Conquest of Elysium 3 dev log

[Gandalf Parker]

Originally Posted by onomastikon

I still have 2 brief questions, if I may, 1 about the product and one about the distribution.

Product: Am I right in gleaning what I could from the video that the turns are not entirely simultaneous? That is, your units move around the map and only combat is processed at the end of the turn? Or is combat also not simultaneous? (It almost looked as if you could click on stuff and give orders during combat.) I mean all this is assuming that that black screen with figures on it was the combat screen. (Will there be a battlefield with terrain or is the black screen what the devs envision?)

As beta testers we are still making recommendations, and they get implemented as the developers see fit. Apparently decided on things like: if they want it in the game, if its fun to implement, or if its easy to implement, if players seem to want it. With the weight being in basically that order. Things move pretty fast and it seems best not to try to pin down absolutes yet on what they will or will not do. So I am afraid that many of the answers tend to be "as of now".

The game is turn based. Moves are made, everyone ends turns, then combat, then new turn. Allies CAN make their moves simultaneous but combat still happens after all moves. No orders are given during combat. As of now combat is black screen. (terrains are very changeable in this game so Id be surprised if the black screen changed but wont say its an absolute)

Distribution: Sorry to continue to pester you on this, I've never heard of Desura but if you all trust it, then that speaks for it. The lack of information there confuses me a bit, however. May I ask?

I have no idea. The pre-order thing came out of the blue and caught me completely off guard. I do not get the impression that Desura will be THE distributor. Especially since it doesnt seem to support Mac versions. Some other distributors are still being actively discussed. (Many seem to be rather divided between being good for the publisher, or good for the players, or good for the developer IMHO.) We do not yet know if Shrapnel is in or out, much less any whys. As far as the pricing that might have just been the developers opinion.

[ArkhanTheBlack]

What about teching? The ultimate 'core' of Dominions 3 was spell research with the goal of creating the most overpowered, broken and unbalanced super monster allowed within the rule system.
Well, there were other purposes as well, but I used it mainly for that...

Is CoE3 also about spell research? What do use your resources for?
Troops, summons, research?

[Gandalf Parker]

There is no real research or forging. You can visit a library to learn a random new spell, or you find get a scroll as combat loot which allows you to add a new spell to a mage. For equipment it tends to come as combat loot. It can be redistributed among all troops (not just commanders).

Resources are for getting more units. Some nations collect herbs for summons, some use gems to create mechanicals, some need cities to get sacrifices for summons, some need gold to recruit, some need iron to recruit more armored units or siege weapons. Most of them have multiples of the above to different amounts so no one is entirely stuck with the results of just one resource but they do tend to have obvious preferences.

In the end it is not as many optioned as Dom3. Its simpler and plays faster. But it is still varied enough to offer a lot of game. A much faster game.

[Ighalli]

Originally Posted by Gandalf Parker

Moves are made, everyone ends turns, then combat, then new turn. Allies CAN make their moves simultaneous but combat still happens after all moves.

Does that mean every team moves and then combat happens? Or does combat happen at the end of each team's turn? I'd hate to see player X acting earlier in the turn just bumping player Y's big army with a lone commander to stop them from moving on player Y's turn.

How is turn order decided? Just cyclic based on the order in the setup list?

[Edi]

In SP, combat happens at the end of the player's turn. Meaning if I play red and attack blue, that is resolved at the end of my turn. If he then attacks me, that plays at the end of his turn.

In network MP, I'm not quite sure how it happens, because if you're moving sequentially with your ally, you should be able to attack an enemy. Meaning if red and blue are allied, and red moves to attack yellow and then blue moves to attack the same stack, they attack together at the end of blue's turn but before yellow player moves.

Turn order is the color sequence. Red, blue, green, yellow, purple, teal, brown, white, which also corresponds to player numbers 0-7. It does not vary, but if you play with less than eight players, you can add all in game setup, then delete the colors you don't want from the in between slots.

[vladikus]

In COE2, if you have multiple commanders and put them all on the same spot, it gets somewhat difficult and tedious to move them together (for instance, if I want to combine a Troll King, an unexpected hero, and Mum the Troll into a single force, I have to perform three moves for each one every turn). Does COE3 have any sort of option to "link" move commands for all commanders on a square so you don't have to cycle through commanders and move them individually or perhaps a commander hierarchy in which you can make "officers" of other commanders?

[Edi]

Yes. They can be grouped and commanders can even be subordinated to others so that they vanish from the list and act like regular units. They can also be turned back to regular commanders by reversing the subordination.

[ArkhanTheBlack]

But if there's neither spell research nor building, then how does a player get more powerful?
If I start start as a Necro and can summon longdead at the start, then how could I ever beat this 'Thing of Unreason'?
Do I just summon long dead warriors until I can just overwhelm it with mass, or are there ways to get spells for more powerful summons?
And if there are, are there other ways to get them besides random locations?
Not sure if this feature will be my favourite. I never was a big fan of the random spells in HoMM.

Can I play a certain 'strategy' with a character, like trying to get big nasty summons with a necro? I also think I heard something about a Lich and/or vampire transformation.
Is this just by accidant or can I 'provoke' it?

[Edi]

There is no spell research, but there is resource accumulation. Since the AAR is going to display them fairly soon in any case (barring a savegame break), let us use Necromancer as an example:

Necromantic rituals are as follows:
- Raise Dead (no resource cost, incurs 6 points of insanity)
- Minor Summoning (20 Hands of Glory)
- Major Summoning (80 hands)
- Summon Legion (200 hands, requires Battlefield)
- Transfrom into a Vampire (125 hands, requires Old Castle)
- Ritual of Necromantic Mastery (50 for apprentice, becomes Necromancer)
- Ritual of Necromantic Mastery (150 for Necromancer, becomes Grand Necromancer)
- Transform into a Lich (250 hands, requires Temple or Ancient Temple, must be Grand Necromancer)

The major summonings from Necromancy can provide some pretty seriously powerful creatures and once you mass enough of those and preferably turn yourself into a lich, you could take it down, but expect serious losses.

As far as spell gain, all mage classes have a ritual of mastery, which upgrades the starting mage into a better mage and gives them access to tier 3 spells. You gain two spells that way. The rest you have to learn at libraries or from scrolls. Or if you can blow more resources on rituals of mastery rather than summons, you can gain more level 3 spells.

Then again, many of the more powerful rituals will summon level 3 casters for you, gaining you more mages/SCs that you can use simultaneously for the same price as gaining one more spell for a mage who can only use one at a time.

As far as rituals are concerned, they are hardwired into the commanders. If you have a certain commander, say Necromancer, that commander can cast all of the rituals available to him given the resources. And if a commander can cast a ritual that requires some specific resource, he can also gather it. So if you charmed a necromancer, you could gather Hands of Glory after that, even if you couldn't normally.

[Gandalf Parker]

I tend to play on REALLY big maps (larger than the game offers on the menu). And even though the ceiling cap on CoE3 seems low compared to Dom3 I never feel it to be too restrictive. If I try real hard I might get one unit to the maximum ability it can achieve. But when I do its only for beta testing purposes because the unit is basically out of the game for too long for that to be worthwhile. By the time its maxed out, its so far behind my front lines that its hardly worth leaving home.