OOB 066 Sweden [WIP]

[wulfir]

Formation changed


Formation................Name

049....................Arm Inf Co 63

Change removed unit 053 Pvb 301 from the AT half-platoon.
These had been added as transport for the AT-inf grg teams previously included in the formation - but Company AT plt only had Pvtgb 1111's.

NOTE: It is possible the Company AT Plt were taken away with the revised Org 63M in the early 80s and reassigned to form a AT Battalion. I have yet to find solid sources on this...

[wulfir]

New formation

Formation................Name

443.....................ArmBde AA Co 63

Company organisation:

366 20mm Lv m/40-70
569 Pltgb 903
1444 ArmBde AA Tr (New formation)
1444 ArmBde AA Tr (New formation)
1444 ArmBde AA Tr (New formation)

Notes: The armoured brigade had one Anti-Aircraft company equipped with old tractor drawn 20mm AA guns. They were not adequate for their task but supposedly the only weapon system able to follow with the same speed as the armoured brigade. In the 80s the Armoured Brigades were re-equipped with SP-SAM systems (the Lvrb 701) instead of the 20mm AA guns.

New formation

Formation................Name

444.....................ArmBde AA Tr 63

Platoon Org:

366 20mm Lv m/40-70
366 20mm Lv m/40-70
366 20mm Lv m/40-70
366 20mm Lv m/40-70
366 20mm Lv m/40-70
366 20mm Lv m/40-70
547 Agri trac towing
547 Agri trac towing
547 Agri trac towing

Notes: Armoured Brigade AA Tropp. Six 20mm AA guns drawn by tractors.

[wulfir]

- Armoured Brigade 49 -

The Armoured Brigade 49 organisation replaced the Armoured Brigade type 43 organisation which had been established during WWII. The new type 49 armoured brigade organisation doubled the number of Armoured brigades from three to six – but without adding to the overall numbers of armoured vehicles, i.e. each brigade now had less.

Previously, the Armoured Brigade 43 organisation had two tank battalions (total of 181 tanks) and an armoured infantry battalion which was now reversed – the new org 49 had each brigade equipped with one tank battalion (67 tanks) and two armoured infantry battalions.

While the infantry strength and support units for the Armoured Brigades were increased, including mortars and artillery, as each brigade needed its own complement, the new organisation meant weaker brigades. The number of infantry battalions grew from three to twelve – without any increase in the numbers of APCs which meant the armoured infantry was not particualry armoured but had to make do with bicyles. This lack of armoured protection and mobility for the majority of the infantry of the Armoured Brigade was a severe drawback.

OOB:

- Armoured Brigade HQ with HQ Company
- Tank Battalion
- Armoured Infantry Battalion
- Armoured Infantry Battalion
- Armoured Special Company
- Tank Destroyer Company
- Armoured Artillery Battalion
- Armoured Mortar Company
- Armoured Anti-Aircraft Company
- Armoured Anti-Aircraft Company
- Armoured Engineer Company
- Armoured Supply Group

[wulfir]

- Tank Battalion 49 -

OOB

- Tank Bn HQ
- Tank Bn HQ Coy
…..........................Coy HQ
…..........................Communication Plt
…..........................Recce Tropp (3 Motorcycle Recce Sections)
…..........................Tank Tropp (2 light tanks, 1 heavy tank)
…..........................Pioneer Tropp (2 Pioneer sections armed with Raketgevär (Rocket AT), 2 Tgb m/42 KP Armoured Personell Carriers)
…..........................Coy Supply



- Light Tank Company
…..........................Coy HQ (incl. Tank Tropp with 2 light tanks, 1 heavy tank, Medical section, Staff element)
…..........................Light tank Plt (4 light tanks)
…..........................Light tank Plt (4 light tanks)
…..........................Heavy tank Plt (4 heavy tanks)
…..........................Storm Pioneer Tropp (2 Storm Pioneer Sections, 2 Tgb m/42 APCs).
…..........................Company Supply

- Light Tank Coy (same as above)

