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  #21  
Old July 28th, 2010, 11:17 AM
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Default Re: River crossing battle tactics

A few years back, I designed a series of hypothetical scenarios of a Chinese vs SEATO/NATO comflict in Korea during 2020. My main purpose was to examine Sino military capability for the near future. I saved the ones that were fun and one of those was a night river crossing by Italian Lagunari Rangers and Tuscania Commandos.

Since it was for my own play, the scenario doesn't have a description but if you would like to try it, I'll shoot it to you.
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  #22  
Old July 28th, 2010, 11:39 AM
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Default Re: River crossing battle tactics

Quote:
So "Imp's firewall" is a limited usage tactic, but possibly useful in the right circumstances.
I have found it very effective with most terrain TI units tend to be back from the river bank so can deny them sight or change the anty by making them move. Difficult to guess LOS with fire & smoke so set yours up covering where he might move for & start piling everyone else in the water while hitting the far bank with conventional arty.
If you are lucky can hit infantry fairly near to the bank & deny LOS to places further back with the same volley, couple of strikes & your window has opened.
If you have them now is a good time to send in the planes as his armour might be on the move so easier to detect plus may give you some idea of which way to break out once you are over.
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  #23  
Old July 28th, 2010, 12:04 PM
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Default Re: River crossing battle tactics

Quote:
Originally Posted by Graeme View Post
Would be nice to have the extra firepower, I checked after what Imp said, I think he means the Smerch MRL 300mm with 90 kill 12 warhead, I have a M1991 240mm 43/9 .

Would be a shame to lessen the Pokpung ho as its quite formidable but if its for realism then fair play.

Its the only tank that can take a hit and has decent vision. But its expensive and I have only got 4, having built up the force with the leftover repair points, I used Harder to simulate the lack of spares and NK economy. The Chonma Hos have a decent gun but get ripped apart with one shot from a K1 and the light tanks are only for ranged infantry fighting if there is no anti tank around.

Its been a good game, a bit of a challenge. Its all infantry like you say with the Light inf being my favourite all round unit. Basically I use plenty of arty, then light inf and just use rifle sections to hold ground and the Fagot ATGM. The snipers with 40 vision are useful and Im a big fan of the Koksan SPA. Tanks are just used to peep over the hill when the enemy is suppressed and have a crack at their armor. Using the Hinds and Paras to terrorise the enemy arty behind the lines.

Ive had 5 battles so far against US and SK, all marginal victories.
That because the P'okpoong-ho was, at least to the public, an unknown quantity until few months ago; little was known except that the NKs supposedly had a new tank.
The RUMINT had it as a T-72 derivative, but some pictures of it have finally emerged: it appears nothing more than a Ch'onma-Ho with extra armor, some automotive changes and perhaps some limited FC update. Still it has no TI and gun still seems to be only a 115mm.
In the previous versions of the game there used to be several high tech toys such as T-80Us, BMP-3s, various assorted vehicles with TI etc. but these have been eliminated because the NKs never actually had them (it is only South Korea which does operate T-80Us), as far as one can be sure about anything when it comes to a place like that.
Infantry based units with TI have been left, under the reasoning that sort of stuff is cheaper to buy, easier to smuggle around and a thermal camera in the hands of SF/recon/FO is more likely to cause damage than inside some old tank which is going to die under cluster bombs or shot to pieces.
Of course one cannot be 100% sure but it is know they do some shopping for their SF equipment, IIRC a shipment of foreign made sniper rifles for their SFs was intercepted not a long time ago.
The north koreans have been emphasizing infantry, special forces and mobile artillery in an ever increasing manner in the last decades, because it is the best bang they can get out of their very few bucks. Nukes too, but that's outside the scope of the game.
I was also thinking that the NK SFs could use some improvements, but details on organization are sketchy and contradictory, though Bermudez is publishing some useful articles on a monthly basis.
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  #24  
Old July 29th, 2010, 06:14 AM

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Default Re: River crossing battle tactics

I read in a few different sources, wiki, globalsecurity.org on the net that it may have some systems from a T-90 as they may have got one as a gift and can try to reverse engineer some systems. I believe around 10 years ago a couple of companies here in Czech Rep and Slovakia were helping them get parts for their tanks and planes as they fly Albatros' which were built near Prague and Slovakia still services Soviet era tanks I believe. Someone should have a word with Kim so we can have some accurate info for our game.


