APC Development and related topics.

[FASTBOAT TOUGH]

A couple of "tail end charlies" that are an extension of the previous post. For me thank god, are FYI issues. The BRADLEY BUSK III one for Don will be of some use as we have a "full on" picture to use for ICON purposes. Sorry I missed these but it's the "vampire hours" I keep after work normally.

1. BRADLEY BUSK III...
http://www.armyrecognition.com/july_...t_1007126.html
If you missed it in the first refs provided earlier, you'll have noticed the first units equipped with them were in S. Korea. Don unless you see something I missed, it appears USA UNITS 305 & 899 will just need to be renamed, protection upgraded and require a new icon for one or both units and I hear you that's enough work!?!
ASSIGN REMINDER # in PP.

2. More on the USMC "Everything Future APC Amphib Program" or EFAAP. This is team BAE/IVECO with the SUPERRAV 8x8.
http://www.armyrecognition.com/may_2...d_1005131.html
If you haven't noticed, click on the yellow highlighted for links to the data sheets for the equipment and other info.
Gotta go, GOT is coming on! Day off priorities don't you know!?!

Regards,
Pat

[sabresandy]

Thanks for the information! It's nice to find a clearinghouse for the news from the defense industry.

I'd like to bring up some issues with the Russian APCs and IFVs in their OBAT, which is obat11. Patch 7.0 did a nice job of trimming out some of the cancelled BTR-90 variants; I'd like to take it a few steps further. First, let's look at the many MT-LB mods. Specifically, OBAT11 numbers 213 (MT-LBM-6M1A3), 332 (MT-LBM-6M1B2), 800 (MT-LBM-6MA), 801 (MT-LBM-6MB), and for that matter 872 (MT-LBM). To the best of my knowledge, these vehicles showed up once at an arms expo, and were promptly never heard from again. I find no reports of any of the MT-LB modifications actually coming into service.

Likewise, there are a number of programs that never seem to have taken off: they are units number 305 (BTR-70M), 787 (BMP-2 Berezhok), 788 (BMP-2M), 850 (BMP-2M (-)), and the heavy APCs 343-345 (all the BTR-Ts). While I believe the BMP-T is on order by the Russian army, I find no indication that the BTR-T is actually being produced. The rest, the BMP and BTR modification programs, appear to exist only in advertisements; the Russians don't look like they've bought off on them.

Pending confirmation, so far as it's possible with Russian military equipment, I think it's fair to delete all of these from the OBAT for Russia and for the RED force (wherever they overlap).

[DRG]

Originally Posted by sabresandy

Thanks for the information! It's nice to find a clearinghouse for the news from the defense industry.

I'd like to bring up some issues with the Russian APCs and IFVs in their OBAT, which is obat11. Patch 7.0 did a nice job of trimming out some of the cancelled BTR-90 variants; I'd like to take it a few steps further. First, let's look at the many MT-LB mods. Specifically, OBAT11 numbers 213 (MT-LBM-6M1A3), 332 (MT-LBM-6M1B2), 800 (MT-LBM-6MA), 801 (MT-LBM-6MB), and for that matter 872 (MT-LBM). To the best of my knowledge, these vehicles showed up once at an arms expo, and were promptly never heard from again. I find no reports of any of the MT-LB modifications actually coming into service.

Likewise, there are a number of programs that never seem to have taken off: they are units number 305 (BTR-70M), 787 (BMP-2 Berezhok), 788 (BMP-2M), 850 (BMP-2M (-)), and the heavy APCs 343-345 (all the BTR-Ts). While I believe the BMP-T is on order by the Russian army, I find no indication that the BTR-T is actually being produced. The rest, the BMP and BTR modification programs, appear to exist only in advertisements; the Russians don't look like they've bought off on them.

Pending confirmation, so far as it's possible with Russian military equipment, I think it's fair to delete all of these from the OBAT for Russia and for the RED force (wherever they overlap).

I am still digging into this and some details are clear and others .....not so clear but I DO find references to the BTR-70M.

http://www.armyrecognition.com/russi...res_video.html

indicates that vehicle exists

BTR-70M: Modernized version with turret, diesel engine and rear hull section of the BTR-80.

