Point Defence and Maximum Weapons Range orders

[God Emperor]

The only downside to the PD mod is that when the enemy is down to just satellites, ships armed only with missiles end up engaging the satellites with their PD at range 19 where they do minimal damage (I'm kind of prepared to accept the tradeoff at this stage).
The problem does go away once your ships are equipped with another satellite targetting weapon (and it is the fleet leader).

[ November 19, 2002, 00:25: Message edited by: God Emperor ]

[Phoenix-D]

"A possible thought I had an an interim fix to the problem was to redesign the point defence component with a much longer range but have the damage at long range as only 1pt."

Ouch. Remember that PD fires automaticly at *max* range. If you are, say, attacked by fighters, they'll fire at the 1 range and the fighters will close undamged to your ships. Missiles too, if the missile is launched at the right time.

Phoenix-D

[God Emperor]

@Phoenix-D
I take your point about PD opening up just before they can do normal damage but that can be managed somewhat by say phasing in the damage a little earlier:

Name := Point - Defense Cannons II
Description := Small mobile cannons on turrets which are used to target and destroy incoming fighters and seekers.
Pic Num := 66
Tonnage Space Taken := 20
Tonnage Structure := 20
Cost Minerals := 100
Cost Organics := 0
Cost Radioactives := 0
Vehicle Type := Ship\Base\Sat\WeapPlat\Drone
Supply Amount Used := 0
Restrictions := None
General Group := Weapons
Family := 2005
Roman Numeral := 2
Custom Group := 0
Number of Tech Req := 1
Tech Area Req 1 := Point-Defense Weapons
Tech Level Req 1 := 2
Number of Abilities := 1
Ability 1 Type := Point-Defense
Ability 1 Descr :=
Ability 1 Val 1 := 0
Ability 1 Val 2 := 0
Weapon Type := Point-Defense
Weapon Target := Ftr\Sat\Seekers\Drone
Weapon Damage At Rng := 35 35 35 35 25 15 15 15 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1
Weapon Damage Type := Normal
Weapon Reload Rate := 1
Weapon Display Type := Torp
Weapon Display := 21
Weapon Modifier := 70
Weapon Sound := pointdef.wav
Weapon Family := 6

On balance it should even itself out and the benefit of not having ships closing all the time is much greater. Currently ships fly towards the missiles and fighters rather than attempting to hold off.

[ November 19, 2002, 01:54: Message edited by: God Emperor ]

[Rexxx]

God Emperor:
In my maximum weapon range strategy I have

Use Type Priority First := False

the priority numbers for seekers are 13 and 14.

all "don't fire on" toggles are set to "False".

Did some tests yesterday including PvK's suggestion. Can confirm your statement, found no difference between the toggles on and off.
The ships didn't go for missiles in both cases, most of the time they tried to stay as far as possible from their opponents. Well, most of the time. In some turns - during reload - they didn't move at all or only one or two sectors away from the enemy (5 were possible).
Will test a strategy consisting of maximum range and don't get hurt, maybe the results become clearer.

[ November 19, 2002, 08:25: Message edited by: Rexxx ]

[God Emperor]

SJ,
Just two things:

1) Does the 0 damage setting prevent triggering of PD? (havent tried it myself yet),
2) My proposal to phase in damage was intended to try and average out the effects of ships at different distances and fighters/seekers of differing speeds. I take your point about the possibility of ships not protecting themselves from hits but as an arm chair admiral, I'm not so much concerned about individual ships but more with the performance of the fleet as a whole. If a ship sacrifices itself for another, so be it. My only concern is with regard to the "to hit" chances at the longer distances.

Anyway, I'm about to start a new game with the PD mod in effect and will provide feedback on what effect it has on the "strength" of point defence (the battles I have witnessed so far have unfolded ok but I want to witness one with more units of multiple types in it).

Regards,

GE

[ November 19, 2002, 13:22: Message edited by: God Emperor ]

[Suicide Junkie]

If a ship sacrifices itself for another, so be it.

No,no. This ship would be wasting its PD shots by attacking for 1 damage, at a missile on the other side of the fleet (IE: 15 squares away), instead of shooting the missile right beside it for 35 damage.

Having a zero-damage at range X prevents the weapon from firing.
You can mod weapons that have a minimum range this way

[God Emperor]

SJ,
But on other occaisions the ship would be firing and scoring (reduced) damage when it would not currently be able to do so.

Anyway, the 0 damage option is the best way ahead and I'll road test it instead.
Thanks for the info. Will get back with the results.

Regards,

GE

[Gryphin]

What happens if you have on the ship: 1 long range direct fire weapon that fires every turn?

[Suicide Junkie]

I take your point about PD opening up just before they can do normal damage but that can be managed somewhat by say phasing in the damage a little earlier:

Instead, what you can do is set a no-fire zone.

Weapon Damage At Rng := 35 35 35 35 35 35 35 35 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1

Now the only problem occurs in fleet battles, where you have many missiles at widely varying ranges from your ship. One of the missiles going for your distant wingman might trigger your PD just before the missiles locked on you hit.

[God Emperor]

SJ,
Your idea regarding the use of 0 damage in the intervening ranges does work.
I have watched several large battles and the AI ships will standoff whilst firing, whilst the PD does only fire when it can do damage.

Can you let Aaron, Richard etc know to include the alteration in the next patch - it vastly improves the AI's performance in combat (check it out for yourself).
I think I'll even run my next game using strategic rather than tactical combat mode for the first time in over 18 months!

Regards,

GE