Crossbows vs. Longbows

[Sombre]

Actually giving maces dmg 7 and AP might work to an extent. They'd be like the melee versons of crossbows - less good vs light prot guys, better against high prot guys. The fact they have worse att and def makes sense, since they are deployed against high prot encumbered guys, or heavy cav (who have good def but who shouldn't be taken out by mace armed foot troops anyway, really).

[Endoperez]

Originally Posted by Sombre

Actually giving maces dmg 7 and AP might work to an extent. They'd be like the melee versons of crossbows - less good vs light prot guys, better against high prot guys. The fact they have worse att and def makes sense, since they are deployed against high prot encumbered guys, or heavy cav (who have good def but who shouldn't be taken out by mace armed foot troops anyway, really).

What do you mean by "dmg 7"? Damage 7, no-str or the sum of strength and weapon damage being 7? I've changed hammers, but not maces/clubs, to be dmg -4 and armor-piercing. Details below.

Maces are mostly used by the monkeys of all castes: Atavi, Vanara, Bandar, Kala-Mukha and leaders. Villains and Burgmeister Guards also use maces. They are pretty rare, but armor-piercing doesn't work with these units. Increased damage would be all right, I think.


Since the discussion changed into weapon balance, would you guys be interested in testing out this little mod I've been making? See attachment.

It started out as giving all magical spears #lance bonus, but I've been slowly adding into it and now it changes most mundane weapons. Most of it doesn't really make a difference, but Hammers (but not maces or clubs) are armor-piercing. They are used by VERY few units, which include few nationals (MA Ulm), Claymen and... Siege Golems! Haven't changed the golems yet, don't know if I should...

Other notable changes: +1 att to most spears, mauls, glaives, mauls and such have higher damage, many weapons cost less resources, axes got more precise.

[Sombre]

Originally Posted by Endoperez

What do you mean by "dmg 7"? Damage 7, no-str or the sum of strength and weapon damage being 7? I've changed hammers, but not maces/clubs, to be dmg -4 and armor-piercing. Details below.

Yes, sorry, I meant around 3-4 damage or so, as a weapon stat. I was mixed up with strength being 10 and 7 being less or something.

I don't see why hammers with AP make more sense than maces? Why doesn't ap on a mace make sense on a markata or hoburg?

[Endoperez]

Originally Posted by Sombre

Yes, sorry, I meant around 3-4 damage or so, as a weapon stat. I was mixed up with strength being 10 and 7 being less or something.

I don't see why hammers with AP make more sense than maces? Why doesn't ap on a mace make sense on a markata or hoburg?

I can't imagine Markata (they don't use maces), Hoburgs or the monkeys in general as something that thugs and heavily-armored, mounted knights should be especially afraid of. On the other hand, low-strength Hoburgs couldn't hit through armor even if their weapons were armor-piercing.

Finally, I don't want to make Lanka's Kala-mukha have armor-piercing weapons.

Thanks for asking about the hammers, since after you asked I read more about them and found out armor-piercing doesn't fit them at all.
I thought the spike at the other end of a war hammer was like a pick-axe, meant to push through the armor, but according to Wikipedia it was for hooking the opponent's leg, neck, weapon or such. It also didn't penetrate armor as such, but "transmitted an impact through even the thickest helmet". I've seen videos of a longer "poll-axe" being used in such a manner, and it looks great. Unfortunately you can't model tripping in Dominions.