The BTR-T though does seem to be a concept no one has wanted. The best I could find was........" state-run production association developed and manufactured a prototype of the BTR-T"

I am happy to remove things especially in that OOB as there aren't a lot of free spaces left for legitimate additions but I'm hesitant to rip things out without digging further..especially things like the BTR-70M


Don

[FASTBOAT TOUGH]

The BTR-T is shown below...
http://www.military-today.com/apc/btr_t.htm
http://www.army-guide.com/eng/product1021.html
Now that there's some info for others to look at...The concept was developed in ~1997 based on the need that arose from the Checeyan campaign where Russias weaknesses were exposed in the APC/IFV vehicles used at the time. Prototypes were built, but as ref 1 above shows the "Entered Service" block is blank for a reason from this primarly Russian source. Isreal also ran a similiar development program at about the same time and I believe so did the Ukraine. Companies are still ofering this conversion as it is estimated there are as many as a 100,000 T-55
tanks world wide which of course includes foriegn manufactured ones as well. Russia would look into the concept with the T-72 and T-90 hulls as well but these were never fielded ethier. However as I've posted already, you will see or there are plans to have an IFV based on the ARMATA tank. These will be designed and built from the ground up though as opposed to being a modification.

The BTR-70M RUNNING OUT OF TIME but...
Russia has them basically added 4 smoke dischagers per side, has a single engine from the BTR-80 vice two GAZ ones as you've noted. Ref is proof of life for the type. Aberbyzan (Sorry for spelling.) ordered modified ones (130) using South African turret/FCS. If you need more I'll give it to you later-I need some sleep.
http://en.ria.ru/video/20110926/167136762.html

Regards,
Pat

[FASTBOAT TOUGH]

BTR-70M...
There are so many mods out there it'll make your head spin!! They gotem. Ref 1 added because he's very through especially dealing with "hard to find" items. I've crossed referenced different equipment issues many times against his info with no problems over the years.
http://www.pmulcahy.com/wheeled_apcs...eeled_apcs.htm
http://www.army-guide.com/eng/produc...18&printmode=1
http://www.minotor-service.com/en/bt...0m-a1-apc.html
http://international-defence-review....ri-armour.html
http://www.afv-news.com/2012/10/btr-70-apc/

Regards,
Pat

[DRG]

Originally Posted by FASTBOAT TOUGH

1. BRADLEY BUSK III...

If you missed it in the first refs provided earlier, you'll have noticed the first units equipped with them were in S. Korea. Don unless you see something I missed, it appears USA UNITS 305 & 899 will just need to be renamed, protection upgraded and require a new icon for one or both units and I hear you that's enough work!?!Regards,
Pat

??? Pat... why would unit 305 be involved with this at all ?


Don

[FASTBOAT TOUGH]

Don,
Simply misinterpreted Johns post in the USA OOB Thread. I thought he mentioned both units were improved with TI/GSR 50 as a "side bar" to his core issue. So in the near term, only USA UNIT 899 will need to be changed. However remember I believe initially 250-285 units were converted with the BUSK III pkg. All others are to follow but don't remember when that deadline was, except it is in the "near term". I already have info that the BRADLEY A3 will be converted (Like earlier mods.) to carry more troops. This is due to budget issues and delays in the GCV Program. So there's another slot down the road and toilet. As I've mentioned already in various posts basically is..."The new will be the old/current types modified" i.e. T-90 something anybody!?! Sorry for delay.

Added edit... These two refs combined provide an overview of the BUSK III pkg. First ref just scroll down to BUSK. Next ref was the one posted earlier for the picture and mentions BUSK III fixes not mentioned in Ref 1. None mentioned the add on armor in the picture of Ref. 2, and nor have I seen that add on armor configuration in earlier models, similiar yes, but this is something different I believe at least in coverage of the hull if nothing else. Don't you hate it when I get tired? I hear you, one more to go, so again good night.
http://www.army-technology.com/projects/bradley/
http://www.armyrecognition.com/july_...t_1007126.html

Good Night and have a great weekend everyone!

Regards,
Pat