Are heavy bless strategies the best ones ?

[FrankTrollman]

Deleted.

[Huzurdaddi]

Frank did this condition apply in your victory:

However, if the four nations in good position are in the good position because they are controlled by the players with most optimized strategies, Graeme's description is totally accurate.

[KissBlade]

I find in veteran heavy games, the ones who command the largest early lead wins the game. In games where there are a mix of newbie, average and veterans, it's obviously just a toss up between which vets get luckiest.

[FrankTrollman]

Deleted.

[KissBlade]

In most veteran filled games, the games have been consistently won by the best expander. There is the occasionally fluke here and there usually caused by the two most aggressive expanders butting heads.

[FrankTrollman]

Deleted.

[Gandalf Parker]

I havent really seen this at all in MultiPlay.
Ive seen it in Solo play of course.

In face the games I remember tended to be quite the opposite. Early expansion by someone until they owned half the map, then later they ended up quite small by the end of the game. Losing or going AI even. I believe the winner was often the 3rd or 4th expansionist. But I suspect that like many people, who you are playing with can make a big difference. Playing with the same people or same type of player might give an impression that all games end up the same. I generally try not to make that assumption.

[KissBlade]

FrankTrollman said:

See, when I see veteran players in a game, I generally see them being able to mitigate this particular trend by ganging up on people who are expanding well.

Being the biggest faction is a good way to find out if you are bigger than the second and third biggest faction.

I'm sort of surprised that you could play with people who have a lot of experience who are willing to allow someone on an obvious upward power curve to go unchecked until they achieve mastery of the world. If anything, experienced players are considered wise to keep things in reserve and purposefully slow expansion in order to be able to grow in spurts that are hard to predict or counter. Gettig too far ahead is a good way to incite a worldwide alliance.

-Frank

Simply put, the fact that you are surprised suggests you don't play with enough vets. First off, ALL veterans jump start expand early. Thus the lines between "first, second and third" are very blurred. Second, you are not always in position to effect the strongest player. For example, in Dawnstrike, Jurri the winner of the game started out literally on the opposite side of my rather large empire. You can imagine the trouble it is to gang up on him. Similarly in Quick and Dead, where my nation and my two allies who all put together was 2-4th place in the game had no way of reaching Ermor who was 1st. You do not get /too/ far ahead until you are assured of your dominance. However, there are certain factors that sure makes you very sure, ex. the quad bless Mict, secure starting position, sc pretenders, etc. Simply put, experienced players who see a dominant nation with nothing but scales and a rainbow pretender, yes you'll be eaten. However, often, the rank 2-3 players are wary to give up their similarly dominant position by attacking one of the "greater powers". In these vet filled games, there is rarely ONE central power (with exceptions such as qm who is a hyper expansionist but his defensive abilities are pretty unreal), instead you have several vets who all jump start their expansions leaving the stragglers behind with their poorer starts.

Honestly, if you played "with the big names", you'll see what I mean. There is a lot of jockeying for alliances, etc, in these games. The good players DO know when to make the lunge from "just slightly ahead" to grabbing the next set of provinces.

[Gandalf Parker]

Heehee. Not to get this into a flame fest but lets tighten this down abit. Is your "big names" list:
A) regulars in the Dom3 IRC channel
B) listed in the game credits
C) frequent posters to the Dom2 forum
D) frequent posters to the Dom 3 Multiplayer and AARs forum
E) frequent posters to the Dom 3 Scenarios, Maps and Mods forum

That will give us some idea of the big name veterans you mean