Proportions mod Version 2.2 released

[NAV]

see above comments

[ May 21, 2002, 20:50: Message edited by: NAV ]

[NAV]

[quote]Originally posted by PvK:
[QB]A group that has been playing Proportions multi-player LAN games on weekends has suggested removing the ability to put shipyards on medium (or larger) transport hulls, because it with the ~30% maintenance reduction, it makes a really powerful and economical mine/satellite layer in Proportions.

~ Regarding Space Yards on cheap transports, in itself is fine, even though the AI does not make good/same use as Humans do.

But us crafty human players put a sat or mine Launching bay on it and bring it to our warp point, in 2 turns we build enough mines to stop any Incursion probe, in 3 more turns we have enough built and launched to probably stop the AIs entire Incursion. 5 more turns-we have enough mines from that Mine Fabricator built and launched, to stop the AIs Attack State sending it Back to infrastructure State to rebuild and try again. In all that (if) the AI_Settings file is on (Ships don't move through minefields := false) he will never be able to re attack because those replacement ships will be piecemealed through our craftfuly built mine field, until/If the AI completes the tree to Mine tech to get Sweepers... And in the mean time we are building our strike force to purge the AI before he gets those now valued mine sweepers... and the AI is foolishly wasting his ships, if the settings were not right; go ahead check your race_AI_Settings.

Also the Mine/Sat Ship yard fabricator launcher can go to far away systems and stop atop a warp point and build 100 mines in 20 turns and for (Low tech Sats)in less then 34 turns it will build you 100 sats.
Now with 20000 units, gee why, wonder why the AI is totaly stupid and cant compete.

Normally if it was just a Mine or Sat layer it would have to go back to a planet to refill, for example: A medium transport that carries 30 mines or 12 Sats with a speed of 4 and traveled 3 systems away it would take about 8.5 turns from the planet to the warp point then 8.5 turns back for a refill that's about 17 turns for one round trip so for a standard Launcher, it would take more then 50 turns to get that 100 mines and 141 turns to place 100 sats. Also considering that a planet now is tied up making 100 sats or mines, that's a lot of planet production even for a Human Player. A tanker also has to accompany the launcher and how about that long term escort commitment ????????? I doubt this would get done casually, however a ship yard launcher with a cargo hold on a cheap transport can do this in multiple locations with only a few, with devestating results. This is fine for an all Human and Neutral game, but the AI Player can't compete with this. I suggest removeing cargo capacity from yards for the above reasons. Not to say you can't do this with a large capital ship, but this gets expensive.

I like the way Proportions now has AI Sat and Mine Layers on transport hulls as well as a host of other hull designs that modders are designing to Benifit the AI.

[ May 21, 2002, 21:07: Message edited by: NAV ]

[oleg]

Pvk,
I noticed weird design minister behaivor:
In my design file, Fighters have small meson bLaster as #1 choice and small DUC as a second option. Now, if I know sDUC but no sMB, AI designs fighter without _any_ weapon but with small shield, which is not in the design at all !
(shield per kt=0). I suspect this is because sMB weapon family number 102 is duplicated by light missile system weapon family number.

[PvK]

That's weird. I'm really swamped at present - if you have time and inclination to test it, please try changing the sMB weapon family number to something else in components.txt, and see if this changes the design.

PvK

[PDF]

Originally posted by PvK:
There is already something like this, that I'm not sure if you've noticed yet or not. The small starliner with standard bridge is the low-tech model for transporting population, and is slow and expensive and so on. With research into ship construction and/or cargo and/or starliner modules, however, you can use the "Basic Bridge," "Basic Life Support," and "Starliner Module" components, and also transport hulls will about 30% maintenance reduction, to reduce costs of pop transports. Higher levels of research allow more population to be stuffed onto ships of different sizes, too. It does take some time to develop this technology, of course.

Or did you already know about all that, and think there should be more to reduce the maintenance costs?

PvK

Thks PvK, indeed I didn't know - I play a PBW Proportion 2.1 game but never dived into 2.2 !

Anyway my idea was to generally reduce costs of Liners even without any high tech just to see faster colony development, and those low maint/combat unable comps looked right, and simpler than the "module" system. But I have to experience it more before talking again

[oleg]

Originally posted by PvK:
That's weird. I'm really swamped at present - if you have time and inclination to test it, please try changing the sMB weapon family number to something else in components.txt, and see if this changes the design.

PvK

Yes, it is an overlap in weapon family numbers that drives AI crazy.

[oleg]

PvK,

Add "Ancient Ruins" and "Planet - Change Ground Defense" to small scaners and ECM, AI makes fighters with extra engines.