mindless units have a penalty."

Last edited by momfreeek; September 1st, 2012 at 12:20 PM..
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to momfreeek For This Useful Post:
  #6  
Old September 6th, 2012, 04:12 PM

JonBrave JonBrave is offline
Second Lieutenant
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 546
Thanks: 100
Thanked 10 Times in 8 Posts
JonBrave is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Patrolling and Unrest

Quote:
Originally Posted by momfreeek View Post
I think its covered here:
http://dom3.servegame.com/wiki/User:...fect_unrest.3F

"Basically, every patroller will catch 0,5 brigand, but the graph is linear (with 30 patrollers you have the same chance to catch, say, 0, 10, 20 or 30 brigands). So, its much more random than if each patroller has 50% chance to succeed."
(Excellent link BTW.) Try as a might, I still can't get this (the "linear", the 0.5 catching not being the same as 50%, basically the whole thing). Care to clarify?
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old September 6th, 2012, 05:11 PM

momfreeek momfreeek is offline
Corporal
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 178
Thanks: 1
Thanked 47 Times in 8 Posts
momfreeek is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Patrolling and Unrest

I did a quick search for "dice bell curve"; the first few paragraphs here seem like a decent explanation:
http://oldguygaming.com/probability-and-dice-rolling

it applies to coin flips as well as dice rolls (a coin being a 2 sided dice). with 30 coin flips there are many combinations with 15 heads + 15 tails but only one with 30 heads.


so given 2 ways of calculating the result:

- flipping 30 coins and adding all the heads
- rolling a single 31 sided dice (0-30)

it could be said that the second method is much more random (as extreme results are far more likely)

Last edited by momfreeek; September 6th, 2012 at 05:25 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old September 6th, 2012, 05:22 PM
jotwebe's Avatar

jotwebe jotwebe is offline
Corporal
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: UTC+1
Posts: 127
Thanks: 22
Thanked 5 Times in 4 Posts
jotwebe is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Patrolling and Unrest

Linear simply means that extreme outcomes are just as likely as middle-of-the-road ones. As opposed to something like a bell curve where the average is also the most common.

So, for example, imagine you have a bunch of 40 militia with and indy commander patrolling away on your overtaxed cap, with a destealth strength of about 50. Say taxes are 150%, so 10 points of unrest. Now your 50 points of destealth mean that up to 50 points of unrest can be patrolled away - but possibly none at all, too. You're rolling a d50.

So on any given turn, there should be a 20% chance that your actual destealth value is below 10, and unrest ensues.

That's from the manual and the wiki. Makes me wonder if having two smaller patrolling groups instead of one big one gave two rolls and so more consistent results?

Edit: ninja'd
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to jotwebe For This Useful Post:
  #9  
Old September 7th, 2012, 04:19 AM

John_Madlock John_Madlock is offline
Corporal
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 53
Thanks: 16
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
John_Madlock is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Patrolling and Unrest

I think it is even more like reverse bell curve. In my tests extreme results are very common and average results are very few.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old September 7th, 2012, 09:27 AM

momfreeek momfreeek is offline
Corporal
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 178
Thanks: 1
Thanked 47 Times in 8 Posts
momfreeek is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Patrolling and Unrest

0-7, 8-22, 23-30

8-23 covers the median 50%, even though 8 feels quite extreme to me. It would take a lot of tests to clean out coincidental randomness but I'm not enough of a statistician to quantify that. Results or it never happened!

Last edited by momfreeek; September 7th, 2012 at 09:45 AM..
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:04 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©1999 - 2022, Shrapnel Games, Inc. - All Rights Reserved.