OT: Sci-Fi Founders

TurinTurambar · #1 February 17th, 2005, 12:51 PM

My body in the morning tells me I'm 37.

But for some reason, my "feeling" about my self seems to hover around 17.

I just realized the other day that Van Halen's "1984" is of course over 20 years old. And that made me feel old. That was the biggest album of my highschool years.

OK, as usual we're way OT in the first page already and I think this time it's my fault.

BWAAAAAAha-ha-ha-haaaaaaaa!
Turin

luke_slovakian · #2 February 17th, 2005, 01:52 PM

COme on you guys you aren't old. I have to wake up and say damn i'm fifteen and i need surgery:-d

Azselendor · #3 February 17th, 2005, 02:17 PM

If I recall right, Star Trek was supposed to the Western in Space, IE: Wagon Train to the Stars

And StarWars was supposed to be like an Epic/Pirate/Fantasy Movie in Space.

But if you review the original concepts of the series, you'll see how the series started totalyl different.

Spock, for example, was supposed to be red and ate stuff via a metal plate in his stomach. The Klingons were supposed to be something totally different and non-humanoid race named "Trox" or something like that. And the Enterprise's missions (Yorktown originally) were supposed to travel to parellel earths. The concept was actually pretty clever since it would have made use of every existing set at the time in hollywood and require only a handful of new sets.

The concept survived in partial form into the proudction of star trek, but later served as a foundation for series like the Time Tunnel and Sliders.

Star Wars, in the original script, involved a General Luke Skywalker trying to get the brains of some scientists to clone bodies and away from the clutches of imperial capital, It started with a G, I can't remember it fully, but it reminded me of a gastro-intestinal disorder.

But to further cement WildCard's comment with something I heard at the Sci-Fi/Fantasy Writer's Guild

Nothing ever created is original. when you think you're original, then someone else already done it a hundred times before you.

RudyHuxtable · #4 February 17th, 2005, 02:54 PM

I don't want to be a party pooper but I do think the Dune/Star Wars comparison is wrong. Dune is written very much as an allegory to the problems and cultures of the current middle east. The spice is characterized by oil (which really does rule the known universe), and the Emperor is basically the British Empire, since at the time they still had a great command of the region. The Fremen are sometimes compared to the Bedouins, but it is more likely Arabs in general were the basis for the Fremen. Once the first book was written, he eschewed the original tenor a bit and made the series stranger and stranger, but nevertheless his initial inspiration was the effects of oil on the international community.

Star Wars was made with the old west in mind, and he included magic to help build his myth, since so much of our past includes tales of miracles and other "magic" occurrences.

I'll go with you on Forbidden Planet, though.

Captain Kwok · #5 February 17th, 2005, 02:58 PM

Jules Verne was certainly one of the earliest Sci-Fi pioneers.

Thermodyne · #6 February 17th, 2005, 07:17 PM

For those who have yet to read the Foundation series, do so ASAP.

For thoes who have read them, ever get the feeling that Lucas read them too.

geoschmo · #7 February 17th, 2005, 07:43 PM

I'm not sure I see any reseblance between The Forbidden Planet and Star Trek other than they are both sci-fi and both had similer visual styles. (At least if you are talking about TOS, which I assume you are.) There's not much connection in the story. Forbidden planet is also not an original story. It's a sci-fi telling of Shakespears "The Tempest". Of course Shakespear probably stole it from some Italian folk tale or something.

Here's a website that shows the connection between the two stories. LINK

rdouglass · #8 February 18th, 2005, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Thermodyne said:
For those who have yet to read the Foundation series, do so ASAP.

For thoes who have read them, ever get the feeling that Lucas read them too.

I agree completely. Also, I don't think that any movie maker that has ever read a good sci-fi book or series was NOT influenced somehow by those books.

If they never read anything than maybe it was original.

kerensky · #9 February 19th, 2005, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Thermodyne said:
For those who have yet to read the Foundation series, do so ASAP.

For thoes who have read them, ever get the feeling that Lucas read them too.

HA! You noticed this too!!! I think that most of the sci-fi stuff today is made up of stuff borowed from the early pioneers such as Verne and Asimov.

Atrocities · #10 February 17th, 2005, 09:48 PM

Quote:

RudyHuxtable said:
I don't want to be a party pooper but I do think the Dune/Star Wars comparison is wrong. Dune is written very much as an allegory to the problems and cultures of the current middle east. The spice is characterized by oil (which really does rule the known universe), and the Emperor is basically the British Empire, since at the time they still had a great command of the region. The Fremen are sometimes compared to the Bedouins, but it is more likely Arabs in general were the basis for the Fremen. Once the first book was written, he eschewed the original tenor a bit and made the series stranger and stranger, but nevertheless his initial inspiration was the effects of oil on the international community.

Star Wars was made with the old west in mind, and he included magic to help build his myth, since so much of our past includes tales of miracles and other "magic" occurrences.

I'll go with you on Forbidden Planet, though.

I agree with you 100% with the exception that Lucas was inspired by Dune. I have been listening to the series on audio cd and they share a lot of common threads.

Paul would be Obi Wan, while his son Leto, a twin no less just like Leia and Luke, turns into something like Vader, (God Emperor) as an example.

The seeing into the future, the ability to move before things happen, all of this sings of the Jedi and their force powers.

In dune the Empire is very old, as was the Rebublic in Star Wars. In Dune the Emperor had his dreaded Sadacar (sp) while in Star Wars the Emperor has his Stormtroopers.

Instead of fighting over the spice and a single planet the rebellion becomes the spice and the battle become a fight over good vs evil.

I guess you have to be in the right frame of mind to see the simularities that stood out to me. Star Wars is on its own, one of the greatest sci-fi epics of all time. To bad it was tanted with PM, a good movie that could have been far better, and by AOTC, a horrible movie that at times reminded me of Star Wars.