AI - The Artificial Idiot - Page 2

thejeff · #11 December 9th, 2010, 01:50 PM

I've looked at the debug log data quite a bit and it doesn't really seem to help with understanding why the AI does what it does. It shows which spells it considers and what ratings it gives them, but not how it calculates those ratings. Sometimes it tells you about gems or paths or fatigue, but not much about why it chose one permissible spell over another.

Rytek · #12 December 9th, 2010, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Executor

Rytek, paralyze is a horrible spell if you only have chaff, and yes we know how much you love unfrozens and you're glad they won

Well, you said he had tarts so paralyze isnt so bad vs them. soul slay and enslave mind are better of course. And disintigrate when they are in range would be the best bang for the buck vs the tarts.

mm, I don't love unfrozens. I just think they are a tiny bit overpowered.I find it hard to justify spending W gems on anything besides them. I have no idea why you think I'm glad they won--I'm just not surprised they did.

Back on topic, I was wondering if you had a power of the spheres cast for your slaves? You never mentioned that or a northern star cast either.if the slaves were just S1,D1 maybe all of those banishment you were seeing were coming from your s1,D1 H2 slaves?

Rytek · #13 December 9th, 2010, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Executor

Hm, interesting idea regarding FF Calahan. But that seems wrong from my point of view as I had undead (longdead) chaff and the enemy had unfrozens. Both susceptible to banishment, actually mine were quite more susceptible to it.
And yes, the battle was under darkness so shouldn't have the AI used higher precision spells?
I'm still rather confused.

I see the logic of this as well. But maybe something else is at work? Did the enemy hold and attack while you charged your chaffe on to his side of the field? Maybe banish was one of the only spells in range. Ive seen several of my communions default to solar rays in near similar circumstances(in the Galadia game vs Balz' mass of unfrozens)Although the ea ermor mages are not holy so no banishment option.If a mass protection or similar was cast the spell may have been discarded due to the higher protection.

Executor · #14 December 9th, 2010, 03:12 PM

I think just PotS,
I first thought that do, I brought a fair amount of indie priests, so initially I figured they were casting it, but once I saw my main mage "BALBLABLABLABLABLABLA" (that's his name

) casting banishment I was surprised.
Than I thought the tarts, or his troops weren't in range, but than I measured the battlefield and they were in a 10-15 range distance from the communion masters.

Swan · #15 December 9th, 2010, 07:00 PM

Problems, God?
\

this is how i often see my mages

Fantomen · #16 December 10th, 2010, 05:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by llamabeast

Quote:

The offer has been out there since before Dom3 was released but very few have actually bothered to look at it.

I don't understand Gandalf - what offer?

I bet you half a melon this just another round of smoke and mirrors.

Links? Post number? Who made the offer? Why has the countless calls and discussions (including input from capable people who would jump on any possibility to help) about AI been left unnoticed by the devs if they in fact have this "offer" standing?

I call bull****.

Gandalf Parker · #17 December 10th, 2010, 10:49 AM

Sorry for late answers. Im not as responsive as I used to be and far more selective about it

Quote:

Originally Posted by llamabeast

Quote:

The offer has been out there since before Dom3 was released but very few have
actually bothered to look at it.

I don't understand Gandalf - what offer?

Such suggestions have been walked in to the devs. Published in the beta group and discussed. And a number of them have generated changes to the way that some spells were treated by the ai.

Some of the discussions died here but for good reasons. People would start to discuss the actual actions of the AI and would try to suggest changes which would quickly become bogged down by IF statements. Clearly such major additions, trying to take in specific nations and situations would shift from a suggested change to a major rewrite. Still though, those discussions were worthy.

But most discussions about the AI here were not actually suggestions about the way the AI in Dom3 does things. They were discussions about AI in general in all games. And most of those were pretty insulting. Nothing I would champion in private discussions.

llamabeast · #18 December 10th, 2010, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Such suggestions have been walked in to the devs.

What suggestions? I'm not being funny, I literally have no idea what you're talking about.

Gandalf Parker · #19 December 10th, 2010, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by llamabeast

Quote:

Such suggestions have been walked in to the devs.

What suggestions? I'm not being funny, I literally have no idea what you're talking about.

Well anything that shows the person actually looked at what was going on and had a tweak in mind. Placing a certain spell higher or lower in consideration. Or how the AI purchases or uses its units. If a suggestion showed understanding of the actions and was reasonable then it would get forwarded by someone. Especially if the original discussion could be linked to safely.

thejeff · #20 December 10th, 2010, 01:55 PM

I'm not sure what "higher or lower in consideration" means. As near as I can tell, the spells the AI tries are given ratings based on their likely effects. My assumption is the way to change this would be to change the weighting of the different types of effects: direct damage vs stun damage vs protection buffs, etc, etc.

Would suggestions like:
Lower the weighting of battlefield summons.
Increase the weighting of the path booster spells.

count as useful suggestions? Because I've certainly seen them before.