.com.unity Forums
  The Official e-Store of Shrapnel Games

This Month's Specials

Bronze - Save $8.00
winSPMBT: Main Battle Tank - Save $6.00

   







Go Back   .com.unity Forums > Illwinter Game Design > Dominions 3: The Awakening

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old November 15th, 2008, 04:45 PM
Tifone's Avatar
Tifone Tifone is offline
Lieutenant Colonel
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Florence, Italy
Posts: 1,424
Thanks: 740
Thanked 112 Times in 63 Posts
Tifone is on a distinguished road
Exclamation Sermon of courage

I remember KO asking some time ago if in our opinion, some spells were given a too high priority by the AI... it came to my mind today looking to one battle...

Does someone else think Sermon of Courage is too high on AI-casting-priority?
While I totally understand the importance of the Moral of my troops, it looks like my mages if left unscripted (which I sometimes have to do, i.e. when passing to another level of Evo or Ench, hoping my mages will cast the great new spell I can't script now) spend a lot of turns rallying every single square of my army, and lose very nice opportunities of highly damaging the enemy army sooner (preventing their cavalry to even get to my troops i.e.) and risk to damage my own troops casting the damage spells when the armies are already near and fighting. Wouldn't also the troops use a rally better when they've started taking some casualties?

Also, I'd like to see my mages if left free to move at will (Stay behind troops) take a bit more the initiative to go a little forward to cast that buff (i.e. Legions of Steel) they missed on the first line the first turn... If I just want my mage to stand and cast spell there's the "Cast spell" command, no?

(Here would come the final part where I say that's a little thing in a big game anyway, and I totally love the game no matter what, but I've already said this ad nauseam in all the months spent on the board so I pass this time )

Last edited by Tifone; November 15th, 2008 at 05:23 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old November 15th, 2008, 05:39 PM
JimMorrison's Avatar

JimMorrison JimMorrison is offline
Lieutenant General
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Utopia, Oregon
Posts: 2,676
Thanks: 83
Thanked 143 Times in 108 Posts
JimMorrison is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Sermon of courage

Well, to be fair on one point, the +2 Morale buff lasts the entire fight, so no reason to wait, per se.

However, I've just found this even more annoying than usual, while testing out the things I was reading about MA Abysia. Seems if you script Anathement Salamanders to (Blessing)(Phoenix Power)(spells), they will happily chain cast Sermon of Courage until every single soldier in range has the boost. They seriously will cast on individuals preferentially, before switching to other spells. I thought that scripting might be kind of nice though, since in general the AI seems to adore Falling Fires and Fire Cloud, but it's nice if they can switch up to Fireball or something, on a case by case basis.

So to sum up, I also think they value Sermon far too highly. Obviously the benefit/target just has too much weight, if they'll cast Sermon on 1 man, rather than drop Falling Fires on a tight mass of enemies - and I agree that it should be changed.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to JimMorrison For This Useful Post:
  #3  
Old November 15th, 2008, 06:52 PM

Sombre Sombre is offline
BANNED USER
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 5,463
Thanks: 165
Thanked 324 Times in 190 Posts
Sombre is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Sermon of courage

Yep, Sermon of Courage is definitely cast too often.

Especially on troops that have already routed. It's absolutely no fun to see your H3 ubermage wasting time casting sermon of courage on a handful of scattered, routing chaff.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Sombre For This Useful Post:
  #4  
Old November 15th, 2008, 08:15 PM

chrispedersen chrispedersen is offline
BANNED USER
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 4,075
Thanks: 203
Thanked 121 Times in 91 Posts
chrispedersen is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Sermon of courage

Agree.. the other thing that frosts me
is how bad bless targeting is.


I've seen blessess.. in a whole square of troops.. only get 1-2 troops...

and 3 priests casting bless on 20 troops , 3 times each.. still lmiss more than 4 units....
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old November 15th, 2008, 11:22 PM

thejeff thejeff is offline
General
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,327
Thanks: 4
Thanked 133 Times in 117 Posts
thejeff is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Sermon of courage

Yeah, or watching a Jotun Jarl miss himself with bless twice then charge off and die.

Technically it's not the targeting. Bless has 100% precision. But it hits an area of 5+ squares around (and possibly not including) that target.
The obvious fix would be to make AoE spells always affect the square they hit.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old November 16th, 2008, 09:16 AM

Sombre Sombre is offline
BANNED USER
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 5,463
Thanks: 165
Thanked 324 Times in 190 Posts
Sombre is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Sermon of courage

Another way would be to make the bless spell itself an aoe 1 100 prec spell, with next spell of 'bless aoe' which covers the other squares it might land on.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old November 16th, 2008, 10:00 AM
vfb's Avatar

vfb vfb is offline
General
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Japan
Posts: 3,691
Thanks: 269
Thanked 397 Times in 200 Posts
vfb is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Sermon of courage

I added a 'Bless Self' spell quite a while back, that's just H1, range-0 aoe-0 prec-0. I had gotten tired of my Dai Onis missing .
__________________
Whether he submitted the post, or whether he did not, made no difference. The Thought Police would get him just the same. He had committed— would still have committed, even if he had never set pen to paper— the essential crime that contained all others in itself. Thoughtcrime, they called it. Thoughtcrime was not a thing that could be concealed forever.
http://z7.invisionfree.com/Dom3mods/index.php?
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old November 29th, 2008, 04:59 PM
Tifone's Avatar
Tifone Tifone is offline
Lieutenant Colonel
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Florence, Italy
Posts: 1,424
Thanks: 740
Thanked 112 Times in 63 Posts
Tifone is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Sermon of courage

Resurrecting the thread just to say IMHO even the Holy Avenger could use some AI-priority reduction, given its usefulness is extremely situational and the last-line-mage's AI loves to lose a turn casting it despite having much more useful spells ready.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old December 1st, 2008, 01:15 AM
Lingchih's Avatar

Lingchih Lingchih is offline
General
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Irving, TX
Posts: 3,207
Thanks: 54
Thanked 60 Times in 35 Posts
Lingchih is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Sermon of courage

I personally like the Sermon of Courage to be a priority cast. I've seen too many routs that could have been won if the soldiers had a bit more balls.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Lingchih For This Useful Post:
  #10  
Old December 1st, 2008, 06:54 AM

Agema Agema is offline
First Lieutenant
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 792
Thanks: 28
Thanked 45 Times in 31 Posts
Agema is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Sermon of courage

I've generally found priest mages that could cast something better than Sermon usually do.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:59 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©1999 - 2017, Shrapnel Games, Inc. - All Rights Reserved.