OT - your fav games

[Arryn]

Originally posted by Vicious Love:
The game was an atrocity.

Please, don't hold back on how you really feel about it.

As for the whole "decently done conVersion" thingie, I'm at a loss for words.

Given the length of your response, methinks not.

Pretty much the only element of P&P V:tM which made the transition intact

Guess you missed the interviews with the CRPG's designers on why things were done as they were. Or the interviews with the designers of the forthcoming Vampire Bloodlines, on what they thought of the earlier game, and what they're doing for the new one. I can see why you'd be disappointed, if you don't understand why they couldn't convert the WW rules more closely than they did. My advice is to avoid getting Bloodlines, because you'll likely be upset all over again.

I hope that came out coherent, I'm definitely not at my best at the moment. So. Very. Tired.

9) MY BRAIN IS SWELLING!

Coherent, yes. Ranting and frothing at the mouth too.

What you disliked about the game (except for the Ventrue goons, which really spoils the whole thing for those familiar with the WW pen&paper game) I could say about many other popular CRPGs. Bear in mind that it's a CRPG, and as such still has to appeal to the mass audience. The sort of roleplayers that love WW are a much smaller niche market than what the CRPG was targeting. So, yes, the game is over the top (another understatement) in many places, and has many many "theatrical" flaws. But I give it credit for allowing, like NWN has done, GMs to create their own (and better) modules and be able to play with people who aren't able to sit across a table from them. It also further popularized the pen&paper game, which doesn't hurt. And, despite its flaws, the game was fun to play. Perhaps not for you, but for myself and thousands of others it was.

[Vicious Love]

Point taken. Nonetheless, I expect a V:tM game to be more like Fallout than Diablo. I LIKE Diablo, because it doesn't pretend to be not-Diablo.
The whole point of V:tM is that it is the anti-AD&D. Dungeon crawls, healing potions, and legions of identical foes there only for the XP are anathema to White Wolf. Right from the outset, White Wolf games were there so elitist geeks could act like they're better than run-off-the-mill hack & slashers, all the while shamelessly indulging in one the oldest adolescent power fantasies in the book.
It's like that Will Smith opus, "I, Robot". It might turn out to be a downright awesome action movie. The effects might be truly spectacular. And Asimov's grave is still doing 300 or so RPM. If they'da called it "Sassy MegaDetroit Cop Versus the Killicator-Robot HyperNation", I'd probably watch it. Ditto for V:tM:R, but replace "Robot" with "Vampire" and "Sassy MegaDetroit Cop" with "Vampire".

Why am I not asleep yet? Stupid King of Dragon Pass demo. Download faster!

Update: Besides which, if Vampire fans are such a tiny niche demographic, why make a Vampire game at all?
I mean, Chessmaster 2000 mighta sold better if there were more explosions, but people looking for explosion-based entertainment generally get turned off by words like "Chess" and "master", as well as numbers above 7. Not that I actually play chess, or anything. Not nearly enough headshots.
Anyway, Bloodlines is going to kick. Silence your inappropriate-comparison making word hole. I'll be in my denial room.

[ July 19, 2004, 22:44: Message edited by: Vicious Love ]

[Kel]

Though none of htem are likely to make my top 10, I thought Vampire was a decent CRPG, I thought NWN was a decent CRPG and I plan to see I, Robot

- Kel

[Arryn]

Originally posted by Vicious Love:
Asimov's grave is still doing 300 or so RPM.

Without a doubt. I've yet to see it, but I expect that "I, Robot" will bear about as much resemblence to something that Asimov would've approved of as Starship Troopers bore any resemblence to Heinlein's book of same name (besides having something called "bugs").

[Arryn]

UPDATE: Having seen "I, Robot" this evening, I have to say that while Asimov would not have approved of the script (I can go into the reasons why if anyone really cares), the movie wasn't bad, and was a helluva lot closer to Asimov's "universe" than "Starship Troopers" was to Heinlein's. Go see the movie and enjoy it (ignoring the impossible physics of the bots will help).

[Vicious Love]

Haven't seen it yet myself but, shortly after my Last post, decided to Google "'will smith' asimov 'in his grave'". Results were... enlightening. I suggest you run the same search yourself, or simply run a search for "'i, robot' hardwired". Turns out any and all similarities between the movie and the book(s) are wholly unintentional.

Update: Summary of search results from various seemingly credible sources, for the abysmally lazy - Once upon a time there was an eye-gougingly generic, post Cold War, Michael Crichton style technophobia/hubris movie, about a detective who has to combat a robot uprising with raw power of quip. Realizing that nothing save the inflated effects budget set their movie apart from every mainstream SciFi Lite movie ever made, the responsible parties got in touch with the estate of Isaac Asimov, commandeered the title "I, Robot", changed one of the movie characters' name, tossed in some halfhearted mention of the Laws of Robotics, and waited for the profits to roll in.

Getting back on topic, I'm a big fan of Warhammer: Dark Omen and Shadow of the Horned Rat myself, and I don't even like the miniatures game.
As for Baldur's Gate, I prefer my computer games either have a good plot(Fallout style), or no plot at all(Diablo style). I can only have so many "assassins" clad in black for no reason whatsoever walk up to me in the middle of a busy street and exclaim "HELLO THERE I AM AN ASSASSIN AND I AM HERE TO MURDER YOU!" before I vow never to touch a game again. Honestly, even the AD&D system lets you slit someone's throat in their sleep, if the developer can't come up with a halfway decent excuse for a fight, they should just make the game a glorified random encounter generator. Y'know, like CounterStrike, only single player.

Updated update: Furthermore, if I have to sit through one more melodramatic, ultracliched ripoff of the end of "The Empire Strikes Back", I'll weep. Stupid Sarevok.

Addendum to update update: I really should get a new keyboard. I've been spontaneously dropping letters for like a week now.

[ July 21, 2004, 08:05: Message edited by: Vicious Love ]

[Arryn]

Originally posted by Vicious Love:
As for Baldur's Gate, I prefer my computer games either have a good plot(Fallout style), or no plot at all(Diablo style). I can only have so many "assassins" clad in black for no reason whatsoever walk up to me in the middle of a busy street and exclaim "HELLO THERE I AM AN ASSASSIN AND I AM HERE TO MURDER YOU!" before I vow never to touch a game again.

That's what so great about KotOR: it has a real plot, great characters, and the only people trying to kill you are scripted to do so for logical (plot) reasons. No random (stupid) mayhem.