The fire smoking out the enemy TI/Vision seems a good tactic and Im seeing it in action now as Im defending a town, but with arty and everything else at a premium for NK its a bit of afterthought. I need it more for defending from infantry and countering their arty then as a screen, it usually gets a bit desperate at the end of a battle defending the hexes and the arty is needed there.
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  #25  
Old July 29th, 2010, 03:08 PM
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Default Re: River crossing battle tactics

Quote:
Originally Posted by Graeme View Post
I read in a few different sources, wiki, globalsecurity.org on the net that it may have some systems from a T-90 as they may have got one as a gift and can try to reverse engineer some systems. I believe around 10 years ago a couple of companies here in Czech Rep and Slovakia were helping them get parts for their tanks and planes as they fly Albatros' which were built near Prague and Slovakia still services Soviet era tanks I believe. Someone should have a word with Kim so we can have some accurate info for our game.
They may have purchased a T-90 but as far as reverse engineering...Just look at the size of the laser rangefinders they make. It might give them some ideas on things like armor arrays, layout and the odd subsystem here and there but they aren't going to be able to copy much; this especially as most of their R&D is focused elsewhere. They can't hope to match SK armor and things are only going to get worse as the K2 tanks start to roll out and the assembly lines and M48s begins to be phased out in the next future, and they probably realize that. Purchasing spares for old soviet era gears is something they are known to do. Occasionally they even buy whole weapon systems: they bought a dozen or two of BTR-80A from Russia, surplus MiG-21bis from Kazakhstan etc. But meaningful quantities of high tech stuff are simply outside the scope of their finances.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Graeme View Post
The fire smoking out the enemy TI/Vision seems a good tactic and Im seeing it in action now as Im defending a town, but with arty and everything else at a premium for NK its a bit of afterthought. I need it more for defending from infantry and countering their arty then as a screen, it usually gets a bit desperate at the end of a battle defending the hexes and the arty is needed there.
You can always use ammo resupply. In real life they are supposed to have a pretty generous ammunition allotment, up to 480 rounds per tube stored forward.
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  #26  
Old July 29th, 2010, 03:56 PM
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Default Re: River crossing battle tactics

The discussion of this particular NK tank is rather swerving away from the thread topic. If any more discussion is needed on the subject, I think you should best start a new thread on it (or use an existing Korean kit one?) over in the TO&E forum.

Cheers
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  #27  
Old August 2nd, 2010, 11:05 AM
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Default Re: River crossing battle tactics

Just remembered what is most likely a cheat but so tempting I have used if terrain allows. The big hovercraft Russia USA possibly others can just fit a barge carrier in them meaning quick transportation to near the river
If you have managed to clear out AT weaponry & the river is wide the hovers are then great at spotting units on the far bank just stick a squad in them & go for a look. Big target though so stay out of RPG range.
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  #28  
Old August 22nd, 2010, 01:54 PM

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Default Re: River crossing battle tactics

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mobhack View Post
The AI is a static defender - so an attacker without TI can use terrain masking to some effect. But I really would not like to play vs a human defender with such a key advantage. He will manoeuvre to get good fields of view/fire where the AI will sit and twiddle his thumbs. Human defender will know if an area of the river bank is 'masked' - and pepper it with arty on principle too.
I think the AI is in general quite good/ok if you consider the variety of situations it has to cope with.

Any chance that we see improvements in some areas (like the mentioned 'static' defense') in the future? Perhaps just make it more unpredictable - it doesn't have to be a master mind .
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