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  #1  
Old April 22nd, 2009, 04:04 AM

Viajero Viajero is offline
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Default Counter against Agartha's Marble Oracles?

I know this is a rock/paper/scissors kind of game so I am sure there is a counter to Marble Oracles.

Any ideas? I am playing with MA Ermor (research levels currently at around 5-6) so if those ideas can be applied by MA Ermor, even better.

The Marble Oracles that I am dealing with in particular, additionally carry boots of behemoth and protection bracers etc.

The thing is that they seem to be all around perfect units:
80+ HP, 22+ prot, 50 moral, 16 base magic resistance (!!! with a few buffs or a good bless this can easily be increased to almost 20!!!), 22 str... the only weakness seem to be a relatively low attack at 12 but with the said behemoth boots or a decent weapon the problem is solved. On top of it they are sacred units benefiting from bless etc etc

They are mindless, lifeless, stone being and magic. I know there are some spells to hurt just magic beings but they do not seem to hurt much... at least at levels 5-6 of research which is where we are + or - at the moment.

I was planning to use my Banes (overall good protection, defense and atack) against them but not sure now as they might get just trampled by the boots?

any other weakness you guys may know of I can exploit? Would paralyze work (although with those 16+ magic resistance levels not sure how productive...)

Last edited by Viajero; April 22nd, 2009 at 04:11 AM..
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  #2  
Old April 22nd, 2009, 04:15 AM

Kuritza Kuritza is offline
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Default Re: Counter against Agartha's Marble Oracles?

They are magic beings and constructs, so elf bane axes, smashers etc are your friends here - equip some counter-thugs. (Bane lords, for example)
MR 16 is not that great; set up a (reverse) communion and spam control and opposition. In CBM control and opposition are also easier to cast/research, making contstructs much more vulnerable to mind-affecting astral spells than undead/demon thugs (which is ridiculous, but that's another story).
As a desperate measure, make some mr-penetrating items (spell focus, eye of the void), put these on your h3 priests (I believe MA Ermor has them) and just spam smite. Maybe set up a communion beforehand. I am not sure just how effective that may be, but if you send a BIG communion with penetrating trinkets, you have a chance to stop these Oracles. After all, they are rather expensive.
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Old April 22nd, 2009, 04:23 AM

Viajero Viajero is offline
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Default Re: Counter against Agartha's Marble Oracles?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuritza
They are magic beings and constructs, so elf bane axes, smashers etc are your friends here - equip some counter-thugs. (Bane lords, for example).
Wouldnt Bane Lords also get trampled by the boots of behemoths these opracles are carrying?
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Old April 22nd, 2009, 04:27 AM
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JimMorrison JimMorrison is offline
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Default Re: Counter against Agartha's Marble Oracles?

As Ermor, you want to spam Nether Bolts or Nether Darts at them until they are Feebleminded. This reduces MR by 5. It's evil, and it works, and I hate it. Once that is accomplished, destroy at will with your favorite anti-construct spells.

If the Nether Bolt doesn't Feeblemind like the Darts (I can't recall for sure, never use it!), then some Black Bows can do the job just the same, and are cheap to produce.
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Old April 22nd, 2009, 04:34 AM

Viajero Viajero is offline
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Default Re: Counter against Agartha's Marble Oracles?

Which ones are the anti-construct spells? I read above "control" and "opposition"?
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Old April 22nd, 2009, 04:49 AM
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Default Re: Counter against Agartha's Marble Oracles?

Shatter, E3 Alt 5, is construct-only.


Could the marble oracle kill a tough size 6 unit, such as a Behemoth?

Casting magic-resistance-negates spells doesn't work against high-mr units every time, but the trick is using spells that HURT when they get through, and casting them until that happens. Soul Slay only has to get through once...
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Old April 22nd, 2009, 05:44 AM

Viajero Viajero is offline
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Default Re: Counter against Agartha's Marble Oracles?

Would Paralyze work against Marble Oracles? or is just for living units or units with a mind?
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Old April 22nd, 2009, 05:52 AM

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Default Re: Counter against Agartha's Marble Oracles?

Trampling is a lousy attack. I think it has only attack 10. So high defense helps a lot. Also luck and eternalness. Give your bane a good shield to boost his defense (gold shield - 9 parry, shield of the accursed - 11 parry) and couple him with an astral mage to cast luck and body ethereal on him. Also give him ring of regen to heal those 1hp damage hits he'll get from trampling.
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Old April 22nd, 2009, 07:35 AM
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Default Re: Counter against Agartha's Marble Oracles?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Psycho View Post
Trampling is a lousy attack. I think it has only attack 10. So high defense helps a lot. Also luck and eternalness. Give your bane a good shield to boost his defense (gold shield - 9 parry, shield of the accursed - 11 parry) and couple him with an astral mage to cast luck and body ethereal on him. Also give him ring of regen to heal those 1hp damage hits he'll get from trampling.
If anyone's interested in the workings of trample, read manual page 57. I think at least the damage-dealing parts of it are true. I wasn't quite sure of the details myself, I had to check it out after reading Psycho's post.

If the Marble Oracles don't start with the blindness tag, they need their eye to see. Take that away, and they're suddenly att0 def0.
Vision's Foe, the magical arbalest, removes one eye when it hits. Give it to a commander with high precision, preferably with N1 so he can cast Eagle Eyes. Script this commander to Fire Large.

After you manage to blind the Oracle, stop the trampling with few size 6 critters.
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Old April 22nd, 2009, 08:37 AM

Redeyes Redeyes is offline
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Default Re: Counter against Agartha's Marble Oracles?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Viajero View Post
Would Paralyze work against Marble Oracles? or is just for living units or units with a mind?
Sadly, it won't work because of mindless.
But you could use Stellar Cascades & Ghost Grip to great effect.

Turns out you'll need to scratch stellar cascades at least, went into a test-game to try it and it didn't work. I know it works against mindless Undead however since earlier games, it must be an effect of their lifeless tag.

Last edited by Redeyes; April 22nd, 2009 at 08:47 AM..
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