TC Spring & Autumn more Chariots mod

[Keir Maxwell]

I've been practising my skills at customising the unit graphics and I've modded T'ien C'hi Spring and Autumn replacing the lightly armed guy with a glaive with a lesser noble in a chariot.

The Lesser Noble has their own .tga with a Spear - one standing, one attacking - and I've done a bit of work on the Noble to make him stand out a bit more from the Lesser Nobles.

The question is what cost for the Lesser Nobles? They have -1 to mor, att, def and lose the falchion for a spear (may make it a long spear). They are not a commander so that makes them cheaper. I put in 55gcost 35rcost simply because I had to put something in.

What does the commander attribute cost? Advice appreciated.

cheers

Keir

[Arralen]

Why putting in a unit at all? Or at least, another chariot?

I think all what T'C-S&A needs is a cheap castle, so you can build those chariots everywhere ... and you don't need at mod for that. Do you really need more than 4..8 chariots in one army?

What the theme is lacking are support troops for the chariots .. riders or infantry that can keep up with them and prevent them from being ganged upon.

But thinking about it, wasn't that a very common historical problem with chariots, especially those which where designed to "trampled" into enemy ranks?

And adding a lance/spear to them makes things even worse - what IS lacking from the chariot commanders is the ability to repell attacks. You have to put at least a stinger in their hands for that, but with your mod one get everything -not for free, but at a discount price :
- the ability to repel
- (some) safety from being closed in
- front line of trampling, highly-armored troops with high tactical and strategical mobility

I found that the chariots do quite well if decked out with low-level fire resistance gear. Drive them right through the friendly fire of the Demons of Heavenly Fire, right over the remaining enemies. Nothing much left what may route afterwards

Reminds me of some test the British did in North Africa: Driving the Cruiser (?) Tank through 3" arty fire (HE). They found it worked quite well - the arty did a great job in surpressing enemy infantry, but worst what could happen to a tank was immmobilization.

A.

[Keir Maxwell]

Originally posted by Arralen:
Why putting in a unit at all? Or at least, another chariot?

I, like a number of other posters, was dissapointed that the Spring and Autumn theme got so few chariots and really struggles to use them. Historically S&A Chinese used quite a high number of shock chariots (4 horse 3-4 crew) and so allowing more than commmanders is a way of playing the theme more like a chariot army as it was historically. Plus chariots are fun - really fun. Having chariots on guard commmander while your Noble risks his life (they do die alot) is hugely fun. Chariots are also the only thing that can keep up with a trampling chariot commander as everything else gets blocked off by enemy.

Chariot warriors used spears, javelins or bows(Lances very exceptionally) - weapons with reach not falchions. I'm just trying to be historical not indulge in a lolly scramble. I see no problem with increasing the syncronicity (the quality of interaction between the parts) of a weak and disjointed theme.

Never fear I will play test it for balence and the bottom line is all I have to do is make them cost more if they are too good - because they are not that good. Direct damage spells massacre these expensive dudes in chariots. Anyone for Xbows? Chariots are an expensive and vunerable weapon system - as they should be. They are also scary due to their trample - as they should be. A heavy chariot charge would have been truly devestating and considering the vast expensense in building, training, and maintaining these weapon systems it is reasonable to assume they were fairly effective.

Anyway I've gone and stuck a back banner (plus lotsa tasseles) on the Nobles chariot to help him stand out from the Lesser Nobles - the back banner has a skull on the top.

I'm considering redoing the Nobles graphic some more and giving him a long spear as a falchion is a really unsuitable weapon to use from a chariot due to lack of reach. The spears with penants look really cute and will make the Noble stand out even more.

I'm also thinking of doing a 2 man chariot shown from a slight angle above so you can see both horse. I'll keep you informed.

I've reduced chariots to size 4 as having them trample giants seems a bit much - I think the chariot would come off just as bad if not worse. This also allows a little interpenertration with infantry which is fine when you consider the historical practice of most chariot armies of using some form of chariot runners to support their chariots.

Cheers

Keir