Mod - Improved Light Cavalry

Keir Maxwell · #1 January 15th, 2004, 12:33 PM

Hiya,

After failing to get Alex's mod off the dom library I quickly made up my own for Tien Ch'i and came up with what I believe to be an important break through in dealing with quality LC - fear.

The difficulty of simulating LC as that they are not involved in full on frontal combat but instead ride in shooting, throwing javelins, feint charges etc. High defense can simulate how hard LC are to catch but its harder to simulate the impact of the LC which is primarily on the cohesion/morale of the units attacked. If the LC involved are of low to moderate quality they will cause a few casulties but are unlikely to shake steady opponents. On the other hand if the LC involved are fierce and keen to close when the opportunity presents the results were described by ancients as terrifying.

So give low to moderate quality LC high defence, as Alex has suggested, to make it hard to shift and give the hard buggers (Huns, Xiongnu, Turkomans, Mongols, Szekeler etc) a fear ability to represent the greater stress they could apply. This is not just about fear but about representing the overall impact of aggressive LC.

So my Tien C'hi Barbarian Kingdoms mod gives the LC bucklers, raising both defense and prot, I've raised precision to 11 (ouch), removed the lance, tinkered with res cost and added fear -4 (good for pillaging). I've given the other cav precison 9 - lower than the LC to reflect the impact of heavy armor on shooting from horseback.

The changes in equipment and precision are to my understanding more accurate for what is being modeled and provide the HC with a clear role - the shock - while the LC are the multi role troops - generally either delaying and shooting or else attacking the flank. While there were lunatic LC with lance I have not heard that the Xiongnu of similar steppe nomads fought this way. My understanding is that the standard is a light lance able to be thrown and better classified as a spear till the weapon mod comes out - then I'll give them scimitars and a one shot light lance.

I'll do a bit of play testing then post the mod. Should provide me with the basic mounted troop types for the Easterling WoTR mod.

cheers

Keir

Pocus · #2 January 15th, 2004, 12:58 PM

a question, how mods which deal with the same parameters (changing the same unit eg) supercede one another?

apoger · #3 January 15th, 2004, 05:27 PM

>a question, how mods which deal with the same parameters (changing the same unit eg) supercede one another?

I saw a comment from IW that suggested that mods that affect the same thing may be problematic in multiplayer. Seems the sequence of mod loading might be different on different machines. This might lead to different stats on things in the same game but on different PC's.

I'll do some testing and see how bad I can make it from my end.

apoger · #4 January 15th, 2004, 05:29 PM

>After failing to get Alex's mod off the dom library

Sunray has my mods on his site.
Illwinter told me they have them up on their site tonight.

apoger · #5 January 15th, 2004, 05:42 PM

>a fear ability to represent the greater stress they could apply. This is not just about fear but about representing the overall impact of aggressive LC.

Hrm, fear is supposed to be the supernatural kind.

After all, many troops/creatures in this game are downright scary (Emerald Guards, Knights, Summer Lions, Minotaurs) but don't generate extra fear beyond the normal morale affect by causing combat losses.

On the other hand I see what you're getting at. In many ways LC would cause a disruption in the enemy ranks due to the threat of being attacked from the flank/rear. Still, this is hard to model in the game as writen. I don't like the idea of using fear for this, as it would be applicable to a multitude of other troops as well (for a variety of reasons).

Perhaps an overall speed modifier?
The average tactical speed of each army could be measured at battle start. The slower army could lose speed and/or defense skill off their stats, as a simlation that they are limited due to the stresses of being outmanuvered. Of course we would have to get Illwinter to do this sort of thing, as it's beyond the mod tools capabilities.

PDF · #6 January 15th, 2004, 05:49 PM

I concur that these changes are welcome...They still aren't sufficient to make LC interesting to build IMHO

As long as "Skirmishing" can't be done, there's no rationale for using expensive LC to shoot instead of cheap foot archers, or unprotected LC for shock instead of sturdy HC...

Leadman · #7 January 15th, 2004, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Keir Maxwell:
Hiya,

After failing to get Alex's mod off the dom library I quickly made up my own for Tien Ch'i and came up with what I believe to be an important break through in dealing with quality LC - fear.

So give low to moderate quality LC high defence, as Alex has suggested, to make it hard to shift and give the hard buggers (Huns, Xiongnu, Turkomans, Mongols, Szekeler etc) a fear ability to represent the greater stress they could apply. This is not just about fear but about representing the overall impact of aggressive LC.

So my Tien C'hi Barbarian Kingdoms mod gives the LC bucklers, raising both defense and prot, I've raised precision to 11 (ouch), removed the lance, tinkered with res cost and added fear -4 (good for pillaging). I've given the other cav precison 9 - lower than the LC to reflect the impact of heavy armor on shooting from horseback.

cheers

Keir

I think that fear is a great way to simulate the effect of LC with the current limitations. High defense against missile fire would be better than an overall increase in defense IMHO. I diagree with lowering the precision of armored cav. They were usually the nobles or other elite and were probably better with the bow. I look forward to giving your mod a run! Thanks!

Leadman