The possibility of partnership.

[Archonsod]

I thought they said they couldn't get the rights, hence the homage rather than the modern version?

Regardless, I wasn't saying that Doms 3 should be more like MoM. I simply figure MoM would be a logical project for both teams - Stardock pretty much lifted most of the mechanics from MOO II in Galciv 1, Illwinter have the fantasy world background. One of the more serious problems with both GalCiv games was that there was little difference between races - whether your playing Terran or Drengin makes no real difference apart from a couple of numbers. There's no real 'feel' for the race you're playing. Dominions on the other hand has a distinct theme and feeling for each race, despite the shared magic and similar, but is limited on the strategic level (in the sense that your pretty much raising armies and killing your enemies and nothing else).
I still can't see what Stardock could really do for Doms 3 beyond making it 'more like MoM'. They're good at the economic type stuff, the tech trees and similar, but in the two areas Doms 3 AI really could be improved (Diplomacy, tactics) Stardock are just as bad as Illwinter.

[Meglobob]

I would love to see a partnership between Stardock/Illwinter, I am a big fan of both GC2 and Dom3. The only reason I bought/knew about Dom3 was Brad Wardell giving his personal recommedation to try/buy Dom3 on the Stardock website.

It seems to me from what I have read on this forum and Stardocks that those two companies would complement each another very well with a partnership.

Kristoffer and Johan seem to really enjoy creating, putting new content, features into the Dom3 series more than anything else. They also seem to do it mostly from the enjoyment of doing it than from huge finiancial gain.

Brad on the other hand loves doing AI, he has been called one of the best AI creaters in the games computing industry and he is a out and out capitalist who wants to make a good product that will make loads of dosh.

So a partnership between them could bring a excellent game like Dom3 to the 'mass market', by this I mean if put on the shelves of retail outlets I think Dom3 would sell over 200,000 units if done right. The game would have both excellent AI for SP play, I could see Brad developing 10 seperate AI's, then assigning 6 nations (with small variations, like GC2) to each. Also excellent content/depth/gameplay/MP that Illwinter have already created. I also think Stardock would considerably improve the graphics/sound/music in Dom3 as well.

Of course all this is unlikely to ever happen but we can dream can we not?

[Gandalf Parker]

Ive actually known of GalCiv for longer than Ive known about Dominions. Persoanlly, Im not that thrilled with what GalCiv has become since it went windows/eye-candy. Im still waiting for it to catch up to its original OS/2 version.

Anyway, some problems I see with a partnership are...
A) they dont program in the same language
B) they dont program on the same OS
C) they dont speak the same language when discussing the programming projects. (Brad=english and Illwinter=finnish I think)
D) Brad isnt all that big on partners.

As for shelfware, there are alot of drawbacks to shelfware. It MIGHT be possible that Illwinter can now aford to test the marketing/shelfware methods but I kindof doubt it.

[Endoperez]

Gandalf Parker said:
C) they dont speak the same language when discussing the programming projects. (Brad=english and Illwinter=finnish I think)

Swedish, actually. "Något gick fel." etc.

[calmon]

Maybe as an european i know more about sweds then someone from US. From my experiences they speak a better english than many americans. They don't use bad slangs and learn english from childhood on (most of the films are in english with subtitle)

[Gandalf Parker]

calmon said:
Maybe as an european i know more about sweds then someone from US. From my experiences they speak a better english than many americans. They don't use bad slangs and learn english from childhood on (most of the films are in english with subtitle)

I know this is true of europeans (in fact ther eis a funny joke about americans based on it). But I know that the games innermost circle, basically the alpha team, prefers people who talk their home toungue. Im not sure if a cross collaboration would be all that comfortable. Of course it would also help if they were all talking the same programming language, and the same operating system also.

[DrPraetorious]

Shelf space in gaming stores is at such a premium at this point that it's like radio airtime - the thing that the major publishers control is access to shelf-space, and they subcontract the work of actually making the software.

So unless J+K wanted to sign themselves over to Atari or something, Electronic Boutique simply won't carry their software.

Does anyone know how many copies of dominions 3 have shipped?

[Gandalf Parker]

DrPraetorious said:
Shelf space in gaming stores is at such a premium at this point that it's like radio airtime - the thing that the major publishers control is access to shelf-space, and they subcontract the work of actually making the software.

Its also a big difference in publishing companies. The "shelfware and advertising" companies vs the "online and publicity" companies. The first one involves extensive pre-pay of funds by the publishing company which have to be paid back before anyone gets a profit check. Sometimes that can take years. The second one tends to be better for indie game developers IMHO.

[PhilD]

I don't think Shrapnel want to divulge that kind of information - they sold more of Dom3 than they sell of most of their games, but they don't typically say how many that is.

[HoneyBadger]

It doesn't matter so much how complicated Dom3 is compared to GalCiv2, where AI is concerned. Or atleast, it doesn't matter as much as it might seem to. The fact is, poor AI is the norm. Very few games have good AI and very few people are capable of creating good AI (even fewer are passionate about it).

Put it like this: If you have someone who's really good at making toasted cheese sandwitches, a master of the toasted cheese sandwitch craft and trade, and you ask them to make a toasted cheese sandwitch with tomato and ham and maybe just a little onion between the ham and the cheese, they're more likely to be able to make you a decent toasted ham and cheese and tomato sandwitch because they already have that talent, experience, and passion for the basic toasted cheese. Now it's possible that the project might be too big, or the person might rebel against the purity of the simple cheese + bread design, but it's also possible that the person might, in expanding his horizons, become a better, deeper, and more complete chef, able to produce a toasted sandwitch of such complexity-yet such grace-that it blows your tastebuds away.

Certainly, Galciv2 is not as complex as Dom3, but just as certainly, Galciv2 is not tic-tac-toe. A partnership would allow Johan and Kristoffer to input just as much into the game, if not much more, than Brad. I also am really glad to hear that Brad has heard of and enjoys Dom3 enough to offer it free advertizing on his site. That's a very good sign.
I'm sure that the language "barrier" can be overcome. After all, if Illwinter were willing to hire me, I'd be willing to learn Swedish or Dutch or Finnish or old Norse runes, whatever was required to make them more comfortable. If a partnership occurred, it certainly is reasonable that a few social compromises be made here and there, atleast to the extent that everyone can communicate in a shared language. Afterall, the company's name is Illwinter, not Illmannered. I agree that Kristoffer and Johan both write English better than most people on this site already, a lot of whom-as far as I know-are American.

As far as the ability to put games on shelves, I bought my copy of GalCiv2 at Wal-Mart, so that puts to rest that particular concern.