- Heavy Tank Coy
…..........................Coy HQ (incl Heavy Tank Tropp with 3 heavy tanks, medical sec, Staff element).
…..........................Heavy Tank Platoon (3 Heavy tanks)
…..........................Heavy Tank Platoon (3 Heavy tanks)
…..........................Heavy Tank Platoon (3 Heavy tanks)
…..........................Heavy Tank Platoon (3 Heavy tanks)
…..........................Storm Pioneer Tropp (2 Storm Pioneer Sections, 2 Tgb m/42 APCs).
…..........................Coy Supply

- ”Följekompani” (this term is hard to translate, litteraly it would mean something like ”Tag-along Company”)
…..........................Coy HQ (Staff Element, Medical Element)
…..........................”Följe” Platoon (3 Sections of each 8 men with 1 Tgb m/42 APC and 1 single 8 cm Mortar)
…..........................”Följe” Platoon (same as above)
…..........................”Följe” Platoon (same as above)
….......................... Close Anti-Tank Platoon (3 Sections of each 10 men with 1 Tgb m/42 APC and 3 Granatgevär AT-weapons).
…..........................Coy Supply

- Tank Supply Company
…..........................Coy HQ
…..........................Ammo Element
…..........................Repair Element
…..........................Fuel Element
…..........................Food Element
…..........................Medical Element
…..........................Pioneer Tropp (2 Sections of 9 mean each, 2 Tgb m/42 – the name of this unit is apparently never changed to Storm Pioneer).
…..........................Coy Supply




During the existance of the 49 org formations the Pioneer Tropp is renamed Stormpioneer Tropp and the Pioneer Sections are renamed Stormpioneer sections – except for the Pioneers found in the supply company (who also lacks Rg AT weapons). The Tgb m/42 is also equipped with twin m/36 AAMG. Exaclty when these changes come into effect can as far as I know not be determined.

In the Swedish terminology ”Tropp” is an element usually somewhat larger than a section but smaller than a platoon. I'm not sure if there is a corresponding English term? The above mentioned Pioneer/Stormpioneer Tropp exists in the regular OOB066 under the name ”StormPi Trp”. In Sweden ”Tropp” is shortened ”To”. Would using ”Trp” for this type of element be confusing – in game it would be a weak platoon...?

My ambition is to include the fighting elements of the HQ and Supply Companies in a type of Armoured Battalion Support Company formation, which would then include:

Company HQ unit
Recce Tropp
Tank Tropp
Storm Pioneer Tropp
Pioneer Tropp

The tanks equipping these battalions were initially of WWII vintage and obsolete allready by the end of WWII. The light tanks were the Swedish version of a Czech's tank used by the Germans as PzKwf 38(t) – they were later rebuilt as APCs – the Pbv301. The heavier tanks were the Swedish design Strv m/42, armed with a largely inadequate short 75mm gun. They were later to be upgrade with a new turret and a longer and more powerful 75mm weapon – the Strv 74.

Sweden was at this time looking for a foreign and more capable tank. It was hoped that the British Centurion would be possible to purchase, but the response from London was not particulary positive. A small number of tanks could maybe be made available to Sweden sometime after 1958. The French AMX-13 was instead choosen for trials. Then a sort of trade imbalance between Sweden and Great Britain led to a British surprise offer of selling Centurion tanks. The first arrived in May 1953. This decision irritated the French and a high ranking Swedish officer, the army commander Ehrensvärd, who figured the lower price of the AMX-13 would have yielded more tanks. The AMX-13 was again considered but in the end Sweden went for moderninsing the older m/42 tank. A large number of French 155mm howitzers was bought as a sort of compensation for the failure of the AMX deal. The gun was in Swedish service named Haubits F, and nicknamed ”Fransyskan” (roughly ”The French Lady”) - it was later to be used by the artillery units of the armoured brigades.

