Forum and manual interaction

[Endoperez]

Actually, there are still threads about how spesific in-game mechanics work. Shields against missiles? The manual formula is either incomplete or wrong, because shields aren't as good in deflecting missiles as it implies. Then there's Air Shield - does it protect from Blade Wind? What about magical aimed "missiles" like Frost Bolt? What about arrows from magical bows (it should)?

The difference is, this time we more often get the actual answers and the actual formulas, and furthermore, I think many more people are willing to use some of their time to test one of these remaining mysteries. I was proved wrong in blindly believing arrow deflection formula, and I'm very happy that happened.

[Twan]

Some basic mechanisms like the effects of temples on dominion spread, are wrong in the manual according to my games (but not exactly as in dom2, it seems in some cases -temple checks- base dominion is used, in others -pretender, capitol ?- actual dominion ; this or some temples "blip" are lost instead of spreading out of high dominion provinces). I would like to see an official page with the real formulaes.

[Kristoffer O]

I thought the manual explained the correct formulas. They are explained by Bruce in the manual as we believed they work when explaining to him. If something is strange with the spread it is not intentional.

[Twan]

Kristoffer O said:
I thought the manual explained the correct formulas. They are explained by Bruce in the manual as we believed they work when explaining to him. If something is strange with the spread it is not intentional.

So there is probably a bug.

I've made a little map file to test it (attached). The test is to be made with Arco EA.

In the west 10 Arco provinces 9 of them having a temple in the version 2, none having one in the version 1.
In the north east a group of 8 provinces (not linked with the others), 3 of them with a Arco temple.
In the south east a group of 7 Arco provinces (not linked with the others), including starting position.
An ermor capital not linked with any province (just to avoid arco immediate victory).

I've then tested using the version without temples and a dom 3 Arco pretender and the version with temples and a dom 1 Arco pretender (having a current dominion of 3 due to all the temples).

In my first test in the turn 11 the results are :

- temples in the west (v2) + dom1 pretender :
in the north-east region (temple spread) total of 3 candles.
in the south-east region (capitol+pretender spread) total of 21 candles since turn 9.
- no temples in the west (v1) + dom3 pretender :
in the north-east region total of 7 candles
in the south-east region total of 21 candles since turn 9

In a second test I have :
- in turn 5 with the natural dom 1 pretender having dom 3 due to temples, 0 candle in the north east
- in turn 11, 6 candles in the north east
- 21 candles in the south east in turn 11

- in turn 5 with a dom 3 pretender 3 candles in the north-east
- in turn 11 11 candles in the north east
- 21 candles in the south east since turn 10

It seems for temple checks a natural dom 3 dominion is about 2 times more efficient than a natural dom 1 + a sufficient number of temples to have dom 3, but capitol and pretender spread are about the same.

I couln't be 100% sure as with these low level dominions the spread is very random, so I've made a new test using a dom 8 pretender & temples and a natural dom 10 pretender. With the dom 10 pretender I have 33 candles in the north east in turn 11 (the logical +1 candle/temple/turn), with the dom 8 pretender only 20.

[calmon]

I reported this in the bug thread and i tested with 45 temples which should give a 100% increase chance with dom1. But it still gives only a ~10% chance.

Some coments from developer would be good. Its definitly not like the manual said.

Additional: Its not like the temple information in the game says. There are the same values like in the manual so its definitly a bug.

[PhilD]

Kristoffer O said:
I thought the manual explained the correct formulas. They are explained by Bruce in the manual as we believed they work when explaining to him. If something is strange with the spread it is not intentional.

Well, some time ago there was a thread about "live" testing to actually determine what the real mechanisms of dominion spread were. My suggestion was that, while it was very clear that "normal temple" checks don't get the 10% increase per 5 temples that is described in the manual, it's possible that this increase is actually true for the home province (and maybe prophets).

Maybe someone with actual access to the source code could check this?

[Folket]

I remember Kristoffer commented on the dominions spread in dominions 2. According to him, amount of temples only affects the spread from prentender, home and profets, temples was allways using start dominion.

Could be that this has not changed.

[calmon]

But then manual AND ingame 'temple info' are both wrong. The 'temple info' updates like the manual decribed, every 5 temples. With enough temples the 'temple info' shows no difference between dom1 starting and dom10 starting but in real there is a really big difference.