PPB is the best weapon in the game. Discuss.

[Phoenix-D]

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Originally posted by Dragonlord:Hi all,

After playing for a few months now, it seems to me that the PPB (Phased Polaron beam) is the best weapon by far in this game, but that it unfortunately unbalances the game. (this applies mostly to PBW multiplayer)

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That they are. I neutered them a bit in Techmod..

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Missiles are useless (as discussed in other threads) because PD is too cheap and strong.
Same for fighters.

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You need a really, REALLY large number to get through in any level of effectiveness, so yeah, you'd normally be better off with other weapons.

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Even in the late game (turn 80 upwards) I stick with PPB. I find they outgun graviton beams, rippers, and even WMG's.

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That's partially because High Energy Discharge isn't worth the research points, and is weak overall. Still, PPB Vs are almost as good as APB 12s, which is..odd.

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Numbers: don't just look at damage per kiloton ratio's, but look at damage per kiloton per combat turn. A wave-motion gun III (tough to research) has a better damage/kiloton (size) ration than a PPB, but only fires once every three turns. In three turns an enemy ship with PPB's will have done more damage than it's counterpart with WMG's. (ignore chance to hit ratios etc since that depends on sensors etc, not on weapon type).

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Actually, chance to hit DOES factor in. Why? WMGs get a to-hit bonus, PPBs do not. Still not worth it though.

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Conslusion: this is not good. It's boring for me to stick to the same weapon throughout an entire game, having found after much experimentation that other ship designs are inferior. I tried missile ships, I tried battleships with the tractor/graviton/repulser combo, etc.
The only thing that comes close is a battleship loaded with Rippers and set to point-blank strategy. Other special weapons (like bio bombs) are nice ideas but only remotely useful in the first 20 turns or so, when you can quickly infect a planet using one to three ships. Later, it's either glass em or capture em.

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Do remember that bio bombs only need one hit, and most populations reallt dislike being plagued..

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Oh while I'm at it: why would anyone bother with dreadnoughts? Battleships give the same heavy mount and have one more speed. I find dreads just slow down my fleets.

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Personally, I stop at Battlecruiser..

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Now what I'd really like to know is how range to target affects your chance to hit, and if this is different for each weapon. Where can I find more info / stats on that?

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Range is a flat 10% per square, I think. Easiest way to check is fire up tactical combat, control both sides, and check yout %s as you close (make sure to turn on display hit %s!)

Techmod lowers the High Energy Discharge to the same place as PPBs, and makes it easier to get phased shields (though normal shields are more powerful). Wham, bam, instant less-useful PPBs. I also increased the research cost for PPBs.

Phoenix-D

[CW]

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Oh while I'm at it: why would anyone bother with dreadnoughts? Battleships give the same heavy mount and have one more speed. I find dreads just slow down my fleets.

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Remember that for every ship you will need a set of bridge/CQs/LSs or MC. You will also need combat sensors, ECMs, long range jammer, self destruct device/anti-boarding parties etc. So if you have a larger hull you can fit in more firepower and spend less space (in the fleet) on "supporting" equipment. I personally don't find the slightly slower speed of a dreadnought to have much of a negative effect in my games, but I do find baseships to be too slow and yak! -40% to defense! So I only use them for non-combat and specialised roles.

[edit] Don't let me find any more typo please!

[This message has been edited by CW (edited 02 September 2001).]

[geoschmo]

I have never got bored with this game. So you have found a weapon that in a 1 on 1 ship battle would beat almost any other ship. How many times do you have 1 on 1 ship battles?

Wars in real life, and in Se4, aren't won by technology alone. Tactics, initiative, economics, logistics. All those are what keeps things interesting. And those change from player to player and game to game.

Personally I get more wrapped up in those things and often lose track of what weapons my ships have on them. Sometimes this hurts me and I end up losing a battle, or winning with heavier casualties than anticipated. But concentrating on building a strong economy, and aggresive tactics that keep your opponent reacting instead of acting, will make up for a lot of tech defecincies in the long run.

Geoschmo

[Phoenix-D]

..which still doesn't change the fact that any weapon other than PPB is really just wasting time and research in most cases.

BTW, what was up with Shrapnel earlier? I couldn't get through.

Phoenix-D

[Dragonlord]

Exactly.
I agree with both geoschmo and Phoenix.

[capnq]

There was a time when I had never researched anything bigger then a battlecruiser...

until the PBW game where I saw one of my neighbors fielding fleets of double digit numbers of baseships.

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Cap'n Q

The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the
human mind to correlate all of its contents. We live on a placid
island of ignorance in the midst of black seas of infinity, and it was
not meant that we should go far. -- HP Lovecraft, "The Call of Cthulhu"

[This message has been edited by capnq (edited 02 September 2001).]

[Rich04]

I know what you mean Capnq. And those baseships (from one race) were armed with APB XII and Phased Shields V. went around munching PPB fleets.

Then there was that other race that had smaller ships without PPB that ate PPB fleets for breakfast.


[This message has been edited by Rich04 (edited 02 September 2001).]