[dmnt]

Originally Posted by wulfir

In the Swedish terminology ”Tropp” is an element usually somewhat larger than a section but smaller than a platoon. I'm not sure if there is a corresponding English term? The above mentioned Pioneer/Stormpioneer Tropp exists in the regular OOB066 under the name ”StormPi Trp”. In Sweden ”Tropp” is shortened ”To”. Would using ”Trp” for this type of element be confusing – in game it would be a weak platoon...?

I believe it is what Finns call puolijoukkue, "half-a-platoon." The Swedish wikipedia entry says "Oftast motsvarande en halv pluton eller 2-3 grupper." Maybe tropp could be translated as subplatoon or half platoon?

In my experience the non-fighting platoons such as supply platoons add little to gaming experience if at all. Game mechanics (AI especially) seems to be working better when SPAA-units are not mingled among tank platoons but bought separately. AI does not understand what it is buying as well as a human does. In this game some realism is sacrificed for playability.

For real world level of realism, check out this game

[wulfir]

Originally Posted by dmnt

Maybe tropp could be translated as subplatoon or half platoon?

Maybe...

[Suhiir]

Originally Posted by dmnt

For real world level of realism, check out this game

I played that game during the 1991 beta test, can't say it's changed much.

[wulfir]

- Armoured Infantry Battalion 49 -

HQ

- Bn HQ Coy
….................Communications Plt
….................Recce Plt (2 APC, 1 light vehicle, 1 Jägartropp of two 9 men sections, 1 Jägartropp of two 9 men sections with bikes, Armoured Car Tropp (two m/40 armoured cars)
….................Company Supply

- Armoured Infantry Company
….................Coy HQ (1 APC, Close AT Section (grg) with bikes.
….................Arm Inf Plt (3 Sections, 1 Spt Section with bikes)
….................Arm Inf Plt (same as above)
….................Arm Inf Plt (same as above)
….................Support Plt (MG-Tropp of two MG Sections with bikes, Mortar Tropp with two 8cm Mortars, one truck and a FOO Team)
….................Company Supply

- Armoured Infantry Company (same as above)
- Armoured Infantry Company (same as above)

- Armoured Support Company
….................Coy HQ (incl Truck)
….................Anti-Tank Tropp (1 APC, Close Anti-Tank Section, 1 Armoured Car, StormPioneer Section with 10 men and another APC).
….................Anti-Tank Tropp (same as above)
….................Infantry Gun Platoon (4 Infantry Guns, 2 Tgb m/42L)
….................Mortar Plt (FOO Section, 3 Mortars, 3 trucks)
….................Storm Pioneer Platoon (2 APCs, 3 StormPi Sections)
….................Company Supply

- Armoured Supply Company
….................Coy HQ
….................Ammunition Element
….................Repairs Element
….................Fuel Element
….................Food Element
….................Medical Element
….................Coy Supply


This organisation, with its lack of adequate numbers of APCs, had about the same level of protection and mobility as leg infantry units. It is a curious development that did continue into the next organisation, the Armoured Brigade 58...

[shahadi]

[quote=dmnt;828233]

Originally Posted by wulfir

In my experience the non-fighting platoons such as supply platoons add little to gaming experience if at all. Game mechanics (AI especially) seems to be working better when SPAA-units are not mingled among tank platoons but bought separately. AI does not understand what it is buying as well as a human does. In this game some realism is sacrificed for playability.

What I've played with, to simulate realism, is to coax the AI into attacking Supply units, etc, by dramatically increasing their cost value from say 20 for a truck to 520. Now with this cost premium the player must defend the non-fighting units because the AI will go after those targets.

-------

[scorpio_rocks]

Originally Posted by shahadi

What I've played with, to simulate realism, is to coax the AI into attacking Supply units, etc, by dramatically increasing their cost value from say 20 for a truck to 520. Now with this cost premium the player must defend the non-fighting units because the AI will go after those targets.

Does this actually work? Does the AI make targeting choices based on target cost? or will it target the unit that is more of a threat?, closer?, easiest to kill?, in its target priority (ie inf v inf, AT v Tank, etc)?