Bug: Retreating into enemy territory

[Dorjan]

If you have the spell that is meant to return you home if you die active you aren't returned and are lost

Could this be fixed? Please!

[Fantomen]

It is not supposed to return you if you die from one hit, it only returns you if you are hurt and survives.

Hence, it is not a bug.

[lch]

Please add bug reports like these to the Bug discussion thread.

[Dorjan]

Originally Posted by Fantomen

It is not supposed to return you if you die from one hit, it only returns you if you are hurt and survives.

Hence, it is not a bug.

Oh... I thought it worked even if you "died" in one hit. Still, I can't imaging why the would be classed as dieing in one hit just becasue they ran away.

So I'll leave it here for discusion

[llamabeast]

I guess this is the issue with dying on running from an assassination again? Did you lose a pretender? That kind of bad luck can be very annoying.

There's been some discussion on whether it's reasonable that fleeing from an assassination kills you. I think the conclusion was "not entirely reasonable, but necessary to make assassinations at all effective".

[Dorjan]

Originally Posted by llamabeast

I guess this is the issue with dying on running from an assassination again?

No, this is after another MP game, totally different event, but I thought I would bring it up at the same time.

This one was actually from an attemp at a remote attack using call of the winds for the useless birds to backup a mage that put himself right into the thick of it (I was really new and didn't realise about the losing troops will make the top mage run away >.<) and he ran and died even with the spells active.

Originally Posted by llamabeast

There's been some discussion on whether it's reasonable that fleeing from an assassination kills you. I think the conclusion was "not entirely reasonable, but necessary to make assassinations at all effective".

No offence, but they are rubbish at making assassins then :

[Endoperez]

How can you "make" assassins? That implies someone spent gems on him, and spending gems on anything that can be killed by province defense is very risky. To my knowledge, no one has figured out how to make massed assassins useful in competitive multiplayer. If you feel someone has, I'd very much like to read how me managed it.

The problems with assassinations are two-fold: assassins die easily, and assassins need items to kill their targets.

Very few nations have worthwhile national assassins. EA and LA Abysia might have, but they're capital-only, which severely limits their use. C'tis Empoisoners are nifty because enemy mages will spend gems against them. Blood nations can put a Black Heart on anything stealthy, which opens up some really tough creatures - Jotun Scouts and Pans, for example - and that MIGHT be worth it. However, most assassins lack the offensive ability to kill someone with bodyguards, and can't surive more than a few of the things a mage worth killing can cast.

Not to mention that assassins can be killed with province defense, patrolling militia or spells like Mind Hunt that can target stealthy commanders. Note that assassination spells and normal assassins are usually talked separately, because the former are used and the latter aren't. Assassination spells can be sent anywhere, their gem cost/success ratio is better and your enemy can't switch his army to "patrol" to remove the troublemaker.


Now, there are exceptions. Assassins can be used to force a player to give all his important commanders bodyguards (taking resources away from elsewhere) and/or invest in patrollers, and a surprise assassination can really ruin someone's plans. Succubi (with their good hp and flight) are tough and fast assassins, and there's always the small chance of successful seduction. Black Heart could also change things.

As I said, if you've seen assassins used effectively, more detailed explanation would be appreciated. As you've noticed, most people here don't think that assassins are as bad as you make them to be. Alternatively, you could just start using assassins yourself - most people here wouldn't expect them, so it could end up working really well.

[JimMorrison]

Originally Posted by Endoperez

...Note that assassination spells and normal assassins are usually talked separately, because the former are used and the latter aren't. Assassination spells can be sent anywhere, their gem cost/success ratio is better and your enemy can't switch his army to "patrol" to remove the troublemaker.
...
As I said, if you've seen assassins used effectively, more detailed explanation would be appreciated. As you've noticed, most people here don't think that assassins are as bad as you make them to be. Alternatively, you could just start using assassins yourself - most people here wouldn't expect them, so it could end up working really well.

Judging by the other thread, I'm quite certain that he is referring to having remote spells spammed at him repeatedly.

[Dorjan]

Originally Posted by JimMorrison

Judging by the other thread, I'm quite certain that he is referring to having remote spells spammed at him repeatedly.

Thank you for your input. It's both actually but I've had it before, don't think this is a rant about "omg someone is using a 1337 spell and i'm losing" It's not. I'm winning and if i'm not going to end top 2nd (if there is such a thing in dom3) is 100%. This was a 5 player game also. Exactly your point about normal assasins but the other thread is about how assasination attempts (spells or otherwise) is handelled. I still kill every other Earth Elemental but the things i'm mentioning (in the other thread) happens it makes me not want to play dom3 (even if i'm winning) because it feels broken.

Anyway this thread has nothing to do with assasins so can we go back to the orginial point

[Sombre]

Pretty sure this is WAD. Returning isn't meant to return you if you're killed by having nowhere to retreat to.