Ramming/Kamakazi tactics

[Dracus]

Here is an idea for you;
Since the drone pictures are not being used. I added a new ship to the ship construction. I called it ram ship and set the requirements to be computer core and armor. I have not finished tested them yet since I just got done setting them up.

[Trachmyr]

FYI, if you ram and both ships survive, then both ships will occupy the same "square", not really that important but an interesting side note... as this means the restriction that ships can't occupy the same "square" is imposed rather than an integral part of the hardcode.

[capnq]

In one of my current games, back when I was losing 2-3 technologically inferior destroyers for every enemy light cruiser I was crippling, I designed a suicide escort with nothing but the requied control sections, engines, and a Cobalt Warhead. I didn't think that design would survive to close with its target, so I tried adding armor and point defense to a frigate Version. The frigate would have cost more than my front line LCs, and the destroyer Version that added another weapon was more expensive than my first cruiser design! Obviously, I never actually built any of these. By the time I'd researched fighters, my casualties were more managable, so I haven't tried a kamikaze design for them yet.

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Cap'n Q

[javaslinger]

Sounds like the kamakazi and ramming rules need some work. I hope MM is listening.

In a perfect game, all available technologies should have viable strategies...

Ken

[Q]

IMO ramming is a valuable strategy. Another topic is the cobalt warhead. In my experience if you use the cobalt warhed on a ramming ship both ship get destroyed. I am not sure if that's always the case, more testing would be needed. But I think the high cost of the cobalt warhead makes this not a very attractive weapon. You probably get a better deal with a lot of armor on a ramming ship.

[CW]

quote:

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my experience if you use the cobalt warhed on a ramming ship both ship get destroyed.

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Nope. That's not always the case.

I've been doing some testing yesterday and my conclusion is that ramming ships are just too expensive. Same goes to the fighters - a large fighter with 2 kamakazi warheads will cost you around 650 minerals depending on your design, and it did only 18 damage each! How many will you need to take out a line Barium class DN of mine with 3000 shields?

Edit: Just did a ramming test with my line coloniser and it did only 186 damage, destroying itself in the process. That's hardly a dent in my DN's shield!

[ 15 December 2001: Message edited by: CW ]

[Baron Munchausen]

quote:

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Originally posted by Phoenix-D:
My idea was to make long-range "smart" missiles out of fighters; make a 1 KT size and a component that flies and rams. But it never did even a half of the rated damage- though I *was* only testing it against shields..

Phoenix-D

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This is using a fighter as a substitute drone. Drones use ramming as their main form of attack. They are essentially cruise missiles. Once you have drones I think you'll not bother with kamikaze ships or fighters.

But remember, the percentage of damage caused by ramming, to both the target and the rammer, is settable in SETTINGS.TXT like so many other things. I've set my ramming damages VERY high (300 percent for both) because realistically you should not expect to survive collison at the speeds represented in space combat. This makes ramming very effective, but also invariably fatal unless there is a HUGE size difference between the ships involved. It does make drones more powerful, though.

[ZeroAdunn]

Wow, I didn't know you could change the ramming values. Thanks for the info.

[Phoenix-D]

Well, the problem I had with ramming is the warheads never did anything, i.e. the ship without the warhead did as much damage ramming as the ship WITH the warhead.

Phoenix-D

[Q]

In my experience the cobalt warheads work. If you put several Typ III on a ship you can do quite a lot of damage! But I always lost the attacking ship even if its destruction potential (of the cobalt warheads) was greater than the target. And the cost of the cobalt warheads is too high. I reduced it to 100 minerals and 200-400 radioactives for level